Articles confirming new Chinese pairs Yu/Zhang and Peng/Jin

[feraina]

But Yu/Jin were working. No reason for them to break up -- except to get a partner for Zhang.

Exactly. Let them break up all they want. It happens all the time to teams that don't live up to one or both partners' expectations.

 

[skateboy]

Exactly. Let them break up all they want. It happens all the time to teams that don't live up to one or both partners' expectations.

I know I won't change anyone's mind here, nor do I intend to try.

My own opinion is that Yu/Jin were a nice team but not particularly fabulous. I don't think it's THAT much of a tragedy that they are no longer together. (Sorry, but that really is my opinion.) Peng/Zhang were ridiculously mismatched and I don't think she was strong enough for him. I can see why the CFSF would think of switching them. I also like Hao Zhang very much--always have--and I won't be automatically assuming he is an unfeeling jerk, just because of public opinion. I understand that character assassination is based on love for others, but this way too over the top for me.

I'll stay out of this thread from now on.

 

[bronwynsings]

The thing is, even if the switch works out amazingly, none of the involved parties except Zhang wanted it to happen from everything that's been said in this thread. As long as Yu, Jin, and Peng (but more so Yu/Jin) weren't okay with the switch, I'll never support it.

 

[mag]

@skateboy, You are, of course, free to think whatever you like, however, it is rather insulting that you think that those of us who disagree with you do so because of "public opinion." I think Zhang is a jerk because of the things he has actually said. It has nothing to do with the opinions of others.

 

[VGThuy]

And maybe you're judgment is clouded and you therefore have a blind spot for him because you've always liked him like the way you think many here are jumping on a bandwagon because they've always disliked him. Yu/Jin could have been an awful team but when there are reports of how this was forced upon them coupled with how Peng was thrown away, then to me the quality of Yu/Jin doesn't matter. I get the idea that people need to be careful with what they read and not blindly listen to whatever sensationalist report is telling them but a lot of people here have been looking at the totality of the circumstances and making their judgments based on their own observations and multiple reports and what Yu and Peng and Zhang have been quoted to saying. If anything, the post-hoc justification and rationalization seems more biased and reaching to me.

 

[jlai]

I have been nothing but astounded at the way things turned out. I still believe the Chinese sport system is very result driven and this decision is so counter intuitive to their medals-oriented approach.
Which makes me think that the pairs situation must not be good. I mean, look at their jgp results at pairs and it was dismal for two seasons. They just don't have good pairs skaters coming up the ranks and they have to keep old skaters like forever. Perhaps the program needs to fail for improvement to happen

 

[Japanfan]

My own opinion is that Yu/Jin were a nice team but not particularly fabulous. I don't think it's THAT much of a tragedy that they are no longer together. (Sorry, but that really is my opinion.) Peng/Zhang were ridiculously mismatched and I don't think she was strong enough for him. I can see why the CFSF would think of switching them. I also like Hao Zhang very much--always have--and I won't be automatically assuming he is an unfeeling jerk, just because of public opinion. I understand that character assassination is based on love for others, but this way too over the top for me.

The issue appears to be that the individual skaters did not consent to the switches (other than Zhang, perhaps).

I too am wary of character assassinations, but have to ask: are you okay with a federation forcing pair skaters into partnerships?

 

[skateboy]

I too am wary of character assassinations, but have to ask: are you okay with a federation forcing pair skaters into partnerships?

Well, I'm honestly not too bothered by it. Federations and coaches can have strong ideas, and I believe this kind of thing happens much more than we hear about, even outside of China.

 

[Jessica]

Well, I'm honestly not too bothered by it. Federations and coaches can have strong ideas, and I believe this kind of thing happens much more than we hear about, even outside of China.

I thought you staying out of this thread.

I'll stay out of this thread from now on.

 

[skateboy]

I thought you staying out of this thread.

Well, I was asked a question.

Staying out now for sure.

 

[Xela M]

Well, I'm honestly not too bothered by it. Federations and coaches can have strong ideas, and I believe this kind of thing happens much more than we hear about, even outside of China.

Can you name just one example?

The only other federation whose methods can be liked to the Chinese is Russia, but even they could not keep their only ice dance OGM-hope I&K together despite all their efforts - simply because the skaters wanted to do things their way. Would that have been possible in China? Highly doubt it.

 

[rjblue]

Well, I can extrapolate from my experience of parents (the bankroll) in young curling teams, that at least some of the partner switching is the result of pressure to switch for someone "better", and not because the skater themselves want it.

But it would be totally behind the scenes, and extremely unlikely with such high level skaters.

 

[Spun Silver]

I'm reading The Second Mark right now with its biographies of Shen and Zhao as well as Berezhnaya (not so much Sikharulidze as yet). Reading about the extreme poverty of both S and Z, how everyone in the skating community had the same goal, to serve the country, how they never questioned the government no matter what... I know things have changed, but perhaps some things have not. I can imagine S and Z thinking that Yu, Peng, and Jin are incredibly lucky to skate under today's improved conditions compared to what they themselves had to go through. Shen grew up skating on awful outdoor rinks in the north of China in the dead of winter, when she was just a tiny tot; she would have to go indoors and thaw out in order to be able to go back out and freeze. She wore all the clothes she had to keep warm, and her mother washed them all every single night. That was only 30 years ago. And in the part about Berezhnaya, the violence is shocking. Goodwin writes that girls were generally considered unimportant in the Moscow skating world. Her partner beat her all the time, at home and at the rink. There was a coach known for hitting the skaters too. When Yelena and her partner moved to Petersburg to work with Moskvina, Moskvina saw it herself. She said (paraphrasing), "I knew they hit the girls in Moscow, but in Petersburg we dont have this," yet she could not find a way to put a stop to it.

Maybe the book is not accurate but if it is, the treatment of Yu and Peng makes a bit more sense. I still hate it and think it wont work, but I am less shocked.

The book also answers a question I have had about this whole episode: why is it so hard to find a partner for Zhang that they have to raid another successful partnership? Remember too that Yao Bin said Peng was the best they could come up with at the time, as if excusing her weaknesses. Well, she sucks, but we have to make the best of it - something like that. I thought, sheesh, in a country the size of China, wouldnt there be hundreds of talented skaters to train up? Turns out that, at the time Goodwin wrote anyway, there were only 11 rinks in the whole country. I dont know what the figure is now, but even if it doubled (which is unlikely) it would still be a tiny number for a country of China's size. The physical pipeline is way too small, even if there were thousands of skaters ready to hop "in" it.

 

[angelflies]

Lol this a plan for 2022?!?! And their OGM hope is on a 40/50-year-old?!

It is crazy. Old fart Zhang sucks, is a boring washed up has been and needs to freaking retire already. The Chinese federation are idiots to break up promising teams and warp their whole program around crazy fantasy dreams around that old beast.

 

[angelflies]

Does anybody really believe that the powers-that-be of the Chinese FS Federation give two craps about ANY of the individual skater's feelings, including Hao Zhang's? I don't. I believe they are concerned with only one thing: improving and winning. If they didn't think Zhang could help improve their situation, I'm sure they would drop him like a hot potato. Time will tell, whether or not their strategy will work.

If they were concerned about winning they wouldnt be putting their efforts behind old washed up/way past his best days (and didnt even win a worlds or big event in his big days) he Zhang. Obviously putting their efforts all behind a no hope to ever win the future like that including breaking up promising teams to accomadate his no future ass, they have no interest in winning. Either that or are complete idiots.

 

[angelflies]

May be he wants the OGM

So I am sure Tonia Kwiatkowski did too in her day. And her chances of getting it were even more than old ogre Zhang's are at this point.

 

[thvu]

So I am sure Tonia Kwiatkowski did too in her day. And her chances of getting it were even more than old ogre Zhang's are at this point.

Roz, is that you?