Valieva Banned for Four Years, Effective December 25, 2021

skategal

skategal

Bunny mama
Messages
12,037
Aaron MB Fan said:
I'm sorry but this decision by the ISU makes me so angry, it makes my blood boil. After yesterday's surprising news, I honestly didn't think the ISU could pull this kinda BS, but should have known better.

I feel like this will also taint and hangover Montreal Worlds as the Canadian fans are not going to be pleased. Montreal Worlds was already tainted 4 years ago by COVID, now the ISU taints it again with their pandering toward Russia. Disgusting.
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Yep. 100%

I'm a lifelong fan and if I didn't already have tickets to Worlds in Montreal, I wouldn't buy them now.

This is just the sh!t icing on the sh!t cake for me.
 
Z

zebobes

Well-Known Member
Messages
637
I'm also incredibly amused that through this decision, the ISU has managed to offend multiple members instead of just one. If they had just followed their rules, they could at least say blame it on the rules, but now, they are going to have to fight multiple lawsuits at the same time.
 
marbri

marbri

Hey, Kool-Aid!
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16,572
From my limited experience I honestly believe those in the ISU who made this decision didn't go any further than "okay if we subtract Valieva's points Russia is in third so everyone who thought they got a medal still gets a medal, how lucky are we" and no one at the table said "hang on, but if we then bump all the ladies up one point in each segment then the math doesn't math".
 
Frau Muller

Frau Muller

From Puerto Rico…With Love! Not LatinX!
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22,223
BlueRidge said:
Correct me if I'm wrong but if they had competed without Valieva (meaning if they had not competed in the women's segment of the team event) they would not have won bronze.

There's no conceivable justification for this. "AndreyakaPushkin thinks Roman Sadovsky is not a worthy skater" is a better reason than whatever gunk the ISU chokes up to explain this.
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They could have competed with Scherbakova (who ended up being singles gold medalist) and/or Trusova (singles silver) and would have probably won. Russia made a big mistake, IMO, by including only Valieva in the team event…already knowing about Valieva’s failed test. Whoever insisted on Valieva being the lone Russian woman in the Team event blew it.
 
rfisher

rfisher

Let the skating begin
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73,929
Do any of you not think the IOC, Russian Fed, Kamilla and ISU didn't get advanced notice of the decision and had plans/responses in place? Seriously? The ISU and IOC have known for two years what they would do if she was DQ'd. Two years. It was pretty clear Valieva knew two weeks ago when she quietly WD from the jump competition. The parties would have been notified well before the public so the ISU has had plenty of time to make their decision and prepare their statements. All parties always have a right to appeal and they should as they can set precedence. But if you drop Kamila's points, Russia still has enough for bronze due to the rest of the skaters.
 
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lexeoe

Active Member
Messages
404
LeafOnTheWind said:
There is so much stupid behind the ISU decision. The part that scares me is that they might get away with it. Why would they do this at all if they thought they couldn't? Unless it was just a blatant Russian ass kissing to say they tried.
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everyone seems to have forgotten how to do the math.
 
A

Andrey aka Pushkin

Playing ping pong with balls of chocolate jam
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22,569
I think the reason for this ISU decision is as people pointed out - to have some kind of a compromise with Russia.

Now, that said, I would be very amused to see how ISU is planning to explain this decision in the formal terms, in particularly given they bumped up other results where Valieva was involved. I mean, it's possible to present it kind of like a wild card entry, something like what they do at Nebelhorn during the qualification tournament: some skaters get different placements depending on whether they already qualified for the Olympics or not.

But that requires one heck of a mental gymnastics, and I would check it for doping too.
 
Former Lurve Goddess

Former Lurve Goddess

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,790
skategal said:
Well I suspect this will bring out the heavy weights in Canada.

There is nothing more motivating in Canadian sports than a Canadian athlete screwed over by or for a Russian.

Buckle up everybody! :lol:
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CBC Toronto was heavily discussing the situation this morning. I suspect more than a few Canuck sport journalists are sharpening their digital pens today.
 
Firedancer

Firedancer

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,658
rfisher said:
Do any of you not think the IOC, Russian Fed, Kamilla and ISU didn't get advanced notice of the decision and had plans/responses in place? Seriously? The ISU and IOC have known for two years what they would do if she was DQ'd. Two years. It was pretty clear Valieva knew two weeks ago when she quietly WD from the jump competition. The parties would have been notified well before the public so the ISU has had plenty of time to make their decision and prepare their statements. All parties always have a right to appeal and they should as they can set precedence. But if you drop Kamila's points, Russia still has enough for bronze due to the rest of the skaters.
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Until you move all the women up a spot, as they did with the individual event and Europeans. Then they are fourth.
 
R

Rainbow

Well-Known Member
Messages
461
rfisher said:
Do any of you not think the IOC, Russian Fed, Kamilla and ISU didn't get advanced notice of the decision and had plans/responses in place? Seriously? It was pretty clear Valieva knew two weeks ago when she quietly WD from the jump competition. The parties would have been notified well before the public so the ISU has had plenty of time to make their decision and prepare their statements. All parties always have a right to appeal and they should as they can set precedence. But if you drop Kamila's points, Russia still has enough for bronze due to the rest of the skaters.
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Actually no. As others have stated, Russia would be one point behind Canada, because Shizas would have gained one point for each portion of the competition, if Valievas placement is taken out of the equation.
 
Colonel Green

Colonel Green

Well-Known Member
Messages
13,943
rfisher said:
But if you drop Kamila's points, Russia still has enough for bronze due to the rest of the skaters.
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There is no logical reason to not reallocate the points in the women’s segments. If Kamila didn’t win the short program, Wakaba did, and her effort should earn ten points, not nine. As of right now, the women’s segments count for less than the other other three disciplines.
 
rfisher

rfisher

Let the skating begin
Messages
73,929
And according to the 2021 rules regarding team, Article 11.2.1 states that if one member of the team is found guilty of violating anti-doping rules, the rest of the team is tested on site and if they are negative, they will not be disqualified as a team. It is the in-competition testing that determines the results. The rest of the team, and Valieva for that matter, did not test positive at the Olympics.

Article 11.2.2 states if any member of the team is found to have violated the rules during the event, then the entire team would be DQ'd. They were not.

Article 11.2.3 states that if one member is found in violation and the rest of the team members establish they had no fault or negligence, they are not DQ'd

That is why the "team" is not DQ'd. These articles make the TE very complicated.
 
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lexeoe

Active Member
Messages
404
rfisher said:
And according to the 2021 rules regarding team, Article 11.2.1 states that if one member of the team is found guilty of violating anti-doping rules, the rest of the team is tested on site and if they are negative, they will not be disqualified as a team. It is the in-competition testing that determines the results. The rest of the team, and Valieva for that matter, did not test positive at the Olympics.

That is why the "team" is not DQ'd.
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but then Valieva was ineligible to be there in the first place.
 
BlueRidge

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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65,287
rfisher said:
And according to the 2021 rules regarding team, Article 11.2.1 states that if one member of the team is found guilty of violating anti-doping rules, the rest of the team is tested on site and if they are negative, they will not be disqualified as a team. It is the in-competition testing that determines the results. The rest of the team, and Valieva for that matter, did not test positive at the Olympics.

That is why the "team" is not DQ'd.
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And if we are going to follow the written rules then with the removal of Valieva's results Russia is 4th.
 
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