Does french figure skating have a culture of rape ? FFSG in the storm

[millyskate]

Guillaume Cizeron has made a statement in support of Sarah Abitbol.

Guillaume Cizeron on Twitter

“I want to express support and admiration for @Abitbol_sarah 's courage. Gabriella and I believe the values of this sport that we represent are pure ones. As skaters, coaches, parents, fans we all want this beautiful sport to remain a safe one.”

twitter.com

 

[cs.berlin]

»Didier Gailhaguet, the unsinkable

The head of the French Ice Sports Federation for the past 21 years, the head of the federation was summoned to the sports ministry on Monday following revelations about sexual violence in the discipline.

Ministers come and go, Didier Gailhaguet stays. The president of the French Ice Sports Federation (FFSG) has been slipping [like an eel] between sporting and non-sporting scandals and affairs for 21 years. For twenty-one years he governed federal life and brought down all opposition. Using a method described in 'Le Monde' by a dozen former members of the institution. They all tell of the impressive intelligence, the passion for figure skating - to the detriment of other disciplines -, the unabashed greed for power and manipulation that the 66-year-old leader maintains.

On Monday 3 February, he will have to explain to sports minister Roxana Maracineanu the revelations published on Wednesday 29 January by L'Equipe and L'Obs: four former high-level skaters said they were victims of sexual violence inflicted by their coaches between the late 1970s and early 1990s, when they were minors.

Although these incidents are now statute-barred and relate to a period before the current presidency, these testimonies nevertheless imply that Didier Gailhaguet, who was criticised for his passivity towards one of the accused coaches, Gilles Beyer, was accused even then. The latter served on the FFSG's Executive Council until 2018 and as such was involved in the association's strategic decisions, according to two former technical executives of the association. And this despite the fact that he had already been dismissed from his post as technical advisor in sport in 2001 following an unfavourable report by the General Inspectorate for Youth and Sport (IGJS) on suspicion of misconduct. Will the minister, who is now described internally as "very angry", urge him to resign? A former executive officer of the federation does not believe it: "He will never resign. He feeds off the conflict and knows exactly how to manoeuvre the ministers."[...]«

Patinage artistique : Didier Gailhaguet, l’insubmersible

A la tête de la Fédération française des sports de glace depuis vingt et un ans, le dirigeant est convoqué lundi au ministère des sports à la suite des révélations sur les violences sexuelles dans la discipline.

www.lemonde.fr

In Germany there is an open bill to settle with the scumbag, let's join (not only because of that) the petition!

 

[russell30]

This is terrible for the French Federation! However i thought that after the John Coughlin business there would be sadly more to come!

I hope Laetitia Hubert was not affected by this in anyway or form.....

Glad Surya Bonaly left Gailhaquet when she did!!!

Luckily Vanessa Gusmeroli was not with any of those!

 

[swissskate]

Well, Laetitia Hubert States that also experienced harassment of this trainer, he kept on offering her flowers and wanted to massage her, she was 15 An investigation was closed without follow-up in 1998...Laetitia was also coached by Jean-Roland Racle who has also been accused of raping young girls...
Looks like this scumbag Gilles Beyer had a bad habit of drinking too much

 

[cholla]

Looks like this scumbag Gilles Beyer had a bad habit of drinking too much

He is a well-known alcoholic who has already suffered two alcohol-related cancers and who is currently fighting liver cirrhosis to no avail since it's lethal. We have been told several times that he was dying but he is unusually strong and he is still there. He is only 62. Some years ago, during Nationals, after he had recently undergone nephrectomy, we were in the same hotel and at 11 in the morning he was at the bar, a full bottle of whiskey next to him. It was empty before 12. And he wasn't even drunk, which showed his level of addiction. I remember wondering if, in his circulatory system, there was some blood left in his alcohol. He was literally marinating, comfitted like a prune.

In the evening after the competition, he ordered from the same bar and only for himself, 2 beers, 2 bottles of red wine and another bottle of Scotch. I was with my mother, and we had never ever seen anyone consuming so much booze in such a short time. He was already running on only one kidney at the time and already had cirrhosis.

Some years before, at Bompard Trophy, after the competition, he was at the brewery opposite the arena, Brasserie des Artistes, along with Gailhaguet, ISU officials and judges. Beyer was so wasted he could barely walk nor speak. With my friends, we felt ashamed for him and failed to understand how Gailhaguet could tolerate such a behavior in public. The drunk was his right-hand man, everybody knew it. Gailhaguet is a crook and an a$$hole, but he is also a well educated and dignified man (at least in appearance) with a lot of authority and control over his people. Witnessing this mess, our mutual idea was : what does Beyer have on Gailhaguet that insures him such immunity ? What skeleton is hiding in Gailhag's cupbard that Beyer knows of ? It had/has definitely to be huge and mega-dirty.

 

[Primorskaya]

Yup, there has to be a large skeleton there, no-one shields for years a drunken liability like Beyer for free. Or else it's just the old-boy network rules in full force: you shield the other guys in the knowledge they will shield you the day trouble comes for you.
Reminds me of reading Gordeeva's memoirs, the bits about Stanislav Zhuk are pretty hair-raising. Also a drunk, also fond of young girls, also wearing an invisible shield.
Seriously, what is it about sports that attract THAT many perverts?? Proximity to young people, ok, but you have to actually be able to teach. I wonder if it's not more the opportunity that makes the pervert. Access, unlimited power over careers, shielded as a matter of principle, what's not to like...

 

[PRlady]

When another teacher or Boy Scout leader or youth pastor is arrested for pedophilia, I remind myself that they self-select into positions with youth contact. Not every skater coaches when s/he retires and a small percent of those that do are abusers, but certainly the reason the abusers stay in is proximity to victims.

 

[Nmsis]

Luckily Vanessa Gusmeroli was not with any of those!

Wrong.
In 1999, one year after the start of Gailhaguet's presidency, she moved to Paris and trained in Bercy, first with Stanislas Leonovitch, then with Katia Krier, Gilles Beyer's wife.
Beyer was still coaching then.
And according to Didier Lucine, it is what Vanessa told him about Beyer and what was happening during the La Roche sur Yon camps in the dormitory that prompted him in 2000 to send a letter to Gailhaguet, copy to a number of people to make sure that wouldn't be buried. That's the period the Sport Ministry launched an inquiry.
Nevertheless, she says nothing happened to her personnally.

From the start of Gailhaguet's presidency, all the girls had their arm twisted by the federation to join the Bercy group (and the boys to join Champigny)

 

[cs.berlin]

I've been watching this video over and over again since many years (despite its terrible quality), but I still cringe when this disgusting subject comes into the picture on the celebrity stage - I always suspected it was one of those oligarchic characters from Eastern Europe ...

 

[Japanfan]

Yup, there has to be a large skeleton there, no-one shields for years a drunken liability like Beyer for free. Or else it's just the old-boy network rules in full force: you shield the other guys in the knowledge they will shield you the day trouble comes for you.

Old boy networks.

 

[becca]

Yup, there has to be a large skeleton there, no-one shields for years a drunken liability like Beyer for free. Or else it's just the old-boy network rules in full force: you shield the other guys in the knowledge they will shield you the day trouble comes for you.
Reminds me of reading Gordeeva's memoirs, the bits about Stanislav Zhuk are pretty hair-raising. Also a drunk, also fond of young girls, also wearing an invisible shield.
Seriously, what is it about sports that attract THAT many perverts?? Proximity to young people, ok, but you have to actually be able to teach. I wonder if it's not more the opportunity that makes the pervert. Access, unlimited power over careers, shielded as a matter of principle, what's not to like...

I always thought power had a lot to do with rape and especially going after kids.

But look how Polanski was treated for all these years.

I personally think our culture is sexualizing children too much. Do not get me wrong this is not the children’s fault. Amazes me anyone would blame a 13 year old.

 

[DreamSkates]

I can't speak to sexual abuse, but I have seen this first hand in the U.S. with emotional abuse - parents of skaters simply looking the other way when a coach is visibly abusive because they don't want to rock the boat and possibly lose access to a "star" coach they think might get their kid to the top. Now, usually they are ignoring abusive behavior towards a skater other than their own child, but the end result is the same - a tolerance for what should be intolerable behavior.

Shoma Uno left his coach for such abuse but he was free to do so. Lambiel is his coach now, and look at the much better result.

 

[Immortelle]

deleted

 

[overedge]

I personally think our culture is sexualizing children too much. Do not get me wrong this is not the children’s fault. Amazes me anyone would blame a 13 year old.

If it's not the children's fault, then don't mention it in this thread. What's being described has nothing to do with (alleged) cultural sexualization of children.

 

[overedge]

This is terrible for the French Federation!

Since the French federation enabled and turned a blind eye to these ongoing events for many years, if this is terrible, they brought that terribleness on themselves.

I know there were good people within the federation, like Peizerat, trying to make some change happen. But I don't feel very sorry for the powerful people who ran the Federation this badly.

 

[MacMadame]

I personally think our culture is sexualizing children too much.

Sexual abuse is not about sex so even if children are being sexualized too much, that is irrelevant to this situation. Abusers look for kids who are vulnerable, perhaps coming from a dysfunctional family or being treated like an outsider by peers. They also look for kids who are available.

It has nothing to do with what they wear, how they dance, how they talk, etc.

 

[MarieM]

Since the French federation enabled and turned a blind eye to these ongoing events for many years, if this is terrible, they brought that terribleness on themselves.

I know there were good people within the federation, like Peizerat, trying to make some change happen. But I don't feel very sorry for the powerful people who ran the Federation this badly.

IMO, if you think it's only happened in France, you are kidding yourself.
I bet others will voice things like that all around federations and that cover up is what that sports has been doing for years. Decades.

 

[overedge]

IMO, if you think it's only happened in France, you are kidding yourself.
I bet others will voice things like that all around federations and that cover up is what that sports has been doing for years. Decades.

Oh, believe me, I don't think at all that this is limited to France.

 

[canbelto]

I always thought power had a lot to do with rape and especially going after kids.

But look how Polanski was treated for all these years.

I personally think our culture is sexualizing children too much. Do not get me wrong this is not the children’s fault. Amazes me anyone would blame a 13 year old.

This has nothing to do with sexualizing children so why bring it up.

 

[becca]

Sexual abuse is not about sex so even if children are being sexualized too much, that is irrelevant to this situation. Abusers look for kids who are vulnerable, perhaps coming from a dysfunctional family or being treated like an outsider by peers. They also look for kids who are available.

It has nothing to do with what they wear, how they dance, how they talk, etc.

I said children aren’t to blame. I more think the sexualization of children is more from the people who excuse it. The girl is wild etc.

I am saying the reason this is getting excused is the sexualization of children. Because the message sent when the Polanskis aren’t punished.

 

[rosewood]

Shoma Uno left his coach for such abuse but he was free to do so. Lambiel is his coach now, and look at the much better result.

Bolded mine. Can you give me a bit further explanation of this?

 

[MacMadame]

I am saying the reason this is getting excused is the sexualization of children.

Then why was it excused and covered up more in the past when children weren't sexualized?

 

[overedge]

I said children aren’t to blame. I more think the sexualization of children is more from the people who excuse it. The girl is wild etc.

I am saying the reason this is getting excused is the sexualization of children. Because the message sent when the Polanskis aren’t punished.

No one has been excused in this situation yet. And what happened to Roman Polanski has nothing to do with this situation either.

 

[Nmsis]

So Gailhaguet is to meet the french minster for Sports, Roxana Maracineanu (former swimmer, world medalist and silver olympic medalist) this monday.
He asked if he could come with his lawyer and was denied.

Sarah Abitbol is asking for his departure, along with other athletes who have signed the petition.
Journalists from several newspapers are joining efforts to hear the maximum of testimonies about abuses within french figure skating.

So what may happen on Monday ?

Maracineanu is going to ask for explanations and could ask for Gailhaguet's resignation if his explanations are not satisfying (and this is getting harder and harder by the hour).
BUT ... this is France, not Russia. Gailhaguet can absolutly answer : "no way". The federation is a private, independant entity and the sport movement is jealous of its independance. The government doesn't have the power to remove him.
BUT ... this is France, not the United States and the government has a massively convincing tool in the form of the "agrément ministériel" or "delégation" ("certification"/"approval"). Having this "agrément" allows the federation to actually use the name "french federation of ...", use the names "french championships", "french champion", "team France", "regional championships", "national championships", "international championships" and to hold competitions with those names. Plus it gives the federation a mission of public interest to develop the sport toward high level and mass sport. This comes with subsidies.
The Sports Ministry gives this "agrément" to one federation per sport / group of sports. It may also take it away. And that's what an ex-sport minister is proposing if Gailhaguet doesn't resign, calling it "the atomic bomb" (I don't think I've ever seen that used). The current minister is evoking it as well.
Then the Fe* Fra* des Sports de Glace would be left naked. No more national nor international comps for the FFSG. No name fed actually.

So what if Gailhaguet doesn't want to resign ?
Well, the ministry could remove the "agrément" or threaten to remove it if Gailhaguet stays.
Hence it would put the pressure on the only body that can actually remove the president of the french fed : the Conseil Fédéral of the FFSG.
BUT ... Gailhaguet was ousted once. In 2004, by the executive bureau which comprised 5 people and 3 of them voted against him
When he came back, he modified the statutes of the federation to make it muuuuch more difficult to topple him. Now it is the conseil federal that can revoke the president, by a majority of 2/3 of the votes. It comprises the amazing amount of 31 people (Morgan Ciprès among them since 2018, I think he was chosen by Gailhaguet as a representative of the athletes). Getting a 2/3 majority could be extremely complicated. But the threat of losing the "agrément" might make them think harder. If they revoke Gailhaguet, there will be a new General Assembly and a new election.

So what if Gailhaguet doesn't resign and the Conseil Fédéral doesn't revoke him and the Sports Ministry takes the "agrément" away ?
Then the ministry may ask the CNOSF, the french olympic committee, to organize figure skating national and international competitions, fund and select the athletes for a (short) period of time, waiting for the problem to be resolved. One option would be a new federation, built from the scratch that would seek the Ministry's "agrément" and then attract the clubs, away from the FFSG. I don't see this taking shape until all the options are exhausted with the FFSG.

 

[PRlady]

Wow. Quite a drama. Not only do I hope he’s forced to resign because he’s a world-class shit, but because it will send a message to all the skating federations that times are changing.

 

[kwanfan1818]

calling it "the atomic bomb" (I don't think I've ever seen that used).

In the US, this would be called "the nuclear option," meaning the biggest, most potentially destructive option of last resort.

Then the Fe* Fra* des Sports de Glace would be left naked. No more national nor international comps for the FFSG. No name fed actually.

The CNOSF could, presumably, de-certify the FFSG as the representative federation for determining who participates in the Olympics and choose another. Would this automatically apply to the ISU as well?

 

[LeafOnTheWind]

That's very complicated and I hope all are committed to seeing it through. Something has to change.

 

[casken]

Well, Laetitia Hubert States that also experienced harassment of this trainer, he kept on offering her flowers and wanted to massage her, she was 15 An investigation was closed without follow-up in 1998...Laetitia was also coached by Jean-Roland Racle who has also been accused of raping young girls..

This really puts Hubert's "headcase" reputation into perspective.

How could someone have a focused, stable, competitive mindset when they were abused by their coach and undermined by their federation?

 

[barbarafan]

So Gailhaguet is to meet the french minster for Sports, Roxana Maracineanu (former swimmer, world medalist and silver olympic medalist) this monday.
He asked if he could come with his lawyer and was denied.

Sarah Abitbol is asking for his departure, along with other athletes who have signed the petition.
Journalists from several newspapers are joining efforts to hear the maximum of testimonies about abuses within french figure skating.

So what may happen on Monday ?

Maracineanu is going to ask for explanations and could ask for Gailhaguet's resignation if his explanations are not satisfying (and this is getting harder and harder by the hour).
BUT ... this is France, not Russia. Gailhaguet can absolutly answer : "no way". The federation is a private, independant entity and the sport movement is jealous of its independance. The government doesn't have the power to remove him.
BUT ... this is France, not the United States and the government has a massively convincing tool in the form of the "agrément ministériel" or "delégation" ("certification"/"approval"). Having this "agrément" allows the federation to actually use the name "french federation of ...", use the names "french championships", "french champion", "team France", "regional championships", "national championships", "international championships" and to hold competitions with those names. Plus it gives the federation a mission of public interest to develop the sport toward high level and mass sport. This comes with subsidies.
The Sports Ministry gives this "agrément" to one federation per sport / group of sports. It may also take it away. And that's what an ex-sport minister is proposing if Gailhaguet doesn't resign, calling it "the atomic bomb" (I don't think I've ever seen that used). The current minister is evoking it as well.
Then the Fe* Fra* des Sports de Glace would be left naked. No more national nor international comps for the FFSG. No name fed actually.

So what if Gailhaguet doesn't want to resign ?
Well, the ministry could remove the "agrément" or threaten to remove it if Gailhaguet stays.
Hence it would put the pressure on the only body that can actually remove the president of the french fed : the Conseil Fédéral of the FFSG.
BUT ... Gailhaguet was ousted once. In 2004, by the executive bureau which comprised 5 people and 3 of them voted against him
When he came back, he modified the statutes of the federation to make it muuuuch more difficult to topple him. Now it is the conseil federal that can revoke the president, by a majority of 2/3 of the votes. It comprises the amazing amount of 31 people (Morgan Ciprès among them since 2018, I think he was chosen by Gailhaguet as a representative of the athletes). Getting a 2/3 majority could be extremely complicated. But the threat of losing the "agrément" might make them think harder. If they revoke Gailhaguet, there will be a new General Assembly and a new election.

So what if Gailhaguet doesn't resign and the Conseil Fédéral doesn't revoke him and the Sports Ministry takes the "agrément" away ?
Then the ministry may ask the CNOSF, the french olympic committee, to organize figure skating national and international competitions, fund and select the athletes for a (short) period of time, waiting for the problem to be resolved. One option would be a new federation, built from the scratch that would seek the Ministry's "agrément" and then attract the clubs, away from the FFSG. I don't see this taking shape until all the options are exhausted with the FFSG.

My fear is that Gailhaquet will refuse no matter what forcing Federation to be punished which of course would penalize skaters more than Didier. And he is so warped he would not mind this...prob. would enjoy this. Many of his decisions on certain skaters were done for spite - self gratification....Maybe it is best to start a completely new federation with new blood but hopefully a basic plan for this is in the works so there will not be a delay in the training and competitions of current competitive skaters. Maybe a few federations....once this has been decided and officially adopted can offer their help in smoothing things over and help athletes. Just a first coffee thought.

 

[cs.berlin]

French skating head asked to quit amid sex abuse claims

The head of the French skating federation has been asked to resign after being summoned for a meeting with the country's sports minister following a string of accusations of sexual abuse by a coach in the sport

www.dailyjournal.net

The results of the "conversation" are not yet known, but since practically the entire French press has been rushing into "the event" since the early hours of the morning, the minister's spokesman is unlikely to be able to avoid it for much longer. On my own, I don't think there will be any major shocks, because there is a not insignificant public in a thicket of dependencies that shrug off the balancing act between success and clean sport. Probably they will stall and organise a new date.