Orser explains why Briand coached Hanyu at GP Final in Torino (Hersh article); also a Ghislain Briand article (in French)

[Sylvia]

'Trouble in paradise' between Yuzuru Hanyu and Brian Orser? Coach says no

Brian Orser coached Yuzuru Hanyu to Olympic titles in 2014 and 2018.

olympics.nbcsports.com

Excerpt:

“I know it looks like there is trouble in paradise, but there isn’t,” Orser said Tuesday via telephone.
“We have bumps in the relationship like any people who have worked closely with each other for a long time, but I feel pretty confident everything is fine. We were working great together this season, and he was skating very well – over 300 points at both his (regular season) Grand Prix events.”
...
Much to Orser’s dismay and disappointment, the reaction to his absence was, like many things in the social media era, blown far out of proportion by some in Hanyu’s adoring and occasionally verbally belligerent fan base.
“So many fans were very angry at me,” Orser said. “They were blaming me and the Cricket Club for the bad start. By my not being there, it looked like I didn’t care. I wanted to go and was ready to go, but my hands were completely tied.”

 

[overedge]

But, but, I thought Hanyu lost because the ISU allowed judges to be unfair

 

[kittyjake5]

uh oh......

 

[her grace]

Why you lie, B? #sheddingasingletear

 

[Polaris]

So someone just randomly submitted Ghislain's name and Orser was surprised to find out last minute?

Yeah...at best it means the team needs to work on their communication, and at worst it means Ghislain has superseded Orser. Either way, the optics don't look good.

 

[Andrey aka Pushkin]

I was prepared to make some snarky comments about yet another version of this story, but actually, this is what has been floating in Turin as well, and confirmed by Hanyu himself.

I have some jucier versions, but seemingly this one is true.

 

[chantilly]

It’s not that hard to believe to me. Chen is obviously a threat. Technically Hanyu needed more difficult jumps in his program. The federation stepped in to ensure the right coach likely to make this happen was the single coach “allowed” to attend.
Said coach muffed up his travel or was the victim on some bad timing theft.
Hanyu muffed up the short.
Chen wins.

 

[antmanb]

#brianapologizetoyuzu

 

[misskarne]

Ridiculous that Orser even has to clarify.

 

[Tahuu]

"One skater one accredited coach" may just be an excuse. You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin. There were other cases of multiple coaches by the board or at K/C in pairs and dance as well, excluding multiple skaters from the same coaching groups. All together I saw 5-6 different coaches by the board and at the K/C between the two Chinese pairs. The rule may just mean the ISU only pays one coach's per diem. But why then JFS or Hanyu didn't want to pay Orser's?

 

[Tinami Amori]

I am not a fan of Orser, but fans should not butt into relationship between a coach and a skater and "attack" coach's social media with their version of events. It ultimately hurts the skater, and Hanyu had enough to deal with without "gossips".

Orser on the other hand was not smart to be posting photos on IG training Kurakova on the exact days Hanyu practiced and sat alone in k-n-c.

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But still, fans should not attack a coach, they don't know the arrangement between the two.

 

[chantilly]

"One skater one accredited coach" may just be an excuse. You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin. There were other cases of multiple coaches by the board or at K/C in pairs and dance as well, excluding multiple skaters from the same coaching groups. All together I saw 5-6 different coaches by the board and at the K/C between the two Chinese pairs. The rule may just mean the ISU only pays one coach's per diem. But why then JFS or Hanyu didn't want to pay Orser's?

Not to incite any conspiracy theories here, but Hanyu is consistently losing to Chen of late. Maybe the JFS doesn’t have faith in Orser to bring his skater to another gold.

 

[Vash01]

Not to incite any conspiracy theories here, but Hanyu is consistently losing to Chen of late. Maybe the JFS doesn’t have faith in Orser to bring his skater to another gold.

Let us face it. Yuzuru’s body has a lot of mileage and Chen is young. Eventually the next generation takes over. It will be unrealistic to expect a third OGM for Hanyu when the sport has become so athletic. I admire Yuzuru immensely for even placing second these days. I do feel that he deserves higher PCS but jumps are the name of the game.

It is neither Orser’s nor Yuzuru’s fault that he is losing to Chen every time. It is just life. I still enjoy watching Yuzuru skate. The day he retires from skating will be a sad one for me.

 

[Orm Irian]

"One skater one accredited coach" may just be an excuse. You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin. There were other cases of multiple coaches by the board or at K/C in pairs and dance as well, excluding multiple skaters from the same coaching groups. All together I saw 5-6 different coaches by the board and at the K/C between the two Chinese pairs. The rule may just mean the ISU only pays one coach's per diem. But why then JFS or Hanyu didn't want to pay Orser's?

That seems to have happened when there was more than one skater from the same club at the competition. For example, there were four Sambo70 girls competing, which meant that each one of them could bring a different designated coach and they then, as a group, had access to four coaches at the competition. If Jason Brown, for example, had reached the final then there would have been two TCC coaches at the final and (most likely) Tracy Wilson could have stepped in for Hanyu when Briand ran into his travel difficulties, but as it stood, Hanyu was the only TCC skater there, so there wasn't anybody who could be backup.

 

[chantilly]

Let us face it. Yuzuru’s body has a lot of mileage and Chen is young. Eventually the next generation takes over. It will be unrealistic to expect a third OGM for Hanyu when the sport has become so athletic. I admire Yuzuru immensely for even placing second these days. I do feel that he deserves higher PCS but jumps are the name of the game.

It is neither Orser’s nor Yuzuru’s fault that he is losing to Chen every time. It is just life. I still enjoy watching Yuzuru skate. The day he retires from skating will be a sad one for me.

Agreed somewhat. But doesn’t mean they aren’t going to try. Considering Hanyu worked and successfully executed two more difficult quads at the GPF FS that he has either struggled with or left out of his arsenal in a while and the fact that he is working on a quad axel makes it pretty clear that he thinks he can win.
Plus ice is slippery, Chen has had injury issues and the last Olympics wasn’t his best.
Anything can happen, including Hanyu winning another gold medal.
The implosion of men’s skating from one competition to another in this last quad is proof of that.

 

[thvu]

"One skater one accredited coach" may just be an excuse. You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin. There were other cases of multiple coaches by the board or at K/C in pairs and dance as well, excluding multiple skaters from the same coaching groups. All together I saw 5-6 different coaches by the board and at the K/C between the two Chinese pairs. The rule may just mean the ISU only pays one coach's per diem. But why then JFS or Hanyu didn't want to pay Orser's?

Do you realize you’re taking an incorrect assumption and then running with it as fact?

 

[misskarne]

"One skater one accredited coach" may just be an excuse. You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin. There were other cases of multiple coaches by the board or at K/C in pairs and dance as well, excluding multiple skaters from the same coaching groups. All together I saw 5-6 different coaches by the board and at the K/C between the two Chinese pairs. The rule may just mean the ISU only pays one coach's per diem. But why then JFS or Hanyu didn't want to pay Orser's?

Bzzzt, completely wrong.

But when you have multiple skaters from the same stable and each one can bring one coach...

For example, had Jason made the final, he could have brought Orser, and Yuzuru could have brought Ghislain. Once that happened, both coaches could have sat with both skaters. The restriction was on accreditation.

 

[mackiecat]

"One skater one accredited coach" may just be an excuse. You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin. There were other cases of multiple coaches by the board or at K/C in pairs and dance as well, excluding multiple skaters from the same coaching groups. All together I saw 5-6 different coaches by the board and at the K/C between the two Chinese pairs. The rule may just mean the ISU only pays one coach's per diem. But why then JFS or Hanyu didn't want to pay Orser's?

Before you make up things, why not look on the ISU site for the answers.
5.4 Entries of Team Members

Please be advised that only one Coach per Skater will be accredited.

 

[Tahuu]

Before you make up things, why not look on the ISU site for the answers.
5.4 Entries of Team Members

Please be advised that only one Coach per Skater will be accredited.

Go watch and explain why "You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin?"

 

[thvu]

Go watch and explain why "You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin?"

It’s already been explained. Go ahead and keep being irrational and ridiculous.

 

[jiejie]

Go watch and explain why "You can see two coaches with Jin and Samarin?"

Might not be two coaches, but one coach and one federation representative. Major federations (and some minor ones) send at least one federation "team leader" and sometimes others (team doctor, etc.). There is a credentialing process for these competition attendees as well as for athletes, coaches, and judges.

 

[Orm Irian]

Might not be two coaches, but one coach and one federation representative. Major federations (and some minor ones) send at least one federation "team leader" and sometimes others (team doctor, etc.). There is a credentialing process for these competition attendees as well as for athletes, coaches, and judges.

Yes, this. IIRC Katia Krier, who's recently been acting as the French team leader at major events, was rinkside for Kevin Aymoz along with his coach.

 

[Tinami Amori]

I am not trying to start an argument. But since there is an issue of why there are 2 coaches with 1 skater, i have a question.

Lets take Samarin. He had 2 people with him in K-n-C - coach Svetlana Sokolovskaya and choreographer Vitaly Butikov. All 3 represent Moscow's CSKA Club.

At this event, Sokolovskaya had only Samarin.
Butikov is not a choreographer to any other skaters at this event (as far as i know and checked).

There is only 1 other skater from Moscow/CSKA club at this event, jr. ladies - Vasilieva, and she was with Davydov.
So we have 2 skaters from CSKA, and 3 people accredited.

How did Butikov got accreditation if 2 CSKA skaters, each came with their own coach?

 

[Sylvia]

Boyang Jin's two coaches sat with him in the kiss & cry in Torino: Zhaoxiao XU (male) & Caishu FU (female).

 

[Sylvia]

Thought I would share this French article in this thread since it's relevant to the topic... Alain Bergeron's piece on Ghislain Briand:

Patinage artistique: un Québécois derrière les succès d'un champion japonais

Le Québécois Ghislain Briand est l’un des entraîneurs du champion olympique Yuzuru Hanyu.

www.journaldemontreal.com

 

[karmena]

I am not trying to start an argument. But since there is an issue of why there are 2 coaches with 1 skater, i have a question.

Lets take Samarin. He had 2 people with him in K-n-C - coach Svetlana Sokolovskaya and choreographer Vitaly Butikov. All 3 represent Moscow's CSKA Club.

At this event, Sokolovskaya had only Samarin.
Butikov is not a choreographer to any other skaters at this event (as far as i know and checked).

There is only 1 other skater from Moscow/CSKA club, and that event, jr. ladies - Vasilieva and she was with Davydov.
So we have 2 skaters from CSKA, and 3 people accredited.

How did Butkov got accreditation if 2 CSKA skaters, each came with their own coach?

….ask to Butkov

 

[mackiecat]

Maybe Eteri gave some of her spots up. Her team is 3 people but she had many more skaters, perhaps the Russian fed used some of her not used spots? Depending on the size of the team, each fed also gets to send a certain number of team leaders.

 

[Vash01]

Agreed somewhat. But doesn’t mean they aren’t going to try. Considering Hanyu worked and successfully executed two more difficult quads at the GPF FS that he has either struggled with or left out of his arsenal in a while and the fact that he is working on a quad axel makes it pretty clear that he thinks he can win.
Plus ice is slippery, Chen has had injury issues and the last Olympics wasn’t his best.
Anything can happen, including Hanyu winning another gold medal.
The implosion of men’s skating from one competition to another in this last quad is proof of that.

Of course he is going to try. He will push himself to the max. He will give it his best effort.
Anything can happen, but the reality is Chen has fresh legs. Both are strong competitors. I think age gives advantage to Chen ( I am not his fan, but that is just the reality).

 

[lurkz2]

Not trying the to start an argument but something doesn't add up for me. Yuzu's statement gave me the impression that they chose Ghislain coz Brian was busy, but Brian's statement to Phil makes it seem like he was blindsided.

Jackie Wong on Twitter

“Hanyu: I don't feel any difficulties without my coaches here. We couldn't get accreditation for more than one coach. Because Brian was busy a week earlier, so Ghislain was supposed to be here. There were some issues for Ghisland to get into Italy. #GPFTurin2019 #GPFigure”

twitter.com

 

[RoseRed]

Not trying the to start an argument but something doesn't add up for me. Yuzu's statement gave me the impression that they chose Ghislain coz Brian was busy, but Brian's statement to Phil makes it seem like he was blindsided.

Jackie Wong on Twitter

“Hanyu: I don't feel any difficulties without my coaches here. We couldn't get accreditation for more than one coach. Because Brian was busy a week earlier, so Ghislain was supposed to be here. There were some issues for Ghisland to get into Italy. #GPFTurin2019 #GPFigure”

twitter.com

Well, I see no reason to doubt Brian when he says he was ready and willing to go. That he was busy a week earlier may have been one of the reasons Hanyu / the Japanese Fed decided to go with Ghislain, but it doesn't mean Brian was not available for the final and happy to go.