Lawsuits against USA Gymnastics, Larry Nassar, etc. - news & updates

[joubertelegant]

I hope there is no chance the Karolyis were part of condoning the sexual abuse from Nassar. That is my biggest fear of all.

 

[joubertelegant]

NPR just reported the entire USAG BoD is going to resign.

Does that mean people like Penney and Steve Rybacki are out too?

 

[Frau Muller]

There used to be a fairly well known figure skating club in Lansing/MSU. I hope that Nassar wasn’t affiliated with them too but if he was the most renowned sports-med doc in town, one has to think. Shudders.

 

[Aceon6]

Does that mean people like Penney and Steve Rybacki are out too?

Penney left nearly a year ago.

 

[ToFarAwayTimes]

I wasn't aware the same problem happened with USA Swimming back in 2010. I wonder how many other national programs have covered up for these kinds of abuses? I think this goes beyond gymnastics and the entire board of the USOC should be forced to resign. Possibly investigate them for criminal or civil liability even, starting with CEO Scott Blackmun.

And I know this is the "other sports" section, but I really suspect this is a major problem in figure skating as well. Not any team in particular, there are no accusations that I'm aware of, but the likelihood is that somewhere in some skating program(s) around the world -- this kind of sexual abuse of minors is happening and powerful people are covering up for it. Like gymnastics, figure skating has kind of a weird fixation on underage athletes, certainly on the ladies side that I mostly follow. I have occasionally been left feeling uncomfortable by posting behavior from some users on figure skating forums over the years. And I am deeply uncomfortable with the way the sanctioning body tailors scoring and competition towards the benefit of younger, often physically and emotionally underdeveloped skaters.

These are skaters who, if the sport emphasized rules and scoring in a different way, would have time to mature and be somewhat sheltered from the crooked and often deviant personalities that infest the top levels of amateur athletics, until they are old enough to deal with it.

Let's look at two examples from different sports: gymnastics and figure skating.

Example 1: John Geddert, USA Gymnastics coach
Geddert was, obviously, a very successful coach at the youth and national team levels. But I'm always reminded of the saying: "the higher up you go, the crookeder it gets". This was a man who allegedly physically assaulted young girls over and over again, and emotionally broke them down in order to achieve his (and very rarely) their success. But at what cost? In addition to the famous gymnasts who won gold medals, there are thousands of girls, names we will never know, who endured that kind of abuse and pain in their formative years. Imagine a sport where the top competitors are grown women, who as adults are more adequately adjusted to handle the crucible of competitions at the highest level of their sport--and then imagine gymnastics, where the most ruthless and cutthroat coaches and officials are directly overseeing and expecting immediate results from young, easily manipulated and controlled children. Nobody has a problem with that?

Example 2: Yulia Lipnitskaya, Russian national team skater
Yulia's case is just an example, but a recent and prominent one. Here was a charming and talented young skater who should have been coached and trained in a protective environment, one where she was allowed to physically and emotionally develop until she was ready to assume the burden and responsibility that was expected of her. Maybe, just maybe she would have had a long and successful career, instead of one that was over in a flash amid forced anorexia and the demand to produce immediate, even unnatural results.

As an athletic and artistic endeavor, I believe the people best suited for competing at the highest levels of the sport are in their late teens and twenties. Their bodies and minds are more physically developed. They are able to do the jumps and spins, train hard and polish their skating skills, and command an audience with a truly beautiful performance. Moreover, they are emotionally prepared and have the experience to handle the difficult personalities and competitive environments that they will encounter at the top of the sport.

Instead, figure skating, like gymnastics, has this bizarre and creepy culture of promoting younger and younger stars. The scoring system now trivializes artistry and skating skills which take years to develop, and reduces entire competitions down to which 15 year old starved-to-anorexia-by-her-coaches-and-trainers girl can jump back and forth across the ice the most, the result only possible in some cases because she is further taking hormones or diet supplements to unnaturally delay puberty, causing her health complications later in life.

I mean ask yourself, what the **** is going on? Why does this happen? It's sick, sick, sick.

Then you put these girls in a position where they are vulnerable to be preyed upon sexually by monsters like Nassar and undoubtedly similar people lurking around rinks today. Imagine if those little girls were not around powerful people like Nassar to begin with. Imagine if they were training like the children they are, being nurtured and allowed to develop, by coaches and people of lesser power--ones who when accused, have limited resources to withstand substantiated accusations and are swiftly removed from free society. Imagine that the competitive amateur sports environment were one in which the highest levels, populated by the officials with the most entrenched interests and power, who are difficult to accuse and remove if guilty of wrongdoing, were dealing with adults, young women who are not little girls anymore, but who are capable of speaking up, being heard, and listened to.

Scrutiny should not fall on just USAG or Michigan State University.

It should extend to all amateur athletics including the USOC and NCAA.

 

[Willin]

@Frau Muller I'm sure there were some skaters affected, as MSU Sports Medicine (the place Nassar officially worked for) was the gold standard of sports medicine in the Lansing area. It should be noted that MSU Sports Medicine has a lot more than just Nassar on staff, and that there are other sports medicine clinics in Lansing, so I don't know how many of the skaters that went there saw Nassar as opposed to other doctors. All of Michigan State University's skaters tend to go to their home doctors when injured, and as skating is not a varsity sport at MSU they wouldn't have been required to see Nassar or any other MSU doctor.

@ToFarAwayTimes I'm thoroughly convinced this isn't just a USAG or MSU problem. I know places cover stuff up all the time and that accusations of sexual misconduct are not reported up the chain all the time and in many contexts - from high school sports to the most famous of pro athletes (Kobe and Peyton Manning).

I'm sure there are creeps in figure skating, but I'm not sure it rises to a USAG level. I haven't heard of USFSA not punishing a pedophile they knew about or enabling that same pedophile by allowing him to be alone with athletes. I'm sure this happens in other countries like Russia and China where athletes live away from home to train from a young age.

It is a wider discussion we must have. These pedophiles and abusers find their way into sports because it's ripe for abuse. I'm sure for every one like Nassar that is in a high place, there's 100 more preying on kids at smaller facilities. We should find ways to identify them and hold them accountable at all levels of sport, along with encouraging reporting of any suspected abuse.

 

[ToFarAwayTimes]

@Willin
I think it starts from the top down. If you want to identify and remove those 100 more preying on kids at smaller facilities, the leadership has to develop and administer systems for doing just that -- and follow them -- holding everyone accountable from the highest levels down to the lowest. Exceptions undermine everything.

Further, we must realize that the higher up you go in a sport, the more credibility and power people have. It is difficult to accuse and remove these people when they do something wrong. They have resources, and they use them. I think the solution is to remove these people from being involved in the lives of children who themselves have no credibility, voice, or power. Put John Geddert, Larry Nassar, Mark Hollis, and Kathie Klages together with young women who are mature enough to deal with them and call out abuse and be heard when it occurs. Don't put them with little girls.

There is no place in our society for sports environments where the top 'athletes' are children. None whatsoever.

And I don't think the discussion in figure skating should be limited to potential sexual abuse. There are many kinds of abuse. Starving a girl to death, forcing her to do things to her body to unnaturally delay puberty, those are abuse to. There may even be young adults who have been sexually harassed by coaches or team officials, who knows what kinds of abuses are out there but none of them should be tolerated.

 

[ToFarAwayTimes]

USA Swimming still not accountable for years of sex abuse cases:
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/m...ss-scott-blackmun-article-1.3782785?cid=bitly

"Those who helped create the culture at USA Swimming continue to be rewarded with promotions and accolades," Allard says. "Much like USA Gymnastics is cleaning house, so too must USA Swimming. And if it refuses, Mr. Blackmun should for once take definitive action to effect that change even if it results in damage to his longstanding personal and professional relationships.”

"Scott Blackmun has rarely exercised the authority to administer punishment, and particularly not when it comes to protecting athletes. The USOC has known about the problems of sexual abuse in sports," says Hogshead-Makar.

This is not a USAG problem. This is USOC problem. Everyone at USOC needs to go.

Now.

 

[VGThuy]

The fact that the fans of figure skating still call the natural maturation of the body the “puberty monster” and does promote immature bodies with its scoring system and what it values in one particular gendered discipline I think should raise some alarm. I was hoping with some role models like Carolina Kostner and a bunch of other successful women who have gone on to win medals and titles after a certain age, things could change and maybe coaching techniques would adapt to teach skaters skills that would benefit from having a more mature body but I don’t think our scoring system always does that.

 

[Aceon6]

@VIETgrlTerifa I think that anything that has the potential to impact normal development needs to be watched. Although there might be an occasional outlier due to hormonal or other medical issues, most young women competing elite/senior should be capable of having a menstrual cycle. Watching for and stopping young women from developing amenorrhea due to over training or poor diet needs to be part of the oversight process. Maybe it’s time to set a BMI floor for eligibility. They could look at healthy pairs women like Ksenia and Vanessa and set it there.

 

[Karina1974]

Does that mean people like Penney and Steve Rybacki are out too?

Here's the link to the story I heard on the radio Friday night:

https://www.npr.org/2018/01/26/5811...ymnastics-and-u-s-olympic-committee-continues

 

[Willin]

@Aceon6 The problem with establishing a BMI floor is that you never know if it's due to genetics, dietary planning, or lack of food intake.
I'm sure there are many cases of anorexia in skating, but other athletes (Megan Duhamel, Ashley) simply eat incredibly healthy. There are others that are just naturally skinny. A study done on gymnasts found that those gymnasts who are most successful do not have their height/puberty stunted by the intense training, but rather they naturally have a body type conducive to good performance in gymnastics: short and muscular. So I'm sure there's some of that involved as well.
But I agree that training practices and dietary standards should be reviewed and that anorexia should be taken much more seriously.

 

[Aceon6]

@Willin I wasn't thinking that much about anorexia as I was about insufficient calories/overtraining in general. Even without a BMI floor, I'd like to see the higher level athletes under the age of 18 (the ones most vulnerable to coach's bullying) checked periodically. A simple urine test can do both. Perhaps they could bundle it with the out of competition doping tests. If the stories about the ranch are true, those samples would have been off the charts with bad proteins.

 

[ilovepaydays]

I thought WADA/USADA kept biological passports of all tested athletes which includes tracking things like hormones levels. Isn’t that how many track & field athletes are getting caught doping - not necessarily finding a substance itself?

 

[Aceon6]

I thought WADA/USADA kept biological passports of all tested athletes which includes tracking things like hormones levels. Isn’t that how many track & field athletes are getting caught doping - not necessarily finding a substance itself?

Hormones tell part of the story. The proteins in urine tell more, especially if you're looking for food deprivation or insufficient liquid intake.

 

[ToFarAwayTimes]

What was the anecdote in some book about skaters only being allowed to eat carrot sticks and mustard by their coaches?

 

[judiz]

Were criminal charges ever bought against Don Peters and other coaches accused of molesting their gymnasts? I know Peters was banned by USGA.

 

[Aceon6]

Were criminal charges ever bought against Don Peters and other coaches accused of molesting their gymnasts? I know Peters was banned by USGA.

I can’t find anything about criminal proceedings involving Peters. Since the girls were older than 15 and never claimed that they were raped, there might not have been anything to charge him with. Unfortunately, using power and position to get what you want is still legal in most states.

 

[Choupette]

Regarding Peters:

Gymnasts accuse renowned coach of sex abuse (from January 2015)

Under California law, sexual contact with a person under the age of 18 is illegal, even if the minor consents. But the statute of limitations for prosecuting statutory rape cases in California is three years if the perpetrator is 21 or older or more than three years older than the victim. Experts say it is now impossible to prosecute Peters under that law, even if the women’s allegations could be proven.

So glad there is no such thing where I live for any kind of sexual aggression.

Edit: In her victim impact statement (you can read it in its entirety here, and it's long but I personally think it's a worthy read), Rachael Denhollander spoke of how bad she felt before and on her 25th birthday, because she thought from that day she couldn't press charges anymore:

We got married, and my 25th birthday came and went and I sat up for nights before, believing my ability to file a police report would end on that birthday. I didn't know the statute of limitations had been lifted.

Speaking of what all this cost her:

Choosing to live those moments over and over, daily, releasing every shred of privacy that I had, living with the reality that not only didn't I get to choose what you did, but now I didn't get to choose who knew about it.
Even my status as a sexual assault victim has impacted or did impact my ability to advocate for sexual assault victims because once it became known that I too had experienced sexual assault, people close to me used it as an excuse to brush off my concerns when I advocated for others who had been abused, saying I was just obsessed because of what I had gone through, that I was imposing my own experience upon other institutions who had massive failures and much worse.
My advocacy for sexual assault victims, something I cherished, cost me my church and our closest friends three weeks before I filed my police report. I was left alone and isolated. And far worse, it was impacted because when I came out, my sexual assault was wielded like a weapon against me.
Often by those who should have been the first to support and help, and I couldn't even do what I loved best, which was to reach out to others. I was subjected to lies and attacks on my character including very publicly by attorney Shannon Smith when I testified under oath.
I was being attacked for wanting fame and attention, for making up a story to try to get money. Your honor, since these attacks were made on my character very publicly on public record, I would like to take an opportunity briefly now to correct them. ... Out of the two women in question that day, Ms. Smith and I, who were attempting to communicate through either questions or answers, I would like to note that only one of us was taking pictures of the courtroom on her cell phone. Only one of us posed for the press and said, quote, I feel like I should say cheese. And out of the two of us, only one of us was making money off her court appearance that day. I don't feel the need to say anything else. I think I've communicated completely.
... The cost, emotional and physical, to see this through has been greater than many would ever know. And Larry, I don't need to tell you what the cost of your abuse has been to me because you got to read my journals, every word of them. Because those had to go into evidence to make this happen.
I want you to understand why I made this choice knowing full well what it was going to cost to get here and with very little hope of ever succeeding. I did it because it was right. No matter the cost, it was right. And the farthest I can run from what you have become is to daily choose what is right instead of what I want.

 

[SpeedySucks]

Were criminal charges ever bought against Don Peters and other coaches accused of molesting their gymnasts? I know Peters was banned by USGA.

By the time Peters’ crimes came to light, I believe all of them were outside of the statute of limitations (which was only 3 years in California in the 80s and 90s). There were people who knew about what he had done in the early-90s, including his gym manager at SCATS. Even though they learned about his crimes after the statute of limitations had passed, none of them bothered to report him to the USGF either. IMO, that group of people, who called themselves “the watchers,” were not much better than Peters himself.

 

[MacMadame]

I just got an email from my Senator, Dianne Feinstein, who is trying to get a law passed to protect athletes from these sorts of situations. They got the Amateur Athletic Organization Sex Abuse Bill passed in the Senate in Nov. but now it needs to brought up in the House. She's asking people to call their Rep in the House.

Here's the email for those who want to help or read more about it:

https://outreach.senate.gov/iqextranet/view_newsletter.aspx?id=10119346&c=SenFeinstein

 

[joubertelegant]

Here's the link to the story I heard on the radio Friday night:

https://www.npr.org/2018/01/26/5811...ymnastics-and-u-s-olympic-committee-continues

Thanks so much.

 

[Artistic Skaters]

Protection of assets becomes an important consideration for the Nassar supporters during the aftermath. Who's surprised?
*** John Geddert transfers Twistars management to wife :
https://www.lansingstatejournal.com/story/news/local/2018/01/29/john-geddert-twistars/1070396001/

John Geddert was listed as the sole president and resident agent of Twistars for 10 years before management was transferred to his wife last week, according to LARA filings.

The House voted on the bill to protect the athletes today.
*** U.S. House responds to sex abuse scandal :
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-house-responds-sex-abuse-scandal/1077247001/

The House voted 406-3 Monday to require amateur athletic governing bodies to promptly report incidents of abuse, a response to a sex abuse scandal in USA Gymnastics uncovered by IndyStar. Backers of the bill hope it will pass the Senate in time to be sent to President Trump for his signature before the Winter Olympics begin Feb. 9.

The bill would require adults who interact with amateur athletes to report suspected child abuse, including sexual abuse, within 24 hours to local law enforcement. It also would direct the U.S. Center for SafeSport to create policies that require U.S. Olympic Committee organizations to ensure adults who suspect child abuse report it to the safe sport center. The Center for SafeSport would be responsible for making sure abuse reports are investigated.

Slate has a recent interview with Joan Ryan.
*** Beyond Larry Nassar - The author of Little Girls in Pretty Boxes on gymnastics’ culture of abuse :
https://slate.com/news-and-politics...boxes-author-on-gymnastics-toxic-culture.html

I spoke recently by phone with Ryan, a longtime newspaper reporter and now a consultant for the San Francisco Giants. During the course of our conversation, which has been edited and condensed for clarity, we discussed the toxic culture in female gymnastics, what won’t change after the Nassar scandal, and America’s weird relationship to female athletes.

 

[ChiquitaBanana]

The House voted on the bill to protect the athletes today.
*** U.S. House responds to sex abuse scandal :
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-house-responds-sex-abuse-scandal/1077247001/

Who are the three morons not voting for??

 

[skatingguy]

Who are the three morons not voting for??

Thomas Massie, R Kentucky 4th
Mark Sanford, R South Carolina 1st
Justin Amash, R Michigan 3rd

 

[Aceon6]

Thomas Massie, R Kentucky 4th
Mark Sanford, R South Carolina 1st
Justin Amash, R Michigan 3rd

I just called them out on FB. Hope others will do the same. @purple skates is Amash your district?

 

[ChiquitaBanana]

Thomas Massie, R Kentucky 4th
Mark Sanford, R South Carolina 1st
Justin Amash, R Michigan 3rd

I just don't get why you wouldn't be voting for this law...

 

[Aceon6]

Deadspin's latest is a list of people who knew or should have known that Nassar was abusing athletes at MSU and the ranch. Some of it is duplicate info from the Indy Star, but the addition of "medical manipulation specialist" is a new term for me. https://deadspin.com/a-list-of-people-accused-of-enabling-larry-nassar-1822393026

 

[Skittl1321]

I just don't get why you wouldn't be voting for this law...

I won't defend them, but it often has to do with funding. Not worth passing a law you can't enforce.

 

[purple skates]

I just called them out on FB. Hope others will do the same. @purple skates is Amash your district?

No, he’s in west Michigan, I believe. I don’t know much about him except that I’ve heard that he’s a pretty strict constitutionalist. A no vote from him could stem from that, but I haven’t heard anything about it except for here.