Papadakis CIzeron #4 - Happiness Does Not Wait

[arakwafan2006]

Good for them. Poor TS, at first rumours about Moulin Rouge in FD, when PC were given Moonlight Sonata, now PC worked with Dean, when TS with whom? Sam? They are sold second time by there coaches, can't believe this happened again.

Who the hell is ts. Why don't people spell the teams name out once then use initials. Smh

 

[Karpenko]

Probably the same reason why people spell Arakawa as arakwa in their username.

Let the freak out games begin, and may the odds be ever in your favor. People are already spazzing that Papadakis & Cizeron are being favored because they are working with Dean. I mean because Tessa and Scott having years and years of experience over them isn't going to be a benefit in itself. this season is going to be a doozy. A real dilly of a crazy pickle.

 

[nimi]

Who the hell is ts. Why don't people spell the teams name out once then use initials. Smh

Preach!

I think in this case TS=V/M=Tessa&Scott.

But... yeah. Ice dance and pairs threads can get wayyy too confusing real quick because of the wayyyyy too many abbreviations.

 

[sap5]

So excited to hear that P/C worked with Dean on their SD! I knew they would plan to hit that SD so hard this season, and now there's no doubt. Can't wait to see the results.

 

[ballettmaus]

Good for them. Poor Virtue-Moir, at firts rumours about Moulin Rouge in FD, when PC were given Moonlight Sonata, now PC worked with Dean, when VM with whom? Sam? They are sold second time by there coaches, can't believe this happened again.

Skaters are free to work with whomever they want. They aren't the puppets of their coaches, they have opinions of their own, Dean isn't part of coaching team, he's an outside hire, so he wasn't assigned to anyone by anyone. If V/M wanted to work with Dean as well, all they'd have to do is say so, ask him if he's available and hire him.

(And who's Sam?)

Moonlight Sonata is still a rumor, isn't it?

 

[VGThuy]

Good for them. Poor Virtue-Moir, at firts rumours about Moulin Rouge in FD, when PC were given Moonlight Sonata, now PC worked with Dean, when VM with whom? Sam? They are sold second time by there coaches, can't believe this happened again.

Oh lord.

 

[whiteskates]

Hopefully Dean can help them work up some interest in the short dance. So far they have seemed to deliver a bit uninspired short dances - like it is something they do because they must and not because they really want to while their free dances have been fantastic.

 

[cocotaffy]

Skaters are free to work with whomever they want. They aren't the puppets of their coaches, they have opinions of their own, Dean isn't part of coaching team, he's an outside hire, so he wasn't assigned to anyone by anyone. If V/M wanted to work with Dean as well, all they'd have to do is say so, ask him if he's available and hire him.

(And who's Sam?)

Moonlight Sonata is still a rumor, isn't it?

Agreed 100%, especially with seasoned skaters like V/M. At this point of their career, they must know what they want to achieve and will probably nail it out of the park.
Sam must be Sam Chouinard, with whom lots of the Gadbois teams have been working. Here is his instagram, there are some videos of skaters like Hubbell and Donohue

 

[nimi]

re: their SDs being somewhat "unispired"... Personally I think their SD last season was one of the more inspired ones we saw, it just didn't play to their strengths the same way their recent FDs do. Free dance is more free and allows more freedom of movement -- I don't know if it's even possible to achieve similar free flowing effect in SD with all the stipulations and restrictions that are in place.

 

[cocotaffy]

I don't know if it's even possible to achieve similar free flowing effect in SD with all the stipulations and restrictions that are in place.

Depends on the type of rhythm. I think the closest to their natural flow was the waltz which they delivered brilliantly during the 2016 World in Boston IMO. They were zooming across the rink with great extensions and poise.

 

[nimi]

Depends on the type of rhythm. I think the closest to their natural flow was the waltz which they delivered brilliantly during the 2016 World in Boston IMO. They were zooming across the rink with great extensions and poise.

Yes, the waltz suited them well, and also there was no not touching step sequence that year.

 

[pani]

Skaters are free to work with whomever they want. They aren't the puppets of their coaches, they have opinions of their own, Dean isn't part of coaching team, he's an outside hire, so he wasn't assigned to anyone by anyone. If V/M wanted to work with Dean as well, all they'd have to do is say so, ask him if he's available and hire him.

(And who's Sam?)

Moonlight Sonata is still a rumor, isn't it?

Yes, but VM all the time talking how they didn't want to hurt there team and this was before and still the same.
Don't think it was PC idea to ask Dean for help, it was Didier, who wasn't happy with DL work last season. Maybe he saw SD and ask Dean to work with PC. And kudos to him for this.

 

[maya1985]

Their short dance was my favorite: it was not like any other.
I hope they will have more success with their Latin dance and compete with Canadians.
I want to see their programs, the wait is long

 

[MelDee]

First of all, hello to all of my fellow P/C ubers, my first time posting here

Yes, but VM all the time talking how they didn't want to hurt there team and this was before and still the same.
Don't think it was PC idea to ask Dean for help, it was Didier, who wasn't happy with DL work last season. Maybe he saw SD and ask Dean to work with PC. And kudos to him for this.

I don't think you've got them figured out on this one. I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was P/C's own idea to get Christopher Dean's imput. They've always wanted to branch out, and they've already confessed their worry about the Latin dances, so I wouldn't be surprised if it was their impulse to work with Dean. They've met him back in 2016 after all, so they could've been thinking about a possible collaboration for a while now.

I'm also pretty sure that Didier didn't see any "initial" version of their SD that he wasn't happy about. If you look at the timeline, Dean was with P/C in the first week of July (based on his and Jayne's Twitter account evidence), and Didier watched their programs presumably in the first week of August (Didier's Twitter - oh yeah, he raved about their new FD there). But that's just my reasoning as to why I don't think that Didier influenced the decision to work with Christopher Dean.

 

[maya1985]

Yes, but VM all the time talking how they didn't want to hurt there team and this was before and still the same.

I do not consider bringing an outside choreographer to the team as a betrayal ... or there are many traitors in figure skating and ice dance. (I thought they had worked with Jean Marc Généreux, I must be mistaken)

 

[VGThuy]

Yes, but VM all the time talking how they didn't want to hurt there team and this was before and still the same.
Don't think it was PC idea to ask Dean for help, it was Didier, who wasn't happy with DL work last season. Maybe he saw SD and ask Dean to work with PC. And kudos to him for this.

Even if this whole hypothetical was true, how does that in any way indicate that V/M are playing second fiddle to P/C in Montreal?

 

[Enchanted]

It was said in the IFS interview that P/C worked with Dean because FFSG advised them to work with him. They both seemed rather inspired about the experience.

Their free dance is choreographed by Dubreuil but it seems that P/C had quite a detailed idea of what they wanted to do. Apparently, their team approved their ideas.

 

[pani]

Even if this whole hypothetical was true, how does that in any way indicate that V/M are playing second fiddle to P/C in Montreal?

Because they will use Moulin Rouge for OG FD? It's like everything was clear when DW choose Shaherezade and VM Seasons?

 

[VGThuy]

Because they will use Moulin Rouge for OG FD? It's like everything was clear when DW choose Shaherezade and VM Seasons?

You haven't even seen the programs yet. What if Moulin Rouge ends up being a choice that totally inspired the team and V/M and something V/M wants to skate to? V/M have said that when they came back they wanted to be satisfied with their choices and their skating. Why are you so intent on making V/M out to be victims and coming up with all sorts of things to support that? Then backtracking to trying to find something else or another angle on your original reasoning if the original reason to support your conspiracy theory doesn't work out? It gets tiring.

And no, nothing was clear with Schez and Seasons. I remember this time four years ago, people were excited about Seasons because that seemed like a more inspired choice with lesser known Russian music for Sochi while Schez seemed like an uninspired warhorse. Then the programs came out and V/M struggled on their elements all GP series and thus were never able to feel totally comfortable with their FD. The program never gelled and it was being re-worked all season. The idea was there, but the execution wasn't the best.

 

[MelDee]

Because they will use Moulin Rouge for OG FD? It's like everything was clear when DW choose Shaherezade and VM Seasons?

Both Moulin Rouge for V/M and Moolight Sonata for P/C are just unsubstantiated speculations. Neither has been confirmed.

 

[pani]

It was said in the IFS interview that P/C worked with Dean because FFSG advised them to work with him. They both seemed rather inspired about the experience.

Their free dance is choreographed by Dubreuil but it seems that P/C had quite a detailed idea of what they wanted to do. Apparently, their team approved their ideas.

So i was right.

 

[maya1985]

Because they will use Moulin Rouge for OG FD?

Since when? I thought it was a rumor

 

[nimi]

I thought it was a rumor

Well, rumors do go well together with conspiracy theories...

 

[VGThuy]

So i was right.

Possibly right about Didier not being pleased with Marie-France and Patrice and Romain's work with P/C and suggesting/advising that they use Dean. I still don't know what that has to do with Marie-France, Patrice, and/or Romain prioritizing P/C over V/M considering it was not them who suggested P/C go with Dean.

 

[pani]

Possibly right about Didier not being pleased with Marie-France and Patrice and Romain's work with P/C and suggesting/advising that they use Dean. I still don't know what that has to do with Marie-France, Patrice, and/or Romain prioritizing P/C over V/M considering it was not them who suggested P/C go with Dean.

To use for OG music like Moulin Rouge against Moonlight Sonata didn't show prioritizing P/C over V/M?
VM spended time on ice with junior teams, spanish team and 10 others, when PC have there own space. PC used Dean for SD, when VM use Sam, who isn't latin dancer at all.

 

[Lutzlvr]

Have they put out any clips of their programs yet? Just excited and impatiently waiting the season to start

 

[Nmsis]

Following Helsinki, Papadakis / Cizeron gave interviews and talked about the direction they wanted to take with their next SD.
With InsideSkating
With RockerSkating

I’m not a big fan of Latin for skating. I love Latin dances, I love watching Latin dances, on the floor. But on the ice… [...]
A lot of dances are about the bounces on the floor, a lot of dances use the floor so much!...
How can you translate that on the ice, when you glide? [...]
We haven’t figured out yet a way to do that, but I think that’s the next step: take the short dance to ice dance, and not just dancing on the ice. I think that’s the challenge for next year.

http://www.rockerskating.com/news/2...eir-off-season-and-their-first-olympic-season

It’s very hard to reproduce Latin dances on the ice, because the dynamics of the dance is very different from the dynamics of skating. For example, we can’t roll our hips while gliding full speed on one foot. And it's also tricky because Latin dances on the floor aren’t usually done in closed holds, and closed holds are much more required in ice dance, especially in the short dance. We want to figure out which movements from Latin dance we can translate on the ice and how we can do it effectively.

For me, it was obvious that if they were specifically working on how to translate the character of the SD into skating and ice dance STEPS, they would go the "Dean way" (not mandatorily with Christopher Dean but with a heavy dose of inspiration).

By July 6th and the photo with Dean, the dots were just needed to be connected.

Gailhaguet has appointments with all the french skaters every year around April-June to talk about their plans and to let them know how much the fed's wallet is open for them. With what they specifically wanted to do and the perspective of an OGM, Gailhaguet connected the dots and opened the fed's wallet to get the biggest possible name. But I wouldn't bet P/C were completly surprised by "Gailhaguet's idea".

 

[ballettmaus]

Don't think it was PC idea to ask Dean for help, it was Didier, who wasn't happy with DL work last season. Maybe he saw SD and ask Dean to work with PC. And kudos to him for this.

If it was Didier, then that was the French Federation. That has nothing to do with the coaching team either and it would still leave V/M free to hire Dean as well.

To use for OG music like Moulin Rouge against Moonlight Sonata didn't show prioritizing P/C over V/M?

Not every coach is like Zoueva and chooses the music for their students. I know that Gwendal Peizerat was always actively involved in the process and, if memory serves, he was the one plowing through CDs, listening for something they could use. More often than not, I've heard that music is chosen together.

 

[pani]

If it was Didier, then that was the French Federation. That has nothing to do with the coaching team either and it would still leave V/M free to hire Dean as well.




Not every coach is like Zoueva and chooses the music for their students. I know that Gwendal Peizerat was always actively involved in the process and, if memory serves, he was the one plowing through CDs, listening for something they could use. More often than not, I've heard that music is chosen together.

VM didn't choose Latch, it was Marie, she choose Sorry for them. They didn't want Prince, but it was coaches choice.
She is smart woman. She play last season like VM got better SD and PC FD. And this season she will play like she need - for PC gold at OG and for VM chance to get medal at team events. Sad, but look like SC like this and support this idea.

 

[Lutzlvr]

Prince turned out to be the best SD of the season