From Russia With Love [#39]: Into Winter 2021

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I was checking the host country and Im a bit supersticious, but indeed the location venue does help with the winning aura

Here was Russian medal count last held in Sweden (Euros)

2015 European Figure Skating Championships - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

Russia does well in Sweden, UK, most in Europe , average Japan, China

Russia tends to not do well when held in North America and suprisingly Belarus (in other sports when held in Belarus they get even worst results like Wrestling etc)
 
Holy Headband said:
I meant that he seems very headstrong and invested in his own training methods and developmental trajectory compared to most other skaters his age, who are more likely to offer cookie-cutter non-answers and/or bland praise for their coaches in interviews. So I’m not too worried that outsiders who think they’re entitled to an opinion, like federation officials, celebrity coaches and commentators, etc., will bully him into making the wrong decision for his career (the way I am about Kostornaia, whose self-belief seems to have cratered this season, for example).
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I'm like oh Aliona what did you do?

Poor girl in her prime did not get to 2 world championships. Once because of Corona virus cancelled the world championships and one because she caught Corona virus after changing coaches.
 
Cherub721 said:
2009, Domnina/Shabalin.

And this is the first time Russia won 3 golds since 2005 in St Petersburg, great job to all the skaters :40beers:

If a man can qualify at Nebelhorn, they will have a full slate of 12 entries at the Olympics.
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What does nebelhorn have to do with any of it and how could they not have a man qualify for it?

I thought they secured 3 spots for the Russian men. I guess this is just the ISU in all their stupidity trying tbeir best to make figure skating niche sport.
 
Scott512 said:
What does nebelhorn have to do with any of it and how could they not have a man qualify for it?

I thought they secured 3 spots for the Russian men. I guess this is just the ISU in all their stupidity trying tbeir best to make figure skating niche sport.
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See this discussion - Russia has earned the opportunity to compete for one of the 7 men's spots to be awarded at Nebelhorn.
 
Scott512 said:
What does nebelhorn have to do with any of it and how could they not have a man qualify for it?

I thought they secured 3 spots for the Russian men. I guess this is just the ISU in all their stupidity trying tbeir best to make figure skating niche sport.
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In addition to what @Karen-W said, in brief, under the new rules you only get the 2/3 spots if you had 2/3 skaters qualify to the free. In pairs, ladies, and dance, that was no problem for Russia, but because they only had two guys there, it was impossible to qualify 3 outright. They have to send a third guy, other than Kolyada or Semenenko, to Nebelhorn to earn the spot. US has to do the same thing because Zhou didn't qualify to the LP.
 
Late to the party. Wondering about what Boikova & Kozlovskiy should do. I love Moskvina, who doesn't? But taking M&G on was surprising. It sent a message she was hedging her bets. I don't blame her, this may be her last shot. But it may backfire spectacularly. There is tension in the group. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it sabotages skaters development. Not sure it's working for B&K. They seem more "together" now, and less connected with Tamara. The relationship has definitely changed. We'll see how things develop. Personally, I am not a fan of the situation.
 
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They can leave if they're unhappy with the situation. It would be up to them to do it. Mishina/Galliamov aren't going anywhere, obviously. But if B/K leave, then they lose her coaching and guidance, which has clearly worked for them getting them to this point. And also, then M/G get all her attention in the Olympic season. Who do they go to that will be as good? Is the off season before the Olympics a good time to make a change? Unless it's someone in St. Petersburg, it means moving and disrupting their whole lives less than a year before Beijing. Even if they stay in the city, it would mean major training changes and lots to adjust to.

Seems like something that would just hurt them, from my point of view. But I'm not there in training every day, so they know better than me what they need.
 
Perky Shae Lynn said:
Late to the party. Wondering about what Boikova & Kozlovskiy should do. I love Moskvina, who doesn't? But taking M&G on was surprising. It sent a message she was hedging her bets. I don't blame her, this may be her last shot. But it may backfire spectacularly. There is tension in the group. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it sabotages skaters development. Not sure it's working for B&K. They seem more "together" now, and less connected with Tamara. The relationship has definitely changed. We'll see how things develop. Personally, I am not a fan of the situation.
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Let us see. Tamara has coached two high level pairs more than once.

M&D and B&P
K&D and B&S.

From what I read, both pairs were not on the ice at the same time. May be the situation is different now? We don't know it.

Whatever the case, Tamara managed the situation well. As fans some people may feel for B&K but those things happen. No coach is going to hold on to just one pair. I am sure the skaters know it. In the future the situation could be different. It is quite possible that B&K know it. I would not worry about it.
 
RoseRed said:
They can leave if they're unhappy with the situation. It would be up to them to do it. Mishina/Galliamov aren't going anywhere, obviously. But if B/K leave, then they lose her coaching and guidance, which has clearly worked for them getting them to this point. And also, then M/G get all her attention in the Olympic season. Who do they go to that will be as good? Is the off season before the Olympics a good time to make a change? Unless it's someone in St. Petersburg, it means moving and disrupting their whole lives less than a year before Beijing. Even if they stay in the city, it would mean major training changes and lots to adjust to.

Seems like something that would just hurt them, from my point of view. But I'm not there in training every day, so they know better than me what they need.
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They are young. They could stay at least one more year work hard and have more of a say in their choreography. Who else is there? Mozer? Trankov? Moskvina for better or worse could be their best bet choice.
 
Perky Shae Lynn said:
Late to the party. Wondering about what Boikova & Kozlovskiy should do. I love Moskvina, who doesn't? But taking M&G on was surprising. It sent a message she was hedging her bets. I don't blame her, this may be her last shot. But it may backfire spectacularly. There is tension in the group. Sometimes it works. Sometimes it sabotages skaters development. Not sure it's working for B&K. They seem more "together" now, and less connected with Tamara. The relationship has definitely changed. We'll see how things develop. Personally, I am not a fan of the situation.
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I think things will be OK I think we understand certain frustrations from the bronze pair team.
But they have to take this and grow from it they could be contenders for Olympic gold and I think we will be. Goes the other way then they might not even make the Olympic team. Its not like Russia is lacking for top pairs teams.

I am hoping Boykovas behavior is a one time thing. I think we need to let people be real be very jument and let them show their frustrations or the greatest joys if that's what they want to do.
 
AnanasAstra said:
and because her entire coaching change and stunt at Angels of Plushenko was a completely idiotic idea.
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Super sad that the most beautiful skater in the world has missed 2 world championships in a row one because Corona virus canceled world championships and ones because she caught Corona virus after the coaching change. That's no 14 it's just deadlock that she got sick.

The thing is Aliona gets her form back people better watch the h*** out.
 
Scott512 said:
I am hoping Boykovas behavior is a one time thing. I think we need to let people be real be very jument and let them show their frustrations or the greatest joys if that's what they want to do.
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It's not about Boikova's "behavior" - she is not a robot. From my observations, it would take a lot for her to express any frustration. She would have a bad fall in practice, and check on Kozlovskiy to see if he's ok. They are both young and idealistic. I think they though they had a "special" relationship with Tamara, and were her babies, her last great pair. Bringing on their rivals (who they do not get along with) and giving them two fabulous new programs and a lot of attention - that was a tough pill to swallow. B&K have two choices. They can grow up, accept the fact it's just business, and use M&G's success as motivation. Or they can move on. I hate to see this loss of innocence, but yes it's just business and they need to understand that.
 
Perky Shae Lynn said:
It's not about Boikova's "behavior" - she is not a robot. From my observations, it would take a lot for her to express any frustration. She would have a bad fall in practice, and check on Kozlovskiy to see if he's ok. They are both young and idealistic. I think they though they had a "special" relationship with Tamara, and were her babies, her last great pair. Bringing on their rivals (who they do not get along with) and giving them two fabulous new programs and a lot of attention - that was a tough pill to swallow. B&K have two choices. They can grow up, accept the fact it's just business, and use M&G's success as motivation. Or they can move on. I hate to see this loss of innocence, but yes it's just business and they need to understand that.
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The parallels to their situation with their rivals is very similar to Zhenya and Alina with Eteri. Exccept the 2 ladies singles skaters got along great while AZ was coming up the ranks.

Your most pertinent point was that B and K thought they had a special relationship with their legendary coach. And then the say these to whether kids come in and steal their saunder with the same coach has to hurt. But that's sports and that's life.

Like you said if B and K grow from this and learn something and get better I think they can be a world championship team someday or certainly a contender for the Olympic gold medal. No need to panic 11 months before the Olympics. But when their competitors get great new programs and then write it up B and K are bound to be jealous. That's just human nature and it's OK if they don't let it get out of hand.
 
Not to be morbid here- but what happens if Moskvina or Mishin pass on in the next twelve months? ?
They are both great but both not the youngest. Is there ever talk about how much Minchuk(?) the guy with Moskvina contributes or how things would go on at camp Mishin?
Obviously this is just speculation but will the skaters stay put?
 
Vash01 said:
Let us see. Tamara has coached two high level pairs more than once.

M&D and B&P
K&D and B&S.

From what I read, both pairs were not on the ice at the same time. May be the situation is different now? We don't know it.

Whatever the case, Tamara managed the situation well. As fans some people may feel for B&K but those things happen. No coach is going to hold on to just one pair. I am sure the skaters know it. In the future the situation could be different. It is quite possible that B&K know it. I would not worry about it.
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Except B&P were never a threat to M&D. There was a clear 1 and 2, no real competition between them. The federation made that outright clear who the heirs of G&G were as #1 and who wasn’t.

B&S and K&D don’t compare either. Because Dmitriev was a seasoned veteran who was practically a co-coach and equal visionary with Tamara for K&D. That team didn’t need her full attention.

B&K and M&G are both equal with no clear hierarchy. Both teams very young and in need of proper guidance and attention. She’s never had anything like that before.

M&G’s season was managed perfectly with two new programs and a clear vision while it was clear B&K were lost in the mix of the new teams arrival. No new LP even though one was apparently thought of, competing so soon almost back to back competition after barely recovering from COVID (why?), debuting a new SP at worlds cause they stuck with one that got a muted response for too long. They were struggling all season long. Even the win at Rostelecom was rough. I hope B&K are better managed by the coaches next season cause this one was a mess and not handled well
 
NAOTMAA said:
M&G’s season was managed perfectly with two new programs and a clear vision while it was clear B&K were lost in the mix of the new teams arrival. No new LP even though one was apparently thought of, competing so soon almost back to back competition after barely recovering from ********* (why?), debuting a new SP at worlds cause they stuck with one that got a muted response for too long. They were struggling all season long. Even the win at Rostelecom was rough. I hope B&K are better managed by the coaches next season cause this one was a mess and not handled well
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And yet, with a brand new SP, B/K had a comfortable lead and just needed to get through the LP and they'd easily be the winners. All of these other factors have nothing to ultimately do with them sometimes crumbling under the pressure. That LP was scoring high plenty of times last season and they would've gone into 2020 Worlds as favorites. I think it has zero to do with what they were or were not given.
 
Perky Shae Lynn said:
It's not about Boikova's "behavior" - she is not a robot. From my observations, it would take a lot for her to express any frustration. She would have a bad fall in practice, and check on Kozlovskiy to see if he's ok. They are both young and idealistic. I think they though they had a "special" relationship with Tamara, and were her babies, her last great pair. Bringing on their rivals (who they do not get along with) and giving them two fabulous new programs and a lot of attention - that was a tough pill to swallow. B&K have two choices. They can grow up, accept the fact it's just business, and use M&G's success as motivation. Or they can move on. I hate to see this loss of innocence, but yes it's just business and they need to understand that.
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How do you know that?
 
tony said:
And yet, with a brand new SP, B/K had a comfortable lead and just needed to get through the LP and they'd easily be the winners. All of these other factors have nothing to ultimately do with them sometimes crumbling under the pressure. That LP was scoring high plenty of times last season and they would've gone into 2020 Worlds as favorites. I think it has zero to do with what they were or were not given.
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The worlds SP is hardly an indication of how their season looked. They were very rough in every competition they entered. Except maybe the test skates they were clearly off their game compared to last season. They forced and pushed everything. Until worlds T&M were doing better then them. They got lucky T&M picked that competition to be their worst of the season
 
tony said:
And yet, with a brand new SP, B/K had a comfortable lead and just needed to get through the LP and they'd easily be the winners. All of these other factors have nothing to ultimately do with them sometimes crumbling under the pressure. That LP was scoring high plenty of times last season and they would've gone into 2020 Worlds as favorites. I think it has zero to do with what they were or were not given.
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And Alexandra has had issues with the throw jumps all season which is why they've traded wins with M/G. Moskvina has said multiple times she doesn't give a "better" program to one team over the other. She gives programs that she thinks suits the skaters. This time M/G came out on top. It doesn't mean any more than that. Now Dima, has a bit of an attitude and he thinks they should be the stars, but that's his problem. They aren't going to leave in a huff unless they are stupid and they are not stupid.
 
tony said:
And yet, with a brand new SP, B/K had a comfortable lead and just needed to get through the LP and they'd easily be the winners. All of these other factors have nothing to ultimately do with them sometimes crumbling under the pressure. That LP was scoring high plenty of times last season and they would've gone into 2020 Worlds as favorites. I think it has zero to do with what they were or were not given.
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its not the first time, B/K bombed, it happened in their first Senior grand prix and then at the GP Final. M/G had teh advantage of consistency ever since they were juniors, before M/G were known as technicians but they have improved and catched up to B/K in just 1 year and are already more decorated with GP Final and World gold, that alone would cause jealousy especially with that kind of personality from Boikova / Kozlovskii who dont seem to be not so nice people off the ice.
 
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