Interview with Nina Mozer

[nlloyd]

Russian women historically have a very different reputation to Western women, so sexism was never in fact such a big issue in Russia because Russian women have always been looked at as work horses and the men were mostly useless/drunk.

Another way to gauge sexism is to look at women who hold public office. What is the ratio of women to men in the Russian parliament? Is this statistic from Wikipedia, admittedly uncited, correct of the 1990s and is it still the case in 2016: "Prior to the 1995 elections, women held about 10 percent of the seats in parliament: fifty-seven of 450 seats in the State Duma and nine of 178 seats in the upper house of parliament, the Federation Council"?

Just because Russian women have a reputation as "work horses" does not preclude sexism. After all, there are many patriarchal cultures worldwide where the work has fallen to women while positions of influence have been dominated by men. This is true of traditional African culture, for example, where women did most of the agricultural work, but had little say in formal governance structures. Sexism comes in many forms. Even the glorification of women ("a Russian woman can stop a galloping horse and enter a burning hut") can be, and often is, sexist. It is similar to the romanticization and valorization of the "east" that Edwards Said described as "orientalism." Glorifying any group in unqualified terms is sexist/racist and often facilitates their oppression in other arenas.

 

[Coquelicot14]

If we look at managerial positions however, in Russia, there are twice as many women in Russian companies in these head positions as in the US, for example. It is 43%!
In the US it is 22% and in Western European countries such as Germany and Denmark it is only 14%.
Sure, some countries abroad may or may not have more positions in the government, but that only represents a small sector compared with the companies in the country overall.

Here's the link to a full article with reference to international reports circa 2014:
http://www.interfax.ru/business/381479

Oh yeah, BTW, if someone wants to glorify me as a part of the group, feel free to do so. I for one am happy to be complimented as a Russian woman.

Why are some people trying to portray us as defenceless or oppressed. That is a bit sexist isn't it? There is always room for improvement but don't worry we can take care of ourselves. ;-)

 

[Coquelicot14]

At least Gorbachev can live his life with dignity (being a very well-respected person abroad as you know) without having to fear prison, extradition or assassination because he stole all of Russia's budget and transferred it abroad. He is an iconic figure in Germany.

Yeah, he was the face of Louis Vuitton at some point. LOL, how fitting.
He's probably the most hated living politician in Russia (and probably in some former republics too).

 

[lala]

Yeah, he was the face of Louis Vuitton at some point. LOL, how fitting.
He's probably the most hated living politician in Russia (and probably in some former republics too).

Why? The cold war finished because of his policy. The "perestroika" changed not only the Societ Union but the whole the world...

Is he hated because he ruined the Soviet Union?

 

[Coquelicot14]

Why? The cold war finished because of his policy. The "perestroika" changed not only the Societ Union but the whole the world...

I don't want to get too much into it, since we are technically supposed to be talking figure skating, but in a nutshell, his lack of planning, foresight and irresponsibility led to the fall of industry and the horror the 1990s were for most people in the country. It's a miracle the country survived that. But like they say, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger!

Anyway back to FS.

 

[Vash01]

If we look at managerial positions however, in Russia, there are twice as many women in Russian companies in these head positions as in the US, for example. It is 43%!
In the US it is 22% and in Western European countries such as Germany and Denmark it is only 14%.
Sure, some countries abroad may or may not have more positions in the government, but that only represents a small sector compared with the companies in the country overall.

Here's the link to a full article with reference to international reports circa 2014:
http://www.interfax.ru/business/381479

Oh yeah, BTW, if someone wants to glorify me as a part of the group, feel free to do so. I for one am happy to be complimented as a Russian woman.

Why are some people trying to portray us as defenceless or oppressed. That is a bit sexist isn't it? There is always room for improvement but don't worry we can take care of ourselves. ;-)

That's true of women in many other countries too. Asian women in particular are seen as uneducated, oppressed, just homemakers, etc. by many in the west, while they too hold high positions in private and government sectors. Americans in general are not well informed about the rest of world. They are brain washed to believe they are superior to everyone in every respect.

 

[lala]

his lack of panning, foresight and irresponsibility led to the fall of industry and the horror the 1990s were for most people in the country. It's a miracle the country survived that.

This happened almost in every country of the eastern block. That was a hard era, no one knew what are the next steps in the economy and in politics. Just every country wanted to survive.

 

[nlloyd]

Why are some people trying to portray us as defenceless or oppressed. That is a bit sexist isn't it? There is always room for improvement but don't worry we can take care of ourselves. ;-)

You have conveniently shifted the focus of my argument and added a dose of hyperbole for good measure. I am not arguing that Russian women are "defenceless" or more "oppressed" more most. Rather, Xela argued that sexism did not exist in Russia as evidenced by the fact that women were viewed as work horses and men as useless/drunks. I was challenging her conflation of "workhorse" with liberation and pointing out that women being "workhorses" and sexism can exist quite happily; the former does not invalidate the latter. There is also, of course, the issue of rhetoric vs. reality; these stereotypes are not necessarily reflective of reality as posters upthread have noted about Russian men.

I would argue this point as much for the west as Russia. Indeed, the point could be made that the gains western women have made in public life, and the concomitant failure of societies to find new solutions to childcare, household work etc., have left many western women saddled with both their former responsibilities as homemakers and new responsibilities as breadwinners. They are now "workhorses" themselves.

I am thus not making a case for Russian women being more oppressed than most, but rather arguing against the absurd notion that Russia is non-sexist. The sexism there is different and the solutions will be different too, but to be considered a "workhorse" in relation to "useless" men, is hardly non-sexist.

 

[nlloyd]

That's true of women in many other countries too. Asian women in particular are seen as uneducated, oppressed, just homemakers, etc. by many in the west, while they too hold high positions in private and government sectors. Americans in general are not well informed about the rest of world. They are brain washed to believe they are superior to everyone in every respect.

Not sure of whether you are referring to me here, but I am neither brainwashed and nor, as a Canadian, have I ever bought into that piece of nationalism you describe. I would, however, say that it is not uncommon on this board for some American posters to make the assumption that all posters are American or to refer to cultural events etc. as if everyone lived in America. That is part of the problem you describe, in my opinion.

 

[snoopy]

Anytime anyone says anything perceived as ignorant on this board, someone else usually posts an assumption that they must be an American.

 

[Xela M]

If we look at managerial positions however, in Russia, there are twice as many women in Russian companies in these head positions as in the US, for example. It is 43%!
In the US it is 22% and in Western European countries such as Germany and Denmark it is only 14%.
Sure, some countries abroad may or may not have more positions in the government, but that only represents a small sector compared with the companies in the country overall.

Here's the link to a full article with reference to international reports circa 2014:
http://www.interfax.ru/business/381479

Oh yeah, BTW, if someone wants to glorify me as a part of the group, feel free to do so. I for one am happy to be complimented as a Russian woman.

Why are some people trying to portray us as defenceless or oppressed. That is a bit sexist isn't it? There is always room for improvement but don't worry we can take care of ourselves. ;-)

This. Russian women have never been defenseless or weak and have never been considered such. The one benefit of the Soviet system was complete equality of the sexes and no woman was told to stay at home (that's a modern phenomenon in Russia). Everything was done to make sure women worked.

P.S. At least we agree on something even if our views on politics are polar opposites

 

[Xela M]

Anytime anyone says anything perceived as ignorant on this board, someone else usually posts an assumption that they must be an American.

I love the US, but having been to the US last year I was absolutely shocked by how little Americans know about Europe

 

[IceAlisa]

I love the US, but having been to the US last year I was absolutely shocked by how little Americans know about Europe

I am an American...Americans are 140M strong, isn't it presumptuous to stereotype this many people?

There are uneducated people everywhere.

 

[Xela M]

I am an American...Americans are 140M strong, isn't it presumptuous to stereotype this many people?

There are uneducated people everywhere.

Yes, I work with many highly educated Americans who regularly travel the world and are very well informed, however just speaking to random people in hotels/bars/taxis/shops etc... Some people for example didn't know that Europe had Euros or that we don't have free gun trade or the difference between Paris and London. Countless examples which we found very amusing and sometimes unbelievable

 

[Jammers]

Why? The cold war finished because of his policy. The "perestroika" changed not only the Societ Union but the whole the world...

Is he hated because he ruined the Soviet Union?

Not sure how he ruined the Soviet Union. The communist oppression is what ruin the USSR if anything Gorbachev tried to bring the them into the 20th century and the hardliners hated him for it of which i'm sure Putin was on of them. To be honest the USSR was done by the 1970's because of their backwards policies and in the end all they had left was their military and that wasn't enough to save them.

 

[julieann]

I am an American...Americans are 140M strong, isn't it presumptuous to stereotype this many people?

...319M

Yes, I work with many highly educated Americans who regularly travel the world and are very well informed, however just speaking to random people in hotels/bars/taxis/shops etc... Some people for example didn't know that Europe had Euros or that we don't have free gun trade or the difference between Paris and London. Countless examples which we found very amusing and sometimes unbelievable

You're talking to the wrong people. Ignorance of other countries can be found all over the world's population.

 

[Coquelicot14]

Yes, I work with many highly educated Americans who regularly travel the world and are very well informed, however just speaking to random people in hotels/bars/taxis/shops etc... Some people for example didn't know that Europe had Euros or that we don't have free gun trade or the difference between Paris and London. Countless examples which we found very amusing and sometimes unbelievable

Same experience here. But the difference among them is staggering. Lots of good educated people, but then again, I had someone who was supposed to be a 5th grade teacher ask me if we had TVs in Russia.
I was tempted to tell her, no we feed bears in the backyard for fun instead...
It's not my only experience, but it stuck with me.

 

[Coquelicot14]

Not sure how he ruined the Soviet Union. The communist oppression is what ruin the USSR if anything Gorbachev tried to bring the them into the 20th century and the hardliners hated him for it of which i'm sure Putin was on of them. To be honest the USSR was done by the 1970's because of their backwards policies and in the end all they had left was their military and that wasn't enough to save them.

No he didn't ruin USSR, he mismanaged to the point where it fell apart and made millions miserable in the process. We needed a gradual change, like China, not the kind of crap he pulled.
And I believe millions that had to live through that and know the situation from within, know what they hate him for. It's 10 years of people's lives they will never get back...

Why are we talking politics?

Look at it from an Figure Skating stand point, the horrible state of rinks and facilities that were in the 90s, the sport almost died out from the lack of funding and care. This sport flourished in the USSR! Only now is it finally getting back. Coaches, skaters, came back.. only in the past 8-9 years has the government funding and support returned. Yes, it's run differently, it adapted, but no thanks to Gorbi.

 

[Vash01]

I love the US, but having been to the US last year I was absolutely shocked by how little Americans know about Europe

I am an American...Americans are 140M strong, isn't it presumptuous to stereotype this many people?

There are uneducated people everywhere.

Yes, but the ignorance in a technologically advanced country like the USA is shocking, and I am an American. I am not talking of people who live in California or New York; they are usually well informed. I have lived in places like Kansas, Texas, and a few other states where many had never traveled outside their state. They did have TVs and access to information, but they chose not be informed and not question whatever was being fed to them.

 

[Vash01]

...319M



You're talking to the wrong people. Ignorance of other countries can be found all over the world's population.

In general, I have found that Europeans are much better informed of the world outside their own world than Americans are. I know this is a gross generalization but the level of ignorance in the USA is shocking at times. Of course there are some that are extremely well informed, but we are not cherry picking here.

 

[Vash01]

No he didn't ruin USSR, he mismanaged to the point where it fell apart and made millions miserable in the process. We needed a gradual change, like China, not the kind of crap he pulled.
And I believe millions that had to live through that and know the situation from within, know what they hate him for. It's 10 years of people's lives they will never get back...

Why are we talking politics?

Look at it from an Figure Skating stand point, the horrible state of rinks and facilities that were in the 90s, the sport almost died out from the lack of funding and care. This sport flourished in the USSR! Only now is it finally getting back. Coaches, skaters, came back.. only in the past 8-9 years has the government funding and support returned. Yes, it's run differently, it adapted, but no thanks to Gorbi.

I thought Gorbachev wanted to make USSR more like the west, but the results were disastrous. I will need to reread my books on Russian history because I don't remember very well what he did wrong.

With the fall of the USSR the skaters lost all the privileges they had. It must have been very difficult. I remember watching a piece on Tamara Moskvina. She was sad at the 1992 Olympics because her country didn't exist the way it did in the past, but she found ways to get support for her skaters. Many Russian coaches left Russia for the west, but it seems some have returned and the conditions for skaters are better. Still, we read things like Liza Tuk, for example, has only limited ice time and she gets more practice when she goes to competitions. So the conditions for skaters are nowhere close to what those in the USSR had. It's amazing that Russian skaters are still doing so well on the world stage.

 

[IceAlisa]

In general, I have found that Europeans are much better informed of the world outside their own world than Americans are. I know this is a gross generalization but the level of ignorance in the USA is shocking at times.

This IS a gross generalization, I will give you that.

 

[IceAlisa]

...319M



You're talking to the wrong people. Ignorance of other countries can be found all over the world's population.

Thanks for the correction. And yes, people think it makes them worldly to kiss up to the Europeans. It doesn't.

 

[VGThuy]

Geographic and historical isolation is probably a big reason why there's a perception that many Americans don't know much about Europe. Heck, many Americans don't know much about Canada, our biggest trading partner. People care about things that affect them directly or that they're exposed to and having that exposure repeated. More Europeans know about each other because many European countries' histories are so intertwined (and there's a long history) and there's easy access to those countries, thus repeated exposure. I wonder how much people in Japan, China, etc., who are educated but not well-traveled, know about Europe. Maybe older people, formally educated or not, in countries that were colonized by European nations in the 20th century know more about that particular country than educated Americans do. I also wonder what many Europeans know about East Asia, Southeast Asia, or heck, North and Central America (including the U.S.). I also wonder what I mean by Europeans some times as we all know aren't really a monolithic blob. I'm just going by all the generalizations going on in this thread.

 

[julieann]

In general, I have found that Europeans are much better informed of the world outside their own world than Americans are. I know this is a gross generalization but the level of ignorance in the USA is shocking at times. Of course there are some that are extremely well informed, but we are not cherry picking here.

Doing business all over Europe for a decade, I see just as many ignorant people in Europe as I do in the states....if you choose to look. The level of ignorance everywhere can be shocking.

 

[Coquelicot14]

I don't think this is just a matter of ignorance. No one can know everything, nor should they be expected to. However, what gives an impression of a person's worldliness is tactfullness. Nowadays there is no excuse for asking ignorant questions, which are often insults in disguise. (See TV question I mentioned earlier.) Google is your friend. Look it up or find a way to ask in such a way that would not piss the person off.
I think the problem is like mentioned earlier, people that don't have an opportunity to travel (and that's harder and more expensive than in Europe) buy into media and don't question what is being fed to them. There is more of that in the US because of Hollywood. But Hollywood world is made up, it's not the real deal, but how many actually remember that?

 

[VGThuy]

And who told you it's more prevalent in the U.S.? Propaganda has been shown to be successful every where, and conspiracy theorists tend to be everywhere, who think everything is propaganda.

 

[Xela M]

No he didn't ruin USSR, he mismanaged to the point where it fell apart and made millions miserable in the process. We needed a gradual change, like China, not the kind of crap he pulled.
And I believe millions that had to live through that and know the situation from within, know what they hate him for. It's 10 years of people's lives they will never get back...

Why are we talking politics?

Look at it from an Figure Skating stand point, the horrible state of rinks and facilities that were in the 90s, the sport almost died out from the lack of funding and care. This sport flourished in the USSR! Only now is it finally getting back. Coaches, skaters, came back.. only in the past 8-9 years has the government funding and support returned. Yes, it's run differently, it adapted, but no thanks to Gorbi.

Lol!!!! Are you conveniently forgetting Boris Yeltsin and the fact that he drank the country away whilst his daughter gifted it to Berezovsky & Co?

 

[Xela M]

Not sure how he ruined the Soviet Union. The communist oppression is what ruin the USSR if anything Gorbachev tried to bring the them into the 20th century and the hardliners hated him for it of which i'm sure Putin was on of them. To be honest the USSR was done by the 1970's because of their backwards policies and in the end all they had left was their military and that wasn't enough to save them.

Please stop talking sense

Same experience here. But the difference among them is staggering. Lots of good educated people, but then again, I had someone who was supposed to be a 5th grade teacher ask me if we had TVs in Russia.
I was tempted to tell her, no we feed bears in the backyard for fun instead...
It's not my only experience, but it stuck with me.

We were askd if there were McDonalds in Germany

 

[Japanfan]

I love the US, but having been to the US last year I was absolutely shocked by how little Americans know about Europe

I've been long appalled by how little Americans know about Canada - I vacation there a lot, so talk to a lot of Americans.

Most don't even know the names of our three major cities, nor the names of any of the provinces.

So I was surprised when in Arizona a few months ago, and several Americans I spoke with and told that I was Canadian commented on the Fort McMurray wildfires. Of course, none remembered the name of the town or the province - but those wildfires put Canada on the map in the U.S.