Survivor S41

Kasey

Fan of many, uber of none
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Who wants to bet that Heather gets taken to the final 2/3 as the goat? I can't think of any other reason why she would make it that far.

(Obviously posted this before reading Shan's "goat" interpretation of Heather)
 

smurfy

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A different episode.
Yes -with Shan gone - got to hear full sentences from others.
This group of 4 does not know about how BB played out this summer when this was taped. So I hope that made them happy to see what they envisioned came to fruition elsewhere. (note to non BB watchers - 6 POC made it to the final 6 (actual; 7 POC made it to the 7 - but the 7th was not part of the six)- and came together like this 4 did - but they started earlier (day 2??) and they had a very elaborate plan - each of the had an outsider as an ally, as they were not physically separate like on Survivor.
Yea - Xander lives. I like him, he is young, but is much smarter than I thought at first.
When Xander and Erika were chatting about Ricard or Liana - I was wondering why not mention that if they vote out Ricard - it will be 3-3, but vote our Liana and it will be 4-2 (possibly).
I am rooting for Xander, but Ricard has grown on me.
And like what others have said - I really like Danny - more as the person, as he has not made me root for him in the game.
And yes DeShawn is all over the place, and he seems like a nice guy.

I believe Survivor and BB share some casting activities. I remember reading how one person applied to one but got on the other show. Both casts this year have been more diverse and in general both shows had good casts with lots of players that were knowledgeable of the game, came to play and some were very good.
 

Spikefan

At the Hubbell Salon
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2,440
I actually like everyone that is left (and the jury). That is a first as there are usually people I am actively rooting against. I will be happy with the winner, although Heather would be my last pick (not worried as it is unlikely anyone will vote for her if she is F2).
 

genevieve

drinky typo pbp, closet hugger (she/her)
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They've been doing these individual spotlights on players, including family and childhood photos, the whole season. I think every episode has had one. Erika's, for instance, was when she was on exile island.

Danny has always come across as a very decent man with a lot of integrity (think back to the reported but not shown TC outburst about the 'turn back time' twist) - which can be incompatible with success in the game of Survivor. There have been times that I thought he was getting a little checked out of the game, or at least being somewhat passive, possibly because he didn't care for how shifty and shady one needs to be.

Glad that Lianna corrected Jeff's assertion that opting out of that challenge was about feeling secure in the game - that was about who thought they were most likely to be out of the challenge first AND not knowing what they'd need to do at TC. I knew Heather would opt out, not surprised she was the only one. It did surprise me that DeShawn was out so quickly. Erika must have praised ceiling cat on that one.

I really, really like DeShawn. He also seems like a good guy, and he's willing to be sneaky, but also can get ahead of himself. But then also is willing to listen and adjust. And admit his mistakes. If somehow Danny and DeShawn make it to F2 it would be epic.

I'm sad to see Lianna go, but I also really didn't want Ricard to go. UGH, as I feared from like the 2nd episode, Heather is getting dragged along to the end. I mean, who wouldn't want to sit next to her when facing the jury? But also - why give her the 2nd (or 3rd) place prize $$ for being useless AND BORING in the game? Even her answer to Jeff's softball question about what DeShawn, Lianna and Danny had brought up at TC was cringe.

Do we know if it's a F2 or F3 this time? Knowing this season, they'll probably introduce something to give a jury member an opportunity to get back in the game in the middle of the FTC :rolleyes:

Tiffany looked like she was trying so hard not to roll her eyes during most of TC.

ETA: Shan's Ponderosa video - the jury sea shanty!!!! :rofl:
 
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tony

But it just doesn't fcuking glide
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This group must really think Xander is not going to win anything because ONCE AGAIN he was not on the radar at all and I'm pretty sure the rules are still that he can use the idol up to final 5 tribal. You can basically write his name down as one of the final 3 IMO. It's hilarious how they just don't care about him being there. If anything, they should've put some heat on him to at least flush out the idol. A huge move would be him not winning immunity at final 5, the assumption that he's using the idol on himself which takes all of the spotlight off of him, and him carrying someone else into the final 4. But with DeShawn and Ricard still there, one of them is going to be the obvious target anyways IMO.

The thing I love most about this group is that they are all hardcore fans that first and foremost understand that not everyone is going to be perfect and honest in the game. DeShawn looked like he was having the time of his life and even Danny was enjoying the moment when they were both clearly the targets. I'm becoming more and more of a DeShawn fan and for a minute I thought maybe the theatrics with Erika were just for show, but then that risked someone else not knowing the plan and him getting voted out in the first round rather than a tie, so it can't be that. And the twist last week ended up being a one-time thing. Meh..

Along with Xander, I don't see a way that Heather becomes a threat along the way to final 3 when Ricard and DeShawn are still there, so I'd say she's probably sitting there at the end, too.

Overall, there's no denying Ricard played the best game IMO, but he's probably going to need to win both remaining immunities (or win the fire challenge) to be there at the end. Tony did it last season and others have completely ran their seasons, so maybe it really has been the Ricard show all year.

If the final 3 ends up Xander, Heather, and Erika, I really don't know what they would do.
 
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Jenny

From the Bloc
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21,550
Agree Ricard has this if he makes it to the end, and they all seem to think so too. Might turn out to be the mistake of the game voting out Liana instead of him.

Also amazed that they didn't at least try to get Xander to play his idol, including Ricard. As you said, assuming he can use it at F5, then he's guaranteed F4, and Ricard has to win immunity or he's toast. Or does he think that they will vote out Deshawn over him? Is Ricard so secure with Xander/Erika/Heather than he thinks they won't turn on him and he can sail right into F3? Or does he think that he can win everything (which is a distinct possibility lol)?

And why didn't Deshawn and Danny do a hail mary and vote for Xander in the first round? According to Wiki, they voted for each other! Xander clearly thought he wasn't in danger so it would have been a 3-way tie and another (if rather slim) chance to save themselves.

Liking the idea that the last 5 have to go to a new beach where they have no shelter and no stash of fire supplies or anything else they had stockpiled. Xander's comment in the preview matched what he said in his pre-game video, that he has no problem living without comforts, including food, he's ready for this. However, I think Ricard and Deshawn can handle it, this close to the end. Erika seems a bit physically weaker, not sure.

The only thing I'm not loving about this season is that Heather's still there.
 

smurfy

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right now Xander is my choice to win, followed by Ricard then Erika.
They all have played an interesting game, but Xander, whom I was not thrilled with in the beginning has won me over and seems like a nice guy.
Also - anyone but Heather. the conversations this past week about Erika and Heather playing the same game - what are they not showing us. If for some reason Heather deserves to win - the editing was very bad this season.
 

smurfy

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And the commerical about the longest Pit Stop - Amazing Race is back in a month! Yippee!!
It will be interesting to see where they went.
 

genevieve

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And why didn't Deshawn and Danny do a hail mary and vote for Xander in the first round? According to Wiki, they voted for each other! Xander clearly thought he wasn't in danger so it would have been a 3-way tie and another (if rather slim) chance to save themselves.
I could not believe that Danny and DeShawn didn't vote together - although the 3 who could still vote would have just voted for Danny anyway. I think D & D just wanted whoever was left to have a chance to work with someone from the others.

Heather.....:wall: She's got a better shot at making it to the F3 than Xander at this point. I can see that ending up being a FTC where no one even asks her anything (what season was it where that happened?).

I was sad to see Danny go, I like him a lot...and it was the wrong move. Danny is incredibly likeable, and he did win one IC, but as I said last week, he's been a little detached from the game and I don't think with against this crowd that would be enough to win.

Agreed that Ricard has to win immunity until the end to get to FTC. He has played the best game overall and deserves to win, but no one is going to want to let him have the chance. It will be a bigger crime if he doesn't make it than Rob Cesternino missing out in the Amazon - although here there are some other worthy choices.

DeShawn - I actually think he's got a shot at this. He's really scattered in his playing style but no one can say he isn't playing hard, or that he is afraid to make big moves. He's likeable, and while the vulnerability he displayed last week was certainly genuine, I think it also helped his game. If he's in the F3, he's got Danny's vote for sure, maybe Lianna's, and I'd say Shan's unless Ricard is there.

Xander has also played a very good game, he strategy is interesting because he has taken pains to hide his physical threat self for most of the game, while also coming through as best as possible for whatever team he's been on for challenges. I confess that I will be disappointed if a season this diverse ends up going to another young white guy (like S39), but also, he's played a great game.

Ericka - I feel like there must be a whole bunch of footage of Ericka that we just haven't seen, because people have been saying she's sneaky and needs to go since almost day 1, and other than the whole Turn Back Time twist (which honestly, there was no other choice but the one she made), we haven't seen her really do that much. I kind of what her to make it to FTC just to hear her talk about her game. If she talks about playing the same game as Heather, though, forget it! Oh, for whoever said upthread that she might have a hard time starting over on the new island - she did pretty well on her exile island adventure so I think she'll be ok.

No one seems mad enough any anyone else left in the game to even throw Heather a pity vote. They have to make it a F3 because there would be zero suspense if she was only up against one other person. :lol:
 

Jenny

From the Bloc
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21,550
Also - anyone but Heather. the conversations this past week about Erika and Heather playing the same game - what are they not showing us. If for some reason Heather deserves to win - the editing was very bad this season.
I was :confused: when Erika said that too. Heather has actually been playing? Because accordingly to Shan, the only thing Heather was doing was working with Erika (they have voted the same every time for example).
Ericka - I feel like there must be a whole bunch of footage of Ericka that we just haven't seen, because people have been saying she's sneaky and needs to go since almost day 1, and other than the whole Turn Back Time twist (which honestly, there was no other choice but the one she made), we haven't seen her really do that much. I kind of what her to make it to FTC just to hear her talk about her game. If she talks about playing the same game as Heather, though, forget it! Oh, for whoever said upthread that she might have a hard time starting over on the new island - she did pretty well on her exile island adventure so I think she'll be ok.
Agree that if Erika tries to make that her Big Move, well it was handed to her and there wasn't much strategy either way.

It was me who wondered upthread how she'll do on a new beach; I did forget she was on her own on Exile, but that was also 10-12 days ago in their time, and it's going to be a lot more intense that just being on your own if the preview is anything to go by!
 

sk8pics

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I agree with what everyone else has said about Heather; I don’t like her at all and don’t see where she has contributed much of anything to anything.

Ricard has played well, but he rubbed me the wrong way in some of his dealings with Shan.

And I agree it’s crazy that Xander’s name has not come up at all. Have they all forgotten he had an idol?

And with the new beach, I guess if someone had found an idol and hidden it, not brought it to tribal with them, they lose the idol if they’re not going back to the same camp.
 

genevieve

drinky typo pbp, closet hugger (she/her)
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very interesting insights from Danny post-boot. Of note: no one in the game thinks Xander can win and actually want to take him to the end :eek:


He really does seem like a very nice and well-adjusted guy.
 

Jenny

From the Bloc
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21,550
Indeed an interesting interview! Not sure I followed all of it, but it does seem that he was playing more than we saw, but it didn't work for the storyline because he didn't make it to the end, so they went with the father story, and his relationship with Deshawn, which may still matter in the end. A very respectful edit - one gets the feeling that the producers etc loved him despite his open criticism of the hourglass twist.

Quoting myself here in response to Danny saying that no one thinks Xander is a threat at the end because he hasn't really been playing:

I think Xander has been strategic, but might have trouble stating his case to the jury because he sounds a bit too laid back most of the time.

If Xander is able to shed his surfer dude presentation and explain himself, he has a shot. If Ricard is not there.

Although, since all the bootees and even those still in the game are pretty much in agreement that Ricard has played the best game, we're either sliding into a satisfying ending, or Something's Gonna Happen.
 

smurfy

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genevieve - thanks for link yes Danny seems like such a nice guy and has good perspective on his time on Survivor.
Very interesting about Xander. Xander has been decent in his confessionals and hopefully he can do that in the FTC if he makes it.
Ricard would be a worthly winner, but the rest might seem boring - hope tomorrow night is good.
Overall I think they did a great job casting this season.
 

Spikefan

At the Hubbell Salon
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2,440
That final challenge favored height, which sucks for the two women. Probably no way for it to not favor someone, just hate when it is gendered.
 

tony

But it just doesn't fcuking glide
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This group must really think Xander is not going to win anything because ONCE AGAIN he was not on the radar at all and I'm pretty sure the rules are still that he can use the idol up to final 5 tribal. You can basically write his name down as one of the final 3 IMO. It's hilarious how they just don't care about him being there. If anything, they should've put some heat on him to at least flush out the idol. A huge move would be him not winning immunity at final 5, the assumption that he's using the idol on himself which takes all of the spotlight off of him, and him carrying someone else into the final 4. But with DeShawn and Ricard still there, one of them is going to be the obvious target anyways IMO.
Well, that almost happened, although he would've been really foolish to keep Ricard.

I found myself really rooting for Heather in the final fire and getting to the 3-- what a challenge. I think she had a strong chance of winning the game had she told the near-drowning story as a finalist, especially since the jury (well, Shan and Liana) seem to be over Xander. I get Xander wanting to verbalize his thought process because he doesn't have much of a resume otherwise (I mean seriously, what was he going to say? 'I had an idol for 20 days and no one cared!'), but I don't know that speaking so matter-of-fact was great. It could also be a fake-out where 5 or 6 jury members vote for Xander anyways. ETA- but since they showed the jury reacting oddly to his statements, I think it was to show the discord between his views and how the jury actually thinks for when he does not end up winning.

But really, between the three, I have no idea how the voting will go. DeShawn has escaped two huge moments in the game (maybe even three thanks to Erika and Heather) and I think he might be able to verbalize his gameplay the best in the final questioning, but we will see.

I've said it in a few different season finales, but I think the fire challenge needs to go even if it is an equalizer. It gives whoever wins it a last checkmark on their own resume, and I was honestly surprised that Xander didn't take the route of giving up immunity to win it.
 
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tony

But it just doesn't fcuking glide
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Even though we got small glimpses of Erika's scheming, I don't think the editing really did a good job of showing her path to the final being as commanding as the 7-1 vote suggests, especially with DeShawn there. And even during the final questions and comments, almost none of the stuff was directed to her which makes me think they already had her as the winner before all of that. Danny giving her the props that he did, I knew it was over.

And yeah, the editing to show the annoyance with Xander was to explain the zero votes. They really, really did not think he was a threat and all of his funny moments had to be for the cameras.

Does anyone think Heather could've had a fighting chance against her if she made it? Erika gave her a lot of credit for a pairing that was taking charge of the game, matched with her potential mentioning of the near-drowning.
 

Prancer

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Even though we got small glimpses of Erika's scheming, I don't think the editing really did a good job of showing her path to the final being as commanding as the 7-1 vote suggests
I read an article a couple of weeks ago that predicated Erica's win based entirely on her confessional about it being time for a woman to win and she wanted the woman to be her. And I thought, but we haven't seen any reason for her to win.

Survivor really doesn't know what to do with women. Or rather, Survivor is too in love with the men on the show to even see the women most of the time.
 

PeterG

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I read an article a couple of weeks ago that predicated Erica's win based entirely on her confessional about it being time for a woman to win and she wanted the woman to be her. And I thought, but we haven't seen any reason for her to win.

1. Her original tribe targeted her as a threat for being too "crafty" (something DeShawn and Ricard were thought of, but instead of being labelled "crafty" they were heralded as "threats")
2. Erika outlasted that whole team who targeted her when perhaps if they had made use of her intelligence ("craftiness"), they would have fared better
3. She continued to involve herself in gameplay, even when she was spurned by pretty much everyone. She didn't give up, outwitting and outlasting everybody.
4. When the cultural alliance (along with Ricard) had a guaranteed final five sitting on their silver platter, Danny and DeShawn threw that away in a suicidal bit of game play. Erika outlasted their dim-wittedness and kept her head to the grown in spite of them continuing to underestimate her and isolate her
5. She mentioned in tonight's episode the two challenges she had won
6. Erika stood up against her team after exile and flipped the game instead of blindly hoping people would be nice to her (finally)
7. She must have created some kind of bond with Xander to get him to save her instead of taking the goat (Heather) to the final three
8. Erika survived being targeted by uber-player Shan in episode nine after Shan targeted her for eviction
9. Also in episode nine, Erika won immunity
10. Erika survived tribal council in episode ten after being targeted by Shan and Liana
11. She mentioned in tonight's episode getting the final dominant voting block together to control the game
12. Erika won in spite of the disrespect shown to her by her competitors, the editors of Survivor and people such as those who post in this thread and can't even be bothered to spell her name correctly. ;) :p
 
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Susan1

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Funny, I barely pay attention to this show, just something to watch. But I was all tensed up during the fire challenge. I didn't even care who won.
 

Jenny

From the Bloc
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That final challenge favored height, which sucks for the two women. Probably no way for it to not favor someone, just hate when it is gendered.
You mean the balancing challenge to build FINAL3 in blocks? I disagree if so. At most (maybe every?) challenge when the players arrive they are lined up by height. The challenges are built to equalize things like reach. If anything, a shorter person had an advantage on that challenge due to a lower centre of gravity.

Anyway, I'm happy that the winner is from my town :cheer2:but not happy that I didn't see more of her gameplay. They put a lot of emphasis on the individual journeys this season - I know they always do, but it seemed that this time they were trying to make it more important somehow, going back to JD, that even though he didn't even make the jury "what a great story." IMO the biggest insight we had into Erika's actual gameplay was Shan thinking she was a threat.

And if she won with 4 votes, sure, but a landslide? Like the entire jury was on board with her win, even though some of the early boots barely played with her? Was she that good at getting her game across at TCs? Because I didn't see it. Even that last immunity win - she was the last to figure out the word puzzle, pretty much found the advantage by accident (and really, that was a "dancing tree"?), and then what was called a little advantage was in fact a very big one. We've said here before that her "big move" was pretty much a 50-50, that anyone in her position was likely to do it, IMO it wasn't a huge strategic move at all.

Not saying she doesn't deserve it, she clearly did if 7 people (and probably Danny too, but he had to throw his buddy a vote I think) thought so, just that I don't think we saw enough of it.

Quite a surprise that they declared the winner on the spot and yes Jeff the raw emotions were interesting, but now I'd like to know what the jury thinks having seen both the edit and all the confessionals.
 

genevieve

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Does anyone think Heather could've had a fighting chance against her if she made it? Erika gave her a lot of credit for a pairing that was taking charge of the game, matched with her potential mentioning of the near-drowning.
No. The only way Heather would have won is if it was a F2 with an incredibly bitter jury towards the other finalist (think Russell Hantz's first season).
IMO the biggest insight we had into Erika's actual gameplay was Shan thinking she was a threat.
It wasn't just Shan - seemed like most of Luvu (her original tribe) wanted her out because of her strategy/'craftiness' that we weren't shown.

I am disappointed that Ricard did not get to the F3, although his extended eulogy before the vote at F5, and especially him going on and on about how great he is at the game, helped. I mean, he's not wrong, but damn. :p I also think it was a mistake for him to have revealed the impeding birth of his son at that TC - what felt like a real, vulnerable moment when he was with Xander felt more like a plea in TC.

Xander, Xander, Xander..... so many mistakes this episode. I mean, he didn't make the biggest mistake, which would have been to use the idol to save Ricard, but.... why did he tell Ricard (unprompted!) that he'd use the idol to save him? And then to get up in TC and play the idol for himself, knowing no one had voted for him? Silly showboating that got Ricard's hopes up at the final moment and ended up being a completely unnecessary broken promise. And following that up with taking Erika to the F3... made me think of Jerri's vote for Tina in S2 - that getting Colby to take her over Keith meant that Tina was truly the master of the game. I did love how freaked out he was seeing Erika's sad attempts to build fire - and yet he still took her!

Going into the fire challenge, I thought, oh, in some ways that would be too perfect for Heather to finally have one moment in the season where she is remotely competitive. But it was so much more satisfying having a F3 of players with very different games who all had the potential to win.

I love FTC, even though in recent seasons the format has gotten a little lame. Walking in, I thought DeShawn was going to win based on his game (what we were shown), but his FTC was almost as bad as Amanda Kimmel's. Hanging his game on relationships was the worst! angle! I can see that perhaps the jury was already decided before FTC, but if DeShawn had owned his chaotic/erratic/highly reactive strategy as him taking big risks and not being afraid to switch gears to further his game, knowing that it meant that he had to eliminate allies, the jury would have respected it more. Unpredictability can be a (risky) strategy. Instead, he walked right into Ricard's reframe that he got to know people just well enough to betray them.

OTOH, Erika was masterful in her answers at FTC. Felt to me like she told us all the things we didn't get to see about her game. She was calm, owned the parts that could be perceived as weaknesses and turned them around to be positives. I'm still annoyed that we didn't get to see more of her game, but this was a satisfying end to a season with a very likeable cast.

(ps final immunity - while watching I did wonder if/how they adjusted the apparatus for things like arm length because it absolutely looked like Xander had an advantage in his ability to reach back for blocks with his long arms)

I liked the winner getting announced at the FTC, although I think it was more to do with not feeling confident in May 2021 about the ability to hold a big public live event in December 2021 than wanting to return to their roots.

Anyone else notice that Shan barely spoke in the afterparty?
 

smurfy

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6,013
Finally have time to read your posts and make my own post.
Overall I am very happy with the ending. Just surprised - and I think that is due to the editing. They left a lot out for Ericka. Maybe they thought it would be a foregone conclusion is they showed more of her actions?
But I am not annoyed. I felt Xander had blown it when he explained some things to the jury - before fire challenge. Their looks told so much.
I really loved the jury questioning - it was a fluid conversation and not just q & a - there was followup and it summed things up.
To me the jury really had strong feelings for Ericka and was trying to help. Also they were trying to help Xander and he just couldn't answer the question about reading the room. Also Ericka's professional background really helped her with the jury.
As much as I like Xander, it is great that a non white won and a female!
 

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