TAHbKA
Cats and garlic lover
- Messages
- 21,909
Elena Vaytsekhovskaya's interview with Marina Zueva `The mood shouldn't influence the work' for rsport.ria.ru
EV: Marina, many years ago telling me about Shibutani you said a siblings team is a peculiar combination for the ice dance. First of all because the range is narrower. What does it mean working with such a team - a cross you carry, a constant coaching challenge or is it all about Maya and Alex coming from a well off family and can afford paying as many specialists as needed, yourself included?
MZ: Money were never a deciding factor for me. Maya and Alex do pay for their preparations, but then everyone in the USA do. For me, as a coach, the important thing is how badly people want to skate. It's the most important for us. Of course each skater has his own goal and their own peak, while I try to help them reaching that peak. So in a way yes, it's a challenge.
EV: And yet it's obvious Maya and Alex do not have such a flow as Tessa Virtue/Scott Moir do.
MZ: True.
EV: They also don't have the emotional charisma of Davis/White
MZ: Agree on that as well.
EV: Yet it's that pair who time after time destroys everyone's idea of their limit. Every time their limit is moved and the peak set higher. How do you do that?
MZ: As you rightly mentioned every athlete has a special talent. In Maya and Alex' case it's an extreme ability to work and digest the information. Hence I get as many specialists as possible to work with them and allow them to improve. There is another issue. While I was the one to offer all the ideas for Tessa/Scott and Meryl/Charlie, the Shibs always know exactly what they want. This differs them from all my previous pupils. As a coach it's a big help when the skaters have the ideas and can explain them.
EV: I know this season Lambiel and Tchernyshev worked with you skaters.
MZ: Not only. Besides the specialists who work in our school I invite various American dancers who work in `Dancing with the Stars'.
EV: The Russian example of Ilya Averbukh who spent years as a choreographer in the TV ice show proves the moves that work fine on the TV do not necessarily translate well into figure skating.
MZ: Am not talking about the programmes, but about the work that dives the athlete a new moving information. That was the reason Alex and Maya went to Lambiel after the Worlds in Helsinki and came back, how should I put it, more dancing free, completely different. Though the defining moment in their moving progress was the Olympic 2014 season when we were working on `Michael Jackson' programme. I invited the specialists who danced with Jackson in his `Thriller'. Maya and Alex worked for a whole year with them.
EV: Did you ever encounter a situation when you want to get a specialist but he is absolutely not available?
MZ: I haven't met one. At least all that we ever needed was possible to get. People usually tend to be helpful even when it's not about working with the well known athletes. Guess everyone is curious to try out in a different field. I myself always loved working with the synchronized swimming when a couple of years ago I was invited to work with the USA team. The first time it happened when we were working on the Indian dance with Meryl and Charlie: one of the syncro ladies saw it and was interested in my athlete's arms work. This year again I received an offer to work with the syncro team and agreed. It's interesting. Besides, the sport moved to such a level now you can't achieve anything alone. The higher level the skaters are the more professionals take part in the process. You don't expect one professor to run a whole university, right?
EV: When Virtue/Moir were skating in your academy you were always making sure to make their range wider, make them look different every season. Now Tessa and Scott's rivals are Papadakis/Cizeron, who have been skating in the same style for 3 years. And remain on the top. Do you have an explanation why that style never gets old for the audience nor the judged?
MZ: What Gabi and Guillaume show is not an individual style of a given pair. Those skaters created a new style in figure skating. Thanks to them after a whole era of the expressive programmes we now have that calm modern. I find it very interesting. I created to programmes for Meryl and Charlie in that style.
EV: Do they still skate a lot in the shows?
MZ: Yes. Of course they no longer skate the competitive programmes, but that what attracts me as a choreographer : now it's possible to experiment so much more. With the styles as well. Meryl and Charlie had a fast and and emotional inner move: the skating that was sort of a flight. They still skate that way, but the programmes started looking differently.
EV: Less emotional?
MZ: I wouldn't say so. I would talk about the emotions that go into the body. It seems the emotions are toned down, but they are burning inside. It's exactly what Papadakis/Cizeron do now.
EV: Admit it, as a coach you are always looking for a way to beat the French.
MZ: Of course I do. But it's not a secret: every success is in development. The more you develop the athlete the more they are able to show. Hence I develop Maya and Alex as much as I can so they would not stop.
EV: Between the French and the Canadians - who are you rooting for.
MZ: I like them both.
EV: Let me not believe you. After all when talking about Tessa and Scott the most of what they do was done by you and Igor Spilband. Your heart probably misses a beat when they go on the ice.
MZ: Of course.
EV: How can you look from the side and not root for them
MZ: I do, but `liking' is a different matter. I like the Canadians, I like the French and I like Maya and Alex: they have what none of the other teams have. Yet I will never attempt to judge which team was the best: let the judges do that.
EV: Which is harder: working with one great team when there is no competition within the group or have an equal competitors?
MZ: There was always a competition in my group, perhaps not always on the highest level. We have quite a few teams who participated the Europeans, Worlds and qualified for the Olympics. Yet each has their own goal and, as I mentioned, the `peak'. They all share the ice, but they have a different goal.
EV: That's not what I meant. Not long ago it was written in the papers Dubreuil and Lauzon who coach both the French and the Canadian duos had to move them to a different rinks - the competition was too high. More or less at the same time Brian Orser admitted he had to work on the different rinks with Hanyu and Fernandez for the same reason. You and Igor Spilband while working together always stressed the wonderful relationships between the top teams. Yet, at the same time, as far as I know it happened they used different flights attending the same competitions.
MZ: That's a different story. Tessa/Scott and Meryl/Charlie indeed were flying on separate flights, but that was only because one had their tickets booked by the Canadian Fed and the others by the USA. All 4 skated on the same ice at the same time.
EV: Are you saying there was no crazy competition in your group at all?
MZ: I never had anything crazy in my group in general. Everyone are very organized and aiming for their goals. Of course there is a human factor. But I try to do everything within my power to focus each skater on their goal. I give the directions how to reach it. The rest is up to them and on how much information they can digest. That's how the sport works: one takes what you give them and the other doesn't.
EV: That is quite clear. Yet you have to agree the reality does not necessarily goes hand in hand with the theory. After losing the Olympics when Tessa was interviewed by the Canadian press it was obvious how bitter she was with the whole world and with you as a coach. Of course it was quite emotional after the Games. But you, as a coach, were probably hurt that the skaters who worked with you and took gold in Vancouver and silver in Sochi when decided to come back chose a different group?
MZ: No, none. We are still in a great terms. Not so long ago Tessa and Scott told me `Marina, we would never become who we are now if it wasn't for the work with you'.
EV: Because of a personal reasons Meryl should be much closer to you than the other pupils
MZ: She is now. Guess she will be even more so soon.
EV: Are you jealous she is going to take your only son away?
MZ: First of all she is not taking him away. Just that our family will expand.
EV: Did you ever talk to Meryl and Charlie about a comeback?
MZ: Why should I?
EV: At least because Tessa and Scott did. Have you ever thought that Meryl and Charlie could come back as well and compete on the highest level? As a coach, wouldn't you be interested?
MZ: I would. But I think it should come from the skaters and not from the coach. I had that experience with Gordeeva/Grinkov when they came to me a year before the Olympics in Lillehammer and said `Marina, we want to come back'. So they did and won another Olympics. But it was entirely their idea - I didn't try to influence their decision not even slightly. You can't do that to the athlete. All my coaching experience shows that if their mind is set on something different it just won't work, no matter how hard you try.
EV: Hence you are trying not to press on Patrick with his quads?
MZ: Patrick realizes very well what is going on: he saw the junior world champion Vincent Zhou who is also training in our academy comes quite often to work on this presentation and he has all the quad jumps. And he is only 16. But first, all the quad jumps need to be landed and even the most talented ones can sometimes miss them. The Japanese Shoma Uno, for example, landed 5 quads in the middle of September in Lobardia Trophy in Italy, but 3 weeks later in Japan Open was able to land only 2 and it was obvious it's too hard. It's hard for everyone now. All the specialists are trying to work on the quads which is not easy: you have to work on the jumps a lot yet keep the shape. Patrick is first of all a performer and not a jumper. He lives the move on the ice and guess that's why he came back. Watching him skating is a happiness for a coach. What we'll do about the quads depends on several factors. Mainly the timing and the goal.
EV: And the skater's mood?
MZ: No. If we are talking about the professional sports here the mood should not influence the work at all.
EV: Marina, many years ago telling me about Shibutani you said a siblings team is a peculiar combination for the ice dance. First of all because the range is narrower. What does it mean working with such a team - a cross you carry, a constant coaching challenge or is it all about Maya and Alex coming from a well off family and can afford paying as many specialists as needed, yourself included?
MZ: Money were never a deciding factor for me. Maya and Alex do pay for their preparations, but then everyone in the USA do. For me, as a coach, the important thing is how badly people want to skate. It's the most important for us. Of course each skater has his own goal and their own peak, while I try to help them reaching that peak. So in a way yes, it's a challenge.
EV: And yet it's obvious Maya and Alex do not have such a flow as Tessa Virtue/Scott Moir do.
MZ: True.
EV: They also don't have the emotional charisma of Davis/White
MZ: Agree on that as well.
EV: Yet it's that pair who time after time destroys everyone's idea of their limit. Every time their limit is moved and the peak set higher. How do you do that?
MZ: As you rightly mentioned every athlete has a special talent. In Maya and Alex' case it's an extreme ability to work and digest the information. Hence I get as many specialists as possible to work with them and allow them to improve. There is another issue. While I was the one to offer all the ideas for Tessa/Scott and Meryl/Charlie, the Shibs always know exactly what they want. This differs them from all my previous pupils. As a coach it's a big help when the skaters have the ideas and can explain them.
EV: I know this season Lambiel and Tchernyshev worked with you skaters.
MZ: Not only. Besides the specialists who work in our school I invite various American dancers who work in `Dancing with the Stars'.
EV: The Russian example of Ilya Averbukh who spent years as a choreographer in the TV ice show proves the moves that work fine on the TV do not necessarily translate well into figure skating.
MZ: Am not talking about the programmes, but about the work that dives the athlete a new moving information. That was the reason Alex and Maya went to Lambiel after the Worlds in Helsinki and came back, how should I put it, more dancing free, completely different. Though the defining moment in their moving progress was the Olympic 2014 season when we were working on `Michael Jackson' programme. I invited the specialists who danced with Jackson in his `Thriller'. Maya and Alex worked for a whole year with them.
EV: Did you ever encounter a situation when you want to get a specialist but he is absolutely not available?
MZ: I haven't met one. At least all that we ever needed was possible to get. People usually tend to be helpful even when it's not about working with the well known athletes. Guess everyone is curious to try out in a different field. I myself always loved working with the synchronized swimming when a couple of years ago I was invited to work with the USA team. The first time it happened when we were working on the Indian dance with Meryl and Charlie: one of the syncro ladies saw it and was interested in my athlete's arms work. This year again I received an offer to work with the syncro team and agreed. It's interesting. Besides, the sport moved to such a level now you can't achieve anything alone. The higher level the skaters are the more professionals take part in the process. You don't expect one professor to run a whole university, right?
EV: When Virtue/Moir were skating in your academy you were always making sure to make their range wider, make them look different every season. Now Tessa and Scott's rivals are Papadakis/Cizeron, who have been skating in the same style for 3 years. And remain on the top. Do you have an explanation why that style never gets old for the audience nor the judged?
MZ: What Gabi and Guillaume show is not an individual style of a given pair. Those skaters created a new style in figure skating. Thanks to them after a whole era of the expressive programmes we now have that calm modern. I find it very interesting. I created to programmes for Meryl and Charlie in that style.
EV: Do they still skate a lot in the shows?
MZ: Yes. Of course they no longer skate the competitive programmes, but that what attracts me as a choreographer : now it's possible to experiment so much more. With the styles as well. Meryl and Charlie had a fast and and emotional inner move: the skating that was sort of a flight. They still skate that way, but the programmes started looking differently.
EV: Less emotional?
MZ: I wouldn't say so. I would talk about the emotions that go into the body. It seems the emotions are toned down, but they are burning inside. It's exactly what Papadakis/Cizeron do now.
EV: Admit it, as a coach you are always looking for a way to beat the French.
MZ: Of course I do. But it's not a secret: every success is in development. The more you develop the athlete the more they are able to show. Hence I develop Maya and Alex as much as I can so they would not stop.
EV: Between the French and the Canadians - who are you rooting for.
MZ: I like them both.
EV: Let me not believe you. After all when talking about Tessa and Scott the most of what they do was done by you and Igor Spilband. Your heart probably misses a beat when they go on the ice.
MZ: Of course.
EV: How can you look from the side and not root for them
MZ: I do, but `liking' is a different matter. I like the Canadians, I like the French and I like Maya and Alex: they have what none of the other teams have. Yet I will never attempt to judge which team was the best: let the judges do that.
EV: Which is harder: working with one great team when there is no competition within the group or have an equal competitors?
MZ: There was always a competition in my group, perhaps not always on the highest level. We have quite a few teams who participated the Europeans, Worlds and qualified for the Olympics. Yet each has their own goal and, as I mentioned, the `peak'. They all share the ice, but they have a different goal.
EV: That's not what I meant. Not long ago it was written in the papers Dubreuil and Lauzon who coach both the French and the Canadian duos had to move them to a different rinks - the competition was too high. More or less at the same time Brian Orser admitted he had to work on the different rinks with Hanyu and Fernandez for the same reason. You and Igor Spilband while working together always stressed the wonderful relationships between the top teams. Yet, at the same time, as far as I know it happened they used different flights attending the same competitions.
MZ: That's a different story. Tessa/Scott and Meryl/Charlie indeed were flying on separate flights, but that was only because one had their tickets booked by the Canadian Fed and the others by the USA. All 4 skated on the same ice at the same time.
EV: Are you saying there was no crazy competition in your group at all?
MZ: I never had anything crazy in my group in general. Everyone are very organized and aiming for their goals. Of course there is a human factor. But I try to do everything within my power to focus each skater on their goal. I give the directions how to reach it. The rest is up to them and on how much information they can digest. That's how the sport works: one takes what you give them and the other doesn't.
EV: That is quite clear. Yet you have to agree the reality does not necessarily goes hand in hand with the theory. After losing the Olympics when Tessa was interviewed by the Canadian press it was obvious how bitter she was with the whole world and with you as a coach. Of course it was quite emotional after the Games. But you, as a coach, were probably hurt that the skaters who worked with you and took gold in Vancouver and silver in Sochi when decided to come back chose a different group?
MZ: No, none. We are still in a great terms. Not so long ago Tessa and Scott told me `Marina, we would never become who we are now if it wasn't for the work with you'.
EV: Because of a personal reasons Meryl should be much closer to you than the other pupils
MZ: She is now. Guess she will be even more so soon.
EV: Are you jealous she is going to take your only son away?
MZ: First of all she is not taking him away. Just that our family will expand.
EV: Did you ever talk to Meryl and Charlie about a comeback?
MZ: Why should I?
EV: At least because Tessa and Scott did. Have you ever thought that Meryl and Charlie could come back as well and compete on the highest level? As a coach, wouldn't you be interested?
MZ: I would. But I think it should come from the skaters and not from the coach. I had that experience with Gordeeva/Grinkov when they came to me a year before the Olympics in Lillehammer and said `Marina, we want to come back'. So they did and won another Olympics. But it was entirely their idea - I didn't try to influence their decision not even slightly. You can't do that to the athlete. All my coaching experience shows that if their mind is set on something different it just won't work, no matter how hard you try.
EV: Hence you are trying not to press on Patrick with his quads?
MZ: Patrick realizes very well what is going on: he saw the junior world champion Vincent Zhou who is also training in our academy comes quite often to work on this presentation and he has all the quad jumps. And he is only 16. But first, all the quad jumps need to be landed and even the most talented ones can sometimes miss them. The Japanese Shoma Uno, for example, landed 5 quads in the middle of September in Lobardia Trophy in Italy, but 3 weeks later in Japan Open was able to land only 2 and it was obvious it's too hard. It's hard for everyone now. All the specialists are trying to work on the quads which is not easy: you have to work on the jumps a lot yet keep the shape. Patrick is first of all a performer and not a jumper. He lives the move on the ice and guess that's why he came back. Watching him skating is a happiness for a coach. What we'll do about the quads depends on several factors. Mainly the timing and the goal.
EV: And the skater's mood?
MZ: No. If we are talking about the professional sports here the mood should not influence the work at all.
