Pairs Discussion Thread 2017-18--"Two Skating as One"

Is there any reason why they eliminate only 6 teams out of 22 after the Sp?

It just seems completely pointless and stupid. If you want to make eliminations then make it matter and do more like 10 and leave 12 left. Otherwise they should just let everbody do the Lp.

If it were worlds then fine whatever, but it's the Olympics. It's a different competition with different meaning. Let everyone have their moment!
 
Is there any reason why they eliminate only 6 teams out of 22 after the Sp?

It just seems completely pointless and stupid. If you want to make eliminations then make it matter and do more like 10 and leave 12 left. Otherwise they should just let everbody do the Lp.

If it were worlds then fine whatever, but it's the Olympics. It's a different competition with different meaning. Let everyone have their moment!
The ISU wants four flights for the free skate - 24 singles, 20 ice dance & 16 pairs - hence the cut of six teams.
 
Is there any reason why they eliminate only 6 teams out of 22 after the Sp?

It just seems completely pointless and stupid. If you want to make eliminations then make it matter and do more like 10 and leave 12 left. Otherwise they should just let everbody do the Lp.

If it were worlds then fine whatever, but it's the Olympics. It's a different competition with different meaning. Let everyone have their moment!

That's exactly how I feel. I feel like the Olympics are just different and if they're already limiting the amount of competitors that can compete at the Olympics then there's no reason to have the LP cut off really. I mean I get five warm-up groups and two zambonis is a lot for a Pairs LP, but they can survive.
 
So anyway... WOWWWWWWW... ALL 16 teams that advanced had 0 deductions... Can you believe it???????

When you see both Italian teams at 74... Wow.. just wow.....

Pairs has advanced MILES....

Was hoping so much that A&W would advance but when I saw them at 4CC I wasnt impressed as I was with them last year....

The Knierims... well, at least they advanced... but I do see how other teams are improving.. and they.... well... were better last year first competition back at 4CC then they are now with a full year behind them :(

The husband, unfortunately, is error-prone. I am also disappointed for Moore -Towers. Her partner is also scary. They have such a stellar program but he cannot deliver on it. We have similar problems all over figure skating, the men are perpetually being overshadowed by the women. I hope we see more parity in the newer generation of figure skaters.
 
That was a hell of a competition. Bravo Pairs. They kick ass tonight! :kickass::respec:

I have a "confession" to make. I know is wrong and not fair to Aljona, but I kinda wish she doesn't win this. Half the reason is cause I like Sui&Han better. But half of it it's also cause it means Bruno wins this too, instead of Robin. And I do not find that "fair", at all, or deserving. It bothers me, somehow. :shuffle: I know it's petty but yep. Guilty. :slinkaway

Err.. Robin fell TWICE at the two Olympics he skated at and refused to continue. What's unfair about that?!
 
The pairs event was spectacular. The 1994 pairs event (best of all time in my opinion) might just be beat if the LP goes like the SP for everyone.

I am heartbroken for S&M, but I think they should go for broke and see what happens. They have nothing to lose.

A Bronze is not going to be satisfactory for Bruno anyway.
 
V/T record will never be broken...

Actually it will, in 2022 by S/H at home in Beijing.

LMAO..Um no.. That would be S&M.. side by side doubles and in 4th place, and a hair out of third........ CHILD........

Only Bruno did a double and he only got one point for it. They rest of the program was great. The score is fine. If he did the triple, they would've been closer to 81 or 82.
 
I think Bruno would be happy with any medal. Aliona won’t be happy with a bronze.
Bruno said he doesn't wan Aljona to come home with another bronze medal. :(

And he looked so crestfallen when they finished... And in the k&c when they received their scores... And in the mixed zone when they talked to reporters... :fragile:
 
I think Bruno would be happy with any medal. Aliona won’t be happy with a bronze.

I don't know. Did any gymnastics fan who followed the sport in the 90s and 2000s ever believe they would see Diva Khorkina smiling, laughing and posing for pictures when Russia won bronze in the 2004 team competition? The same woman who reportly slapped a teammate or looked a her Sydney silver with complete disgust and then take it off?

Yeah Alonia is much much closer to gold then Russia was in 2004, but considering this time around the journey was tougher and all the obstacles and challenges deep down I'm sure she will be proud with any color even if it isn't gold. If she doesn't think that now then years later I'm sure she will. She did absolutely everything she could but alas such is the nature of pairs that you need a partner to match you.
 
Actually it will, in 2022 by S/H at home in Beijing.



Only Bruno did a double and he only got one point for it. They rest of the program was great. The score is fine. If he did the triple, they would've been closer to 81 or 82.

Yeah but Tara alwaysssss says 'Better to rotate a triple and fall than do a double."

Well, example Chris Knierim rotated a triple didn't even fall (had a step out) and this team is MILES behind S&M.

Guarise, Hotarek, and over a dozen more rotated triples and are behind S&M..

Tara is wrong then....

S&M's other elements IN THE SHORT PROGRAM are NOT that Superior to everyone else that doubles jumps dont matter.

Now, dont get me wrong S&M are tied with 3 teams as my Favorite.... but should NOT be in 4th.... with all the other teams and looking at scores I have them in 8th or 9th.. and thats how it should be. I feel bad for Marchei and Hotarek and even D-M&G.... They were BOTH FLAWLESS....
 
I couldn't watch it live and only saw the performances and they were cut up so no k&c. Was Robin in the k&c with T/M? It would be kind of funny if T/M end up winning gold and S/M end up with bronze. Robin's revenge!

I will say though Aloina missed an oppertunity to enter Olympic immortality when she didn't do a Diva Barbara and melt Bruno down with her eyes of fury. Too bad
 
Szolkowy now sings a different tune. Talks about participating in the Team Event in Pairs and "saving energy". It helps to do the Team Event... and ANL agrees! :)

http://web.icenetwork.com/news/2018/02/14/266410858

Although this is interesting...

"Ten of the 22 pairs competing in the short program at Gangneung Ice Arena on Wednesday also competed shorts in the team event. Of those ten, just two scored higher in the team event, than in the individual contest."
 
[QUOTE="AngieNikodinovLove, post: 5288999, member: 57323"

S&M's other elements IN THE SHORT PROGRAM are NOT that Superior to everyone else that doubles jumps dont matter.[/QUOTE]
I disagree... Their program is superior to everyone else's except S/H. They got maximum scores for the twist and steps and and almost maximum for the spin. This is superior to almost all other pair...

In conclusion it is totally fair to be in fourth with that mistake with a 6 point margin to Sui/Han.
 
Err.. Robin fell TWICE at the two Olympics he skated at and refused to continue. What's unfair about that?!

Because he was a much better skater overall? I'm sure you're not reducing his career and qualities in those two falls?
I didn't say it was unfair they didn't won the title back then. And I'm sure, if S&M will win this one it is because they deserve it. At least I hope that will be the case. But it doesn't change the feeling of "regret" and "unfairness" of the fate, if you want.
 
My thoughts on some of the pairs:

Sui-Han: They are incredible. Although I was rooting for Savchenko & Massot, I would be very happy with them as the next Chinese Olympic Champions. I honestly prefer them to Shen & Zhao, even if that is a cardinal sin on this site.

Tarasova-Morozov: I am not a fan, but I will admit they skated super well, and they look very ready for this meet. I think a lot of the predictions they would come 4th along with the Russian situation has spurned them and they are jaded and hungry, and they are after gold. I still think they were overscored on PCS, their PCS should not be on par with S&H and S&M. Their TES was right but PCS is bloated. Atleast their SP is much better than their LP. If they get similar PCS for their LP, particularly if they dont skate perfectly which they have not done this year so far, I will toss my cookies.

Duhamel-Radford: Not a fan of them either but I would feel for them if they wound up 4th, although not nearly as much as I would if they didnt get an Oly Gold already. I get a feeling that is what they are destined for, they are only barely in 3rd since S&M made a big mistake, they are likely the lowest scoring of the top 4 if they go cleanish, and their program is the highest risk and the least likely to go clean with to boot. They are fighters though, and will fight for a medal should any of the other 3 top pairs have mistakes.

Savchenko-Massot: My heart breaks for them, I so badly wanted Aliona to finally get gold here. It still isnt impossible, but I am thinking silver might be their best case scenario now. I can see them making up 5-6 points on T&M who have struggled with their LP and consistency all season, but Sui & Han is much less likely. Even if S&H fall on the salchow (which they havent their last 2 competitions) they would need to be absolutely perfect to stand a shot now.

Yu-Zhang: Strong skate, and they are definitely a technically strong team, but their PCS are accurate. They clearly dont have the speed, quality, or lightness of any of the top pairs. I will admit this team has panned out far better than I anticipated but I still think the Chinese fed. is making a huge mistake pinning their future around a mid to old 30s year old Zhang who even at his peak despite his physical strength and technical abilities never had the presentation qualities or personality to win a major title, let alone now as a very old man in the sport. And I miss Yu-Jing.

Della Monica-Guarise: I thought they were underscored, I preferred them to their teammates by far. I give him huge credit for how far he has come since becoming a figure skater, I never figured it would be possible for them to reach this point, where they probably have now (finally) surpassed Della Monica-Kocon as a pair in ability. I hope they continue for 2022, I still think they have a lot more to give and even more improvements left.

Marchei-Hotarek: They did skate well but as mentioned I prefer their teamates to them. I totally disagree with some of the above posters who think Savchenko-Massot should be below them, I would honestly switch them with their teammates. They are technically strong but I dont find they have their own style, and they dont grab or excite me like some of the others, but a very good skate for them again. Combined with their great team event skate they are definitely ready for this meet.

James-Cipres: Good skate, it seems they are still fighting for jobs respect which they will probably never get. Underscored IMO but that is the norm for them. Although Kurt Browning on CBC made a good point that they never have quite found that one thing that makes them stand out from the rest, and I think that along with that the French doesnt care about politiking for pairs much hurts them.

Sequin-Bilodeau: Not their best but I am happy after all their injury troubles they were able to have a fairly good skate at the Olympics and to be here at all, and skate fairly well. I hope they have a great skate tommorow.

Peng-Jin: I feel awful for them. Wow I didnt anticipate them missing the free skate, as they have been coming along fairly nicely this year. I wonder if this might be it for them. The Chinese fed. isnt very forgiving, and clearly is not invested in them, and only in He Zhang anyway.
 
My thoughts on some of the pairs:
Sui-Han: They are incredible. Although I was rooting for Savchenko & Massot, I would be very happy with them as the next Chinese Olympic Champions. I honestly prefer them to Shen & Zhao, even if that is a cardinal sin on this site.

I prefer them to Shen&Zhao too. Although that wasn't always the case. They have improved and grown so much though, especially in the last 2 seasons.

Savchenko-Massot: My heart breaks for them, I so badly wanted Aliona to finally get gold here. It still isnt impossible, but I am thinking silver might be their best case scenario now. I can see them making up 5-6 points on T&M who have struggled with their LP and consistency all season, but Sui & Han is much less likely. Even if S&H fall on the salchow (which they havent their last 2 competitions) they would need to be absolutely perfect to stand a shot now.

They have a very good chance to put a lot of pressure on the other skaters. They are the first of the last group.

Della Monica-Guarise: I thought they were underscored, I preferred them to their teammates by far. I give him huge credit for how far he has come since becoming a figure skater, I never figured it would be possible for them to reach this point, where they probably have now (finally) surpassed Della Monica-Kocon as a pair in ability. I hope they continue for 2022, I still think they have a lot more to give and even more improvements left.

My thoughts as well.
 
Sorry, but T/M are the most "pair-like," with incredible unison and extraordinary skating skills, which you see in the step sequence, as well as exceptional extension and line. Having seen all of these top pairs at least once, they are also the fastest, beaten only by Stolbova/Klimov at times. Sui/Han are also fantastic and I would have them slightly higher on performance and interpretation.

Again, Aliona is great, but this is pairs skating. Most of their huge marks are due to the reputation she built WITH Robin.
 
My thoughts on some of the pairs:

Sui-Han: They are incredible. Although I was rooting for Savchenko & Massot, I would be very happy with them as the next Chinese Olympic Champions. I honestly prefer them to Shen & Zhao, even if that is a cardinal sin on this site.

Tarasova-Morozov: I am not a fan, but I will admit they skated super well, and they look very ready for this meet. I think a lot of the predictions they would come 4th along with the Russian situation has spurned them and they are jaded and hungry, and they are after gold. I still think they were overscored on PCS, their PCS should not be on par with S&H and S&M. Their TES was right but PCS is bloated. Atleast their SP is much better than their LP. If they get similar PCS for their LP, particularly if they dont skate perfectly which they have not done this year so far, I will toss my cookies.

Duhamel-Radford: Not a fan of them either but I would feel for them if they wound up 4th, although not nearly as much as I would if they didnt get an Oly Gold already. I get a feeling that is what they are destined for, they are only barely in 3rd since S&M made a big mistake, they are likely the lowest scoring of the top 4 if they go cleanish, and their program is the highest risk and the least likely to go clean with to boot. They are fighters though, and will fight for a medal should any of the other 3 top pairs have mistakes.

Savchenko-Massot: My heart breaks for them, I so badly wanted Aliona to finally get gold here. It still isnt impossible, but I am thinking silver might be their best case scenario now. I can see them making up 5-6 points on T&M who have struggled with their LP and consistency all season, but Sui & Han is much less likely. Even if S&H fall on the salchow (which they havent their last 2 competitions) they would need to be absolutely perfect to stand a shot now.

Yu-Zhang: Strong skate, and they are definitely a technically strong team, but their PCS are accurate. They clearly dont have the speed, quality, or lightness of any of the top pairs. I will admit this team has panned out far better than I anticipated but I still think the Chinese fed. is making a huge mistake pinning their future around a mid to old 30s year old Zhang who even at his peak despite his physical strength and technical abilities never had the presentation qualities or personality to win a major title, let alone now as a very old man in the sport. And I miss Yu-Jing.

Della Monica-Guarise: I thought they were underscored, I preferred them to their teammates by far. I give him huge credit for how far he has come since becoming a figure skater, I never figured it would be possible for them to reach this point, where they probably have now (finally) surpassed Della Monica-Kocon as a pair in ability. I hope they continue for 2022, I still think they have a lot more to give and even more improvements left.

Marchei-Hotarek: They did skate well but as mentioned I prefer their teamates to them. I totally disagree with some of the above posters who think Savchenko-Massot should be below them, I would honestly switch them with their teammates. They are technically strong but I dont find they have their own style, and they dont grab or excite me like some of the others, but a very good skate for them again. Combined with their great team event skate they are definitely ready for this meet.

James-Cipres: Good skate, it seems they are still fighting for jobs respect which they will probably never get. Underscored IMO but that is the norm for them. Although Kurt Browning on CBC made a good point that they never have quite found that one thing that makes them stand out from the rest, and I think that along with that the French doesnt care about politiking for pairs much hurts them.

Sequin-Bilodeau: Not their best but I am happy after all their injury troubles they were able to have a fairly good skate at the Olympics and to be here at all, and skate fairly well. I hope they have a great skate tommorow.

Peng-Jin: I feel awful for them. Wow I didnt anticipate them missing the free skate, as they have been coming along fairly nicely this year. I wonder if this might be it for them. The Chinese fed. isnt very forgiving, and clearly is not invested in them, and only in He Zhang anyway.

LOL, you don't think Marchei & Hotarek have their own STYLE??? I think of ANY pair I know their style the most........

Anywhoozle, I enjoyed your pairs read, I may not have agreed with all of it but I enjoyed!!!
 
Sorry, but T/M are the most "pair-like," with incredible unison and extraordinary skating skills, which you see in the step sequence, as well as exceptional extension and line. Having seen all of these top pairs at least once, they are also the fastest, beaten only by Stolbova/Klimov at times. Sui/Han are also fantastic and I would have them slightly higher on performance and interpretation.

Again, Aliona is great, but this is pairs skating. Most of their huge marks are due to the reputation she built WITH Robin.

I agree. However, they have the worse LP, and honestly I do not like that to be the winner.
As much as I loved V&T and I adored their SP in Sochi, I always felt kinda meh...with their win cause of their LP. Although, I was happy with their OGM and well deserved overall.
 
That was a hell of a competition. Bravo Pairs. They kick ass tonight! :kickass::respec:

I have a "confession" to make. I know is wrong and not fair to Aljona, but I kinda wish she doesn't win this. Half the reason is cause I like Sui&Han better. But half of it it's also cause it means Bruno wins this too, instead of Robin. And I do not find that "fair", at all, or deserving. It bothers me, somehow. :shuffle: I know it's petty but yep. Guilty. :slinkaway
I feel exactly the same.
 
Sorry, but T/M are the most "pair-like," with incredible unison and extraordinary skating skills, which you see in the step sequence, as well as exceptional extension and line. Having seen all of these top pairs at least once, they are also the fastest, beaten only by Stolbova/Klimov at times. Sui/Han are also fantastic and I would have them slightly higher on performance and interpretation.

Again, Aliona is great, but this is pairs skating. Most of their huge marks are due to the reputation she built WITH Robin.

Aliona has built a reputation based on her individual skills - .ie excellent skating skills, posture, jumps, line, extension flexibility and musicality.

T/M have excellent pair elements but they lack musicality, performance and his skating skills are "okay". The steps always look like "work" for him and he give zero personality. That's why they have the rep. for being the "beige" team.

Sui/Han have the skills, personality, choreography and performance.
 

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