ISU Congress

[hanca]

@ananis I believe a change was made a few years back to count half loops as jumps, making the old fashioned series of jump-1/2 loop - flip or salchow a three jump combination.

What is being changed now is that they have created a 7th type of jump - a euler. So the 1/2 loop will no longer count as a loop. I believe this matters now because of another rule change a few years back that dealt with limitations on repeating jumps with 2 or less rotations.

I'm pretty sure I butchered that, as sure as I am that someone will correct me and provide the right information

I for one am sad to see the steps before the solo jump being eliminated. They are totally admitting judges weren't getting it done with this element. Rather than make the callers award the steps a level, they are trashing the whole thing.

It's interesting, though. Success in IJS programs really depends on being able to do difficult entrances, be they short or simply full of complex transitions, into jumps. It's a shame none of the skaters, particularly juniors, will have this element to track their progress in this area.

I still don’t see why it matters that the half loop will be called euler. Half loop counted as a single loop and as one can do only one combination of three jumps, there was no chance that anyone would repeat the half loop (or euler) even if it was still counted as a single loop. Skaters are unlikely going to put a single loop in their program, so the chance of repeating it on purpose is zero. And if someone singled loop (let’s say triple loop popped to single), they may have too many single loops, but with too many repeated jumps only the repeated jumps doesn’t count, not the whole combination. And the value of single loop was something tiny anyway. I believe approx 0.5 point?

 

[SmallFairy]

I still don’t see why it matters that the half loop will be called euler. Half loop counted as a single loop and as one can do only one combination of three jumps, there was no chance that anyone would repeat the half loop (or euler) even if it was still counted as a single loop. Skaters are unlikely going to put a single loop in their program, so the chance of repeating it on purpose is zero. And if someone singled loop (let’s say triple loop popped to single), they may have too many single loops, but with too many repeated jumps only the repeated jumps doesn’t count, not the whole combination. And the value of single loop was something tiny anyway. I believe approx 0.5 point?

It matters a lot to skaters not at elite level, who for instances only have singles yet

 

[SmallFairy]

According the Norwegian Skating Union's Facebook page, Jan Dijkema (Netherlands) is elected ISU president. Tron Espeli (Norway) is elected vice president.

https://www.facebook.com/Norges.Skoyteforbund/ (in Norwegian)

 

[hanca]

It matters a lot to skaters not at elite level, who for instances only have singles yet

I see. Yes, I was looking at it from the point of view of elite skaters who do mostly triples and quads.

 

[gkelly]

My guess is that the lack of preceding steps in the SP was mainly a problem with skaters attempting quads.

When the requirement was first introduced, the solo jump was a required double. IIRC it wasn't until 1989 that senior men were allowed to do triples for that element and 1995 for women, and then a few years later required to do triple (or quad for men starting 1999).

 

[tony]

My guess is that the lack of preceding steps in the SP was mainly a problem with skaters attempting quads.

When the requirement was first introduced, the solo jump was a required double. IIRC it wasn't until 1989 that senior men were allowed to do triples for that element and 1995 for women, and then a few years later required to do triple (or quad for men starting 1999).

The triple jump requirement for the ladies started in the 2002/2003 season. Until that point, a double was still within the rules.

 

[lexeoe]

are they announcing the 2021 bid results today?

 

[Sylvia]

are they announcing the 2021 bid results today?

I don't believe so - that info/news should be announced in an upcoming, separate "Decisions of the ISU Council" ISU Communication.

An ISU Congress 2018 recap has been published: https://www.isu.org/news/145-news/12111-decisions-of-the-congress?templateParam=15

 

[SamuraiK]

I like that the order of the medal ceremonies has been adjusted to reflect olympic order. Now bronze will be called first, then silver, then gold.

 

[StitchMonkey]

I like that the order of the medal ceremonies has been adjusted to reflect olympic order. Now bronze will be called first, then silver, then gold.

Guess they figured out skaters know how to climb to that top step after all.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ I never really noticed that there was a difference in how the order was called between Olympics and Worlds...

The Olympic podium steps are made differently anyway. Plus it was kind of annoying the way the actual medal presentations had to take place later at a different venue, which meant it was difficult tracking down all the figure skating awards, separate from the mini-celebrations with toy animals in the fs arena.

 

[thvu]

When is Guillaume gonna be allowed to skate in sheer underwear?

Where was this emergency proposal Netherlands!

 

[Areski]

After Shekhovtsova objected the mandatory minimun of 5/5 NED actually conceded and said it could be ammended to just an equal number on each panel but then both technical comittess (Single/Pairs and Dance) objected saying that it would be too risky having such a low number and that the rule should be the same for all ISU events. That's where it went downhill IMO.

Why is that corrupted woman allowed to take part in any of it? Oops ... I forgot this is ISU that we're talking about.

 

[SamuraiK]

Why is that corrupted woman allowed to take part in any of it? Oops ... I forgot this is ISU that we're talking about.

At least she lost the reelection on the Dance Comitee. Giorgy Elek (HUN) was elected instead.

 

[GREGORY]

Why is that corrupted woman allowed to take part in any of it? Oops ... I forgot this is ISU that we're talking about.

Shekhovtsova is no longer a member of the ice dance technical committee.

 

[lexeoe]

Shekhovtsova is no longer a member of the ice dance technical committee.

I remember her getting elected today. Any development?

 

[Sylvia]

All election results are published here: https://www.isu.org/news/145-news/12112-election-results?templateParam=15

 

[Dobre]

I remember her getting elected today. Any development?

Per the thread on GS, there was a mistake during the voting. Rettstatt was voted in by majority. The next three nominees tied. And the fifth nominee finished well behind. There was a second vote to settle the tie. Rettstadt was already selected and removed from the second vote, but the bottom nominee was accidentally left on. During that vote it appeared that Shekhovtsova and the British nominee were the winners. However, the vote had been split incorrectly because the fifth nominee was incorrectly on the list. So they voted again. This time with just the three names that had tied, and this time Elek & the British nominee finished ahead of Shekhovtsova. So she missed the cut. Though, obviously, those three nominees were all very close. (Apparently all these votes took place back to back to back so you probably just missed the final vote).

 

[caseyedwards]

It will take effect inmmediately this season. As for the skaters with programas already made, They can keep them, They will just not get all the excessive bonus.

The split panel proposal was only for ISU events (JGP, GP, Challenger and Championships) so it wouldn't affect the SB list but the issue with 5 judges on each panel really affects the challenger series where sometimes there's only 7 or even less . Lakernik also stated that it will be worse for Dance because you cant use the same judge from other categories like with singles and pairs.

I bet no one ever- Not once in any competition- puts a jump in the second half With no bonus received

 

[Sylvia]

The final ice dance technical committee vote between Shekhovtsova and Elek was announced ~ the 3 hour 26 minute mark: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MKFPezs8Kcg

 

[lexeoe]

Per the thread on GS, there was a mistake during the voting. Rettstatt was voted in by majority. The next three nominees tied. And the fifth nominee finished well behind. There was a second vote to settle the tie. Rettstadt was already selected and removed from the second vote, but the bottom nominee was accidentally left on. During that vote it appeared that Shekhovtsova and the British nominee were the winners. However, the vote had been split incorrectly because the fifth nominee was incorrectly on the list. So they voted again. This time with just the three names that had tied, and this time Elek & the British nominee finished ahead of Shekhovtsova. So she missed the cut. Though, obviously, those three nominees were all very close. (Apparently all these votes took place back to back to back so you probably just missed the final vote).

Ah, so even the ISU suffered a Steve Harvey moment.

 

[VGThuy]

That’s such an example of how the make up of the nominees do affect the winners. Also, the voters got a preview of who was going to win before the revote so I wonder if there was some machinations going on to make sure a certain someone didn’t win this time around.

 

[GREGORY]

Per the thread on GS, there was a mistake during the voting. Rettstatt was voted in by majority. The next three nominees tied. And the fifth nominee finished well behind. There was a second vote to settle the tie. Rettstadt was already selected and removed from the second vote, but the bottom nominee was accidentally left on. During that vote it appeared that Shekhovtsova and the British nominee were the winners. However, the vote had been split incorrectly because the fifth nominee was incorrectly on the list. So they voted again. This time with just the three names that had tied, and this time Elek & the British nominee finished ahead of Shekhovtsova. So she missed the cut. Though, obviously, those three nominees were all very close. (Apparently all these votes took place back to back to back so you probably just missed the final vote).

It's very rude for Alla s... Elected and no elected. The legals advisors should be fired

 

[Coco]

Awkward

 

[Dobre]

That’s such an example of how the make up of the nominees do affect the winners. Also, the voters got a preview of who was going to win before the revote so I wonder if there was some machinations going on to make sure a certain someone didn’t win this time around.

They would have had a quite clear idea of who could win after the first vote. Baranov (UKR), Shekhovtsova (RUS), and Elek (HUN) all from Eastern Europe. It's surprising that the winner switched, but not too surprising to think that Elek could have been just as appealing a choice for the people who had previously voted for Baranov as Shekhovtsova. In any case, 44 votes for Selby, Shekhotsova, & Elek during the initial tie so apparently plenty of support for all of them.

 

[kwanfan1818]

With regard to split panels, I still don't understand the insistence on "one-size fits all" for rules and officiating across all levels of competitive figure skating. To me, it's as if MLB were hog-tied to Little League officiating. The ISU already allows a range of min/max panel sizes for international competitions.

Skaters at the lower levels and in some higher level small, local competitions still have marks tallied on paper, smaller panels, and officials and judges with lower-level accreditation, subject to the limitations of who volunteers, how much money is in the coffers, and how TPTB decide to spend it. I doubt your average eight-year-old or thirteen-year-old -- unless they are a student of Tutberidze -- actually believes that they are being judged the same way that elite seniors are. They might luck into it, but even they aren't deluded into thinking it's equal across all levels.

IMO, the ISU should be able to define the best officiating -- judging and tech panel -- strategy for ISU competition, and not have to be tethered to a low common denominator. The ISU should be able to say that there are a minimum of X judges, split X%/Y%, for ISU -- championships, JGP, GP, CS, Olympic Qualifier -- and ISU-governed -- Olympic, Goodwill Games, etc. -- competitions.

 

[seabm7]

I got confused over the changes of the pair lifts. There are two places (Rule 610 and Rule 619 c)) where they define illegal movements. The proposal 257 removes only Rule 610, not the other one.

Rule 619 c) is as follows,

"Spinning movements in which the Man swings the Lady around in the air while holding her hand or foot, are illegal. Also illegal are the jumps of one of the partners towards the other partner, rotational movements with the grip of one of the partners on the leg, arm and neck of the other partner. "

 

[nimi]

I got confused over the changes of the pair lifts. There are two places (Rule 610 and Rule 619 c)) where they define illegal movements. The proposal 257 removes only Rule 610, not the other one.

Rule 619 c) is as follows,

"Spinning movements in which the Man swings the Lady around in the air while holding her hand or foot, are illegal. Also illegal are the jumps of one of the partners towards the other partner, rotational movements with the grip of one of the partners on the leg, arm and neck of the other partner. "

That is a bit confusing. Probably a simple oversight, but still.

Also, like others here have noted, it's surprising if headbangers really are legal moves now in competitions. I expect there will be further clarifications about these changes, i.e. whether headbangers are included in or excluded from the category of "spinning movements in which..."

I took a look at the changes re: dance lifts (rule 704 par 16, screencap here) and they removed some restrictions there, too. E.g. sitting on the partner's head is still illegal (btw this is my favorite ice dance rule lol) but lying on the partner's head is now okay. Similarly, standing on the partner's shoulder is still illegal but standing on their back is okay.

I just wonder whether in ice dance, too, there's another rule someplace else where there's something about "the Lady shall not sit on the Man's head" etc. I'm just too lazy to go through the 100+ pages of ice dance rules and regulations to find out...

 

[personwhoishere]

I saw something in another thread about a new rule for underrotations but I'm surprised it's not posted here as I would think that's pretty significant?

 

[VGThuy]

I saw something in another thread about a new rule for underrotations but I'm surprised it's not posted here as I would think that's pretty significant?

What's the new rule for underrotations?