Tracking Russian figure skating's support for the war

[hanca]

Well Canada (and us and UK and others) are selling weapons to Saudi Arabia that they know are being used to decimate the Yemen people. That's pretty evil if you ask me but hey nobody cares about the Yemeni anyways I guess they are expendable.

Saudi Arabia top export destination for Canadian arms after United States in 2021

Almost all of Canada’s arms exports to Saudi Arabia are combat vehicles, as part of the $15-billion contract brokered by the Harper government but approved by Prime Minister Justin Trudeau

www.theglobeandmail.com

War on Yemen: Stop Canadian arms sales to Saudi Arabia - Spring

Canada has placed profits over peace, refusing to halt weapons sales to Saudi Arabia. This refusal constitutes an apathy towards the suffering of Yemenis, and a self-seeking posture towards war.

springmag.ca

I think you are in the wrong place if you expect some posters here to acknowledge that their own government is doing something wrong. They feel full of anger towards Russian skaters, blaming them and their families for not stopping the war, but they will ignore the fact that their own government is doing similar things and according to their own reasoning, they should be considered responsible for their own government’s actions. All this hypocrisy…

 

[Mozart]

I hope people don't interpret my bringing up how western governments are supplying arms to Saudi Arabia to decimate the Yemeni as me supporting Russia. Nope not at all.

 

[Karen-W]

I think a lot of folks in the Russian skating community are having a hard time with the reality that the rest of the skating world functions without their presence. The longer the ban remains, the less relevant they are and the more distant the memory becomes of what is missed. Very few people outside of Russia are giving any attention to their domestic GP series or other events. They got lucky that Valieva's Wednesday program went viral, because that's the only positive attention they've gotten from the wider world. Other stars from other countries will continue to rise, fill the vacuum, and the Russians know this.

 

[caseyedwards]

I think a lot of folks in the Russian skating community are having a hard time with the reality that the rest of the skating world functions without their presence. The longer the ban remains, the less relevant they are and the more distant the memory becomes of what is missed. Very few people outside of Russia are giving any attention to their domestic GP series or other events. They got lucky that Valieva's Wednesday program went viral, because that's the only positive attention they've gotten from the wider world. Other stars from other countries will continue to rise, fill the vacuum, and the Russians know this.

Just because The world is moving on doesn’t mean you can’t see - if you look- that almost all the pairs talent is in Russia. So it’s true most people aren’t looking and don’t care but it’s true anyway

 

[SidelineSkater]

Hypocrisy indeed!

Not sure anyone here is blaming the skaters for NOT stopping the war. It's very interesting how arguments on any controversial topic go down...

Person A - You are wrong person B because of facts X,Y,Z

Person B - No, because I'm going to deflect and tell you about facts D,E,F

Repeat this a hundred times, ramp up the what-about-ism, throw in the occasional insult, and dig your heels in so far to refuse to even consider the other side.

I think we can all agree on this - no one wants war (unless you're in the military industrial complex).

Going back to the root of this thread. People who openly support Russia over Ukraine in this situation deserve to be called out. If they're public about it, there's no secret list or risk of outing someone. Why is there protection for those on the list, who choose to hold this opinion and share it?

Even if they're being forced to appear in shows or post support, they're choosing personal greed over human life. Russia continues to send untrained and under-armed soldiers into battle, setting them up for slaughtering. Shouldn't the skater supporters also worry about a system where they are well kept when their fellow citizens are sent off to die?

Hypocrisy indeed!

 

[Nadya]

Well, Russia is also being "lectured" by Canada, Australia, New Zealand and most of Europe, save Belarus and Serbia. What evils have these nations recently perpetrated? Are we going to whatabout Hitler's Germany, or maybe even Spain's inquisition? Also, as an American with critical thinking ability, I was protesting the IRAQ war, and I cheered on others who did the same. I wasn't whataboutng the Russian invasion of Afghanistan or the Nazi invasion of Poland.

As an American, protesting to you was a fun, cost-free activity. From both ends. And your credit car

Me as well---but I do have to say that being on my soapbox denouncing Bush and his actions regarding Iraq is simply not the same as protesting Putin's decision to invade Ukraine in Russia. I'm not going to end up in the gulag no matter how much I protest. I think the Russians who have stood up are very, very brave.

And your credit cards were working, and you were able to fly direct to pretty much any place on the planet.

 

[tmari]

Mostly it's that people don't want to be lectured on the evils of invasions and civilian casualties by the nations guilty of multiple invasions and massive civilian casualties. But never mind; if you rule the world, the people you kill don't matter. If they are brown and Muslim, they matter even less.

(Continuing my previous response)

They matter to you? So why have you decided to whatabout in defense of Russia, which:

- systematically bombs Muslim civilians in Syria

Russian–Syrian hospital bombing campaign - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

- murdered thousands of Muslim civilians in Chechnya

Chechen–Russian conflict - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

- has a long history of genociding other Muslim groups, as well as native Siberian ethnic groups:

Circassian genocide - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Deportation of the Crimean Tatars - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Territorial evolution of Russia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

and continues committing horrific crimes into the 21st century:

Crimean Tatar tortured to death for silent protest - Hero of Ukraine and symbol of Russian lawlessness

It is four years since Reshat Ametov was abducted from his silent protest at Russia’s invasion of his native Crimea and savagely tortured to death. On the eve of the anniversary, President Petro Poroshenko entrusted to Refat Ametov his brother’s Hero of Ukraine honour and posthumous Gold Star...

khpg.org

disemboweling civilian women in the Central African Republic:

Putin’s Private Army Accused of Most Heinous Massacre Yet

Witnesses are pointing a finger at the Wagner Group over a series of gruesome killings that allegedly involved disemboweling several women.

www.thedailybeast.com

and proudly erecting statues of Stalin, a murderer of millions...

New Stalin busts unveiled in Russia

Stalin busts unveiled as Russians indulge in nostalgia for the Soviet Union's superpower status.

www.euronews.com

 

[Nadya]

(Continuing my previous response)

They matter to you? So why have you decided to whatabout in defense of Russia, which:

- systematically bombs Muslim civilians in Syria

Russian–Syrian hospital bombing campaign - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

- murdered thousands of Muslim civilians in Chechnya

Chechen–Russian conflict - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

- has a long history of genociding other Muslim groups, as well as native Siberian ethnic groups:

Circassian genocide - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Deportation of the Crimean Tatars - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Territorial evolution of Russia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

and continues committing horrific crimes into the 21st century:

Crimean Tatar tortured to death for silent protest - Hero of Ukraine and symbol of Russian lawlessness

It is four years since Reshat Ametov was abducted from his silent protest at Russia’s invasion of his native Crimea and savagely tortured to death. On the eve of the anniversary, President Petro Poroshenko entrusted to Refat Ametov his brother’s Hero of Ukraine honour and posthumous Gold Star...

khpg.org

disemboweling civilian women in the Central African Republic:

Putin’s Private Army Accused of Most Heinous Massacre Yet

Witnesses are pointing a finger at the Wagner Group over a series of gruesome killings that allegedly involved disemboweling several women.

www.thedailybeast.com

and proudly erecting statues of Stalin, a murderer of millions...

New Stalin busts unveiled in Russia

Stalin busts unveiled as Russians indulge in nostalgia for the Soviet Union's superpower status.

www.euronews.com

Like everyone else, you read into this what you want to read into this. I get to make my own views on Russia's behavior - but I don't want to be lectured by the West who's guilty of many similar adventures and the crime of hypocrisy.

 

[tmari]

Like everyone else, you read into this what you want to read into this. I get to make my own views on Russia's behavior - but I don't want to be lectured by the West who's guilty of many similar adventures and the crime of hypocrisy.

I'm not "the West". I was born in Poland. And I'm sick of Russian attempts to paint themselves as victims while sweeping under the rug their own extensive history of genocidal colonial crimes.

 

[kwanfan1818]

The ISU has specifically justified the Russia/Belarus ban on the grounds of one member's agression towards another and its impact on the agressed-upon member (emphasis mine):

The ISU Council reiterates its solidarity with all those affected by the conflict in Ukraine and our thoughts are with the entire Ukrainian people and country. The ISU Council reaffirms its full solidarity with the ISU Members in Ukraine, the Ukrainian Speed Skating Federation and the Ukrainian Figure Skating Federation. The ISU Council will evaluate possibilities for swift humanitarian assistance to its Ukrainian ISU Members.

Yemen is not a member. Iran is not a member. Iraq is not a member. Palestine is not a member.

From the point of view of figure skating, the hypocrisy is refusing to acknowledge the damage inflicted on other members.

So we could talk about US or Canadian involvement (in this century) in member countries, for example military bases and interference in elections in South America member countries. Or the conflict between Japan and pre-ban Russia over ownership of the Kurill Islands, or the various conflicts between Georgia, Azerbaijan, and Armenia, or China's crackdown on Hong Kong.

 

[Nadya]

I'm not "the West". I was born in Poland. And I'm sick of Russian attempts to paint themselves as victims while sweeping under the rug their own extensive history of genocidal colonial crimes.

What do you mean, sweep under the rug? You're posting about it here; it's certainly widely known to anyone who cares to learn. Way better than any of the American misadventures. They are either using a bad broom or that carpet is threadbare.

 

[tmari]

What do you mean, sweep under the rug? You're posting about it here; it's certainly widely known to anyone who cares to learn. Way better than any of the American misadventures. They are either using a bad broom or that carpet is threadbare.

Russia has for years portrayed itself as anti-imperialist and anti-colonial.

Why Russia Markets Itself as an Anti-Colonial Power to Africans

Colonial exceptionalism and a victim mentality are integral to Russia’s self-image.

foreignpolicy.com

 

[Bulletsdad]

What do you mean, sweep under the rug? You're posting about it here; it's certainly widely known to anyone who cares to learn. Way better than any of the American misadventures. They are either using a bad broom or that carpet is threadbare.

America has had plenty of misadventures. The anti "critical race theory" crowd is trying to legislate that some of these adventures be "swept under the rug." I think it's disgusting, and as an American and Floridian, I welcome any non-Americans to point that out, and punish the states that are propagating this white Christian nationalist nonsense ( boycott Florida, etc.).

 

[Nadya]

Russia has for years portrayed itself as anti-imperialist and anti-colonial.

Why Russia Markets Itself as an Anti-Colonial Power to Africans

Colonial exceptionalism and a victim mentality are integral to Russia’s self-image.

foreignpolicy.com

Russia has for years portrayed itself as anti-imperialist and anti-colonial.

Why Russia Markets Itself as an Anti-Colonial Power to Africans

Colonial exceptionalism and a victim mentality are integral to Russia’s self-image.

foreignpolicy.com

You are surely not singling Russia out for the very typical government-level mythmaking, are you? I mean America has for years portrayed itself as pro-democracy and pro-human rights, while none of these things are true. Israel: "the people with no land for the land without people", only the first part is true.

Dr House has the answer for you:

 

[Mugs]

Do you deny people who oppose Putin are murdered even if they are famous or well Known? You want Russian skaters to choose death for them or their families to oppose the war?

I feel like you are defending the Iraq war. It was awful and it was genocidal: millions would die

United States faced NO consequences

It’s like you are saying the war in Ukraine is worse because skating rinks have closed there and Iraq had none

You can't possibly be serious. The war in Ukraine is worse because civilians, including children, are purposefully being targeted. Civilian bodies are strewn in streets of Ukraine cities as if their lives, their hopes, their dreams didn't matter. The U.S. did not purposefully target civilians. That's the difference.

 

[Mugs]

The only things that made Riverdance worth while are that it’s so bad it’s fun to make fun of, and that Oksana Grishuk said she could learn the program in a day.

Now you had to go and drag Pasha into the argument I'm sure you are proud of her accomplishments but I find her an unlikeable skater and person. A skater should not publicly trash a competitor's program. As a fan, however, I'm more than happy to call out questionable taste; such as skating to Jailhouse Rock or Rock Around the Clock. I mean, please.

 

[Bulletsdad]

Now you had to go and drag Pasha into the argument I'm sure you are proud of her accomplishments but I find her an unlikeable skater and person. A skater should not publicly trash a competitor's program. As a fan, however, I'm more than happy to call out questionable taste; such as skating to Jailhouse Rock or Rock Around the Clock. I mean, please.

Yep, Pasha is super toxic. Even she admitted that she deserved to be slapped silly by Usova. "Oksana" also has an exaggerated opinion of her abilities, i.e. she convinced herself that she could save money by coaching her daughter in tennis (since she knows as much as pros). Long story short....she doesn't!

 

[Ananas Astra]

Now you had to go and drag Pasha into the argument I'm sure you are proud of her accomplishments but I find her an unlikeable skater and person. A skater should not publicly trash a competitor's program. As a fan, however, I'm more than happy to call out questionable taste; such as skating to Jailhouse Rock or Rock Around the Clock. I mean, please.

Although I enjoy "Riverdance" a lot, I have to say that those two pieces are classics in rock music...had Pasha skated to Coldplay or Muse (which she couldn't have because of, you know, time), your argument would be valid.

 

[Ananas Astra]

Yep, Pasha is super toxic. Even she admitted that she deserved to be slapped silly by Usova. "Oksana" also has an exaggerated opinion of her abilities, i.e. she convinced herself that she could save money by coaching her daughter in tennis (since she knows as much as pros). Long story short....she doesn't!

One of the best moments in Russian ice dance...EVER!

 

[DreamSkates]

Hypocrisy indeed!

Not sure anyone here is blaming the skaters for NOT stopping the war. It's very interesting how arguments on any controversial topic go down...

Person A - You are wrong person B because of facts X,Y,Z

Person B - No, because I'm going to deflect and tell you about facts D,E,F

Repeat this a hundred times, ramp up the what-about-ism, throw in the occasional insult, and dig your heels in so far to refuse to even consider the other side.

I think we can all agree on this - no one wants war (unless you're in the military industrial complex).

Going back to the root of this thread. People who openly support Russia over Ukraine in this situation deserve to be called out. If they're public about it, there's no secret list or risk of outing someone. Why is there protection for those on the list, who choose to hold this opinion and share it?

Even if they're being forced to appear in shows or post support, they're choosing personal greed over human life. Russia continues to send untrained and under-armed soldiers into battle, setting them up for slaughtering. Shouldn't the skater supporters also worry about a system where they are well kept when their fellow citizens are sent off to die?

Hypocrisy indeed!

I agree mostly but have to keep in mind that the skaters/coaches in Russia do not live in a country where they can freely express anything but support for Putin. When you’re a teenager you might at least act supportive rather than having a public opinion and seeing you or your family spend time in prison or being denied basics like work and food. I can’t honestly say what I would do in that situation. Fear does strange things to people’s thinking and choices.

 

[On My Own]

As an American, protesting to you was a fun, cost-free activity. From both ends. And your credit car

And your credit cards were working, and you were able to fly direct to pretty much any place on the planet.

This thread is about what I expected it to be, but I do wish people would pay attention to the bolded as well as the fact that a lot of the sanctions and the war Putin's been waging has not caused the general Russian to leave, but the forward thinking ones. Saying "where there's a will, there's a way" really doesn't work here, and the public opinion in Russia must have been on a very severe downward spiral since last year for these reasons.

Also, it's very funny. At least I'm forward with my dislike for Islam. I imagine I'd have to prise the confession out of the cold dead hands of some on this thread.

 

[Vash01]

Perky Shae Lynn, you've failed to explain how I've "put a target on their back" or how this resembles the KGB.

For the last time, no one is forcing Russia's skaters to publicly support the war. It's a choice.

Russia is Not a democracy to have freedom of speech. It is a dictatorship. Openly disagreeing with powerful people can put their lives in danger. There have been examples already. Nadia of Pussy Riot, Navalny, etc. Have paid dearly for speaking up.

You cannot assume that Russia is just like the USA or Western Europe. No, the skaters in Russia do Not have a choice. There is a real possibility that some of them are being forced to do or say things they don't believe in.

I am sure there are skaters that actually support what Putin is doing, but you cannot lump all Russian skaters in the 'supporting the war' category, based on superficial information. We cannot read their minds.

 

[PRlady]

Anything that makes Russian skaters realise that they will pay a price for overt support of Putin and the war is fine. It sends the message that the rest of the world, or most of it, is quite serious in its refusal to countenance Russian aggression. The smarter among them might ask themselves why that is and at least try to lay low from being used as propaganda props.

But judging by Tarasova’s hysterical reaction to Tessa, maybe not.

 

[Hedwig]

It is hysterically funny (or would be if the topic was not so horrible) how „they cannot protest“ is lumped together with „proudly support Putin and the war on social media“

You only need to read what Tarasova has to say and know that there are degrees of keeping your mouth shut or showing the world that you are a despicable human being, who seems to stop at nothing.

Since the IOC is in Russias pocket and tries everything to get Russians compete again I support the notion of at least letting Putin‘s spit lickers out of competition if we cannot have all of them banned as long as this horrible genozide is going on.

 

[tmari]

Russia is Not a democracy to have freedom of speech. It is a dictatorship. Openly disagreeing with powerful people can put their lives in danger. There have been examples already. Nadia of Pussy Riot, Navalny, etc. Have paid dearly for speaking up.

You cannot assume that Russia is just like the USA or Western Europe. No, the skaters in Russia do Not have a choice. There is a real possibility that some of them are being forced to do or say things they don't believe in.

I am sure there are skaters that actually support what Putin is doing, but you cannot lump all Russian skaters in the 'supporting the war' category, based on superficial information. We cannot read their minds.

This is a straw man argument. This topic is about skaters who've chosen to announce to the world that they support the war.

Who's lumping all skaters into the same category?

 

[Vagabond]

There is no evidence that Russian skaters are forced to speak up in support of the war. None.

To the contrary, there are interviews linked to posts in this forum in which Russian skaters are asked war-related questions and refuse to be drawn on the subject. Some people here should go read those interviews.

 

[Nadya]

You can't possibly be serious. The war in Ukraine is worse because civilians, including children, are purposefully being targeted. Civilian bodies are strewn in streets of Ukraine cities as if their lives, their hopes, their dreams didn't matter. The U.S. did not purposefully target civilians. That's the difference.

What? You're saying the deaths of millions should be excused because "it was an accident"?

Just be honest: the dead do not count if they are brown and Muslim.

 

[airgelaal]

How convenient it is to be Russian.

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

Here is a fragment from Plushenko's show "Union of Champions". Published by Elena Rodina. She calls herself "an expert in the field of figure skating. Analyst. Hit writer. Protector of children. Patriot". The figure skater in the video skates to a song written and performed by Rodina herself.
And since this Rodina is an expert, she has social networks with various gossip and news. Let's see what this "kind woman" wrote about Danijil Szemko

That fascist. What was he doing in Russia anyway? They're all here, damn it. Thanks to whoever slaughtered that pig. Sorry, not dead.

ЕЛЕНА РОДИНА

Спортивный обозреватель, общественный деятель, эксперт на ТВ. Композитор, поэт. Патриот 🇷🇺.

t.me

Her social networks are full of Z-propaganda and support for the war. Do you think at least one of the skaters will refuse to participate in the Plushenko show? If they are all so against it, then where is the limit when they stop being silent?

 

[Ananas Astra]

How convenient it is to be Russian.

View this content on Instagram

View this content on Instagram

Here is a fragment from Plushenko's show "Union of Champions". Published by Elena Rodina. She calls herself "an expert in the field of figure skating. Analyst. Hit writer. Protector of children. Patriot". The figure skater in the video skates to a song written and performed by Rodina herself.
And since this Rodina is an expert, she has social networks with various gossip and news. Let's see what this "kind woman" wrote about Danijil Szemko

ЕЛЕНА РОДИНА

Спортивный обозреватель, общественный деятель, эксперт на ТВ. Композитор, поэт. Патриот 🇷🇺.

t.me

Her social networks are full of Z-propaganda and support for the war. Do you think at least one of the skaters will refuse to participate in the Plushenko show? If they are all so against it, then where is the limit when they stop being silent?

Elena Rodina is an idiot, by no means a serious "figure skating influencer" and most Russian figure skaters avoid her.
She has already attacked several of them, including Kolyada, and her Youtube-channel is a shithole full of gossip and wordpuke.

 

[airgelaal]

Elena Rodina is an idiot, by no means a serious "figure skating influencer" and most Russian figure skaters avoid her.
She has already attacked several of them, including Kolyada, and her Youtube-channel is a shithole full of gossip and wordpuke.

Nevertheless, Plushenko uses her song in his shows and skaters are ok.
How I like it and how convenient it is. We will call everyone who does not fit into the portrait of "good russians" idiots and everything will immediately become fine.