Jeré Longman/NYT: The Greatest Skater Ever Is Michael Jackson on Ice, Surrounded by Winnie the Poohs

[Sylvia]

Feature article on Yuzuru Hanyu by Jeré Longman, sports reporter for The New York Times, who traveled to Russia for Rostelecom Cup and Japan for NHK Trophy this past fall to research and write this article (published Jan. 4, 2018): https://www.nytimes.com/2018/01/04/sports/olympics/yuzuru-hanyu.html

People quoted in this article include: Stephane Lambiel, Midori Ito, Brian Orser, Jason Dungjen, Jackie Wong, Frank Carroll, Evgeni Plushenko, and several of Hanyu's fans. Longman even visited a Shinto shrine in Kobe called "Yuzuruha" (photos included) where fans have left supportive messages for him on round wooden plaques.

 

[livetoskate]

It's incredible what devotion his fans have. The article mentions 100 Japanese journalists flooding in to hear about Hanyu's condition. If only skating could be so popular in the United States!

 

[danibellerika]

Well I'm just going to put on my Yuzuber hat and go to town. I am very happy that they acknowledged he has fans from all over. Not only Japanese fans travel for him (including me), and his asian fans aren't only Japanese. I was not really following skating for a few years after 2010 (except for US nationals). Then I saw him before Sochi skating to Parisienne Walkways and instantly became a fan, being extremely impressed with his combination of charisma, skating skills, and remarkable jumping ability. The quality of his jumps when clean are unlike anything I've seen in this sport and he does them with little to no telegraphing which makes his programs even more exciting for me.

His work ethic is also admirable because he could be trying to win with the same content that got him his big 330 score the first time, but instead he works to upgrade his content every season and improve himself. How many olympics gold medallists have won and then gone on to become a better skater than the first time they won it? How many stick around a full 4 years afterward? I can't recall many in recent memory. I admire him a heck of a lot for how clearly he gives this sport 200% of himself. He never rests on his laurels. I hope his recovery has gone well and I'll be in PyeongChang and I will be rooting for him no matter what.

 

[Vash01]

It's incredible what devotion his fans have. The article mentions 100 Japanese journalists flooding in to hear about Hanyu's condition. If only skating could be so popular in the United States!

If we had a skater of Yuzuru's caliber, may be it would be popular.

If Nathan Chen wins the OGM - and there is a good chance he might - skating could regain some popularity.

 

[Sylvia]

Re-posting @clairecloutier's comments re. the NYT article from the Hanyu Cheer thread:

Found it interesting, but a bit unsatisfying. The author could have done much more here, I think. Gotten more quotes from skating insiders about Hanyu, done a better job of evaluating Hanyu's achievements within the history of figure skating. Gotten more quotes from fans about specific performances.

Pretty clear that the author is simply a bit perplexed about the Hanyu phenomenon. Perhaps you can't understand it if you're not either a) pretty deep into the sport, or b) pretty knowledgeable about Japanese culture?

 

[Frau Muller]

.....
If Nathan Chen wins the OGM - and there is a good chance he might - skating could regain some popularity.

Really? How popular did Skating become after Evan won in 2010? He was on DWTS. I love Nathan but...let’s be real. The average Joe and Jane Public would care only if a US lady wins and, even then, she’d have to have the Peggy-Dorothy-Nancy look. (Gracie & Ashley had the potential but...)

Did Meryl/Charlie resurrect skating in America?

If Nathan wins, I’d celebrate, as would many fans on FSU, and that’s enough for me.

 

[misskarne]

Really? How popular did Skating become after Evan won in 2010? He was on DWTS. I love Nathan but...let’s be real.

Nathan is infinitely more marketable than Evan was.

I object to "the greatest skater ever" tag. You can't compare eras. Hanyu may be the greatest skater of this era. I still mark him down for lack of consistency.

 

[DreamSkates]

I enjoyed reading the article and find the commitment of his fans refreshing. I wish him well and hope he recovers.

 

[Frau Muller]

Nathan is infinitely more marketable than Evan was.

I object to "the greatest skater ever" tag. You can't compare eras. Hanyu may be the greatest skater of this era. I still mark him down for lack of consistency.

I sure hope that you’re right.

 

[aftershocks]

How many olympics gold medallists have won and then gone on to become a better skater than the first time they won it?

Not many I suppose, but they do exist: Dick Button who is still the only man to win two back-to-back Olympic gold medals. Brian Boitano definitely continued to improve aesthetically as a skater after 1988, albeit as a professional. By 1992, Brian B was still at the top of his game technically, and he likely would have won another Olympics if he'd been allowed to return for that year's Olympics. By the 1994 Olympics when he was allowed to make a comeback, Brian B was injured and past his peak.

Kristi Yamaguchi became a better skater after she won Olympic gold in 1992, also skating professionally. Virtue/ Moir are arguably better skaters than when they first won Olympic gold in 2010. Katarina Witt skated better during her 1984 OGM performance than she did in 1988. However, at her third Olympics, Witt had become a better skater than in her first Olympic appearance, and certainly better than her second showing. I'd also say that Sale/Pelletier were great skaters professionally, so there was improvement in their skating after 2002, even though the technical side is not emphasized as much professionally. Kurt Browning never won an Olympic medal, but he was a great World champion who became a better skater as a professional. Scott Hamilton, 1984 OGM, improved as a professional too, as did Paul Wylie, who some felt should have won OGM in 1992.

Like Virtue/Moir, Hanyu was young when he won his OGM, so he has had time and opportunity to improve as an eligible skater.

 

[MAXSwagg]

Well there are already articles coming out about how Nathan is the “manly” skater so the hype machine is - has been - in overdrive. But it’s futile as he will not resurrect skating in the US even if he wins. Jason could have, even with an individual medal I think, but that’s a lost cause and has been.

 

[aftershocks]

If we had a skater of Yuzuru's caliber, may be it would be popular.

Please clarify what you mean by caliber? Huge national and international fandom does not equate to highest caliber. There are plenty skaters of high caliber in the United States. Did you miss the recent U.S. championship? There are also plenty high caliber skaters from other countries besides Japan and the U.S. Skating these days is an international melting pot anyway. Hanyu has been helped to nurture his talent training in Canada. Figure skating is a global sport.

There are not only different skating cultures in Japan and the U.S., but the two countries also have vastly different cultures in general, plus all of the other factors as to why skating is not hugely popular in the U.S. It never has been despite the increase in television ratings in the late 1990s (post Tonya/Nancy overwrought interest). Figure skating is a niche sport in the U.S. which can not compete with the big ball sports, nor does figure skating (or the people running the sport) seem to want to compete nor know how to compete with more popular sports.

Skating's popularity first began to skyrocket in Japan reportedly in part due to Janet Lynn's heroic 1972 showing in Sapporo:
http://articles.latimes.com/2002/feb/22/sports/sp-olywherenow22

 

[gkelly]

Of course many Olympic champions who then turned pro became better performers and perhaps more generally comfortable on their blades without the pressure of competition and high jump content.

For an Olympic champion who became a better skater while still competing as amateur/eligible, I'd also include Alexei Urmanov. I'd say he improved his choreography, his spins (at least from below-average to average), and his jump content (adding triple-triples especially 3A+3T to his repertoire, and briefly recovering the lost quad that he'd last landed in 1992 and then once again in 1997).

But injury prevented him from competing at another Olympics.

 

[danibellerika]

Not many I suppose, but they do exist: Dick Button who is still the only man to win two back-to-back Olympic gold medals. Brian Boitano definitely continued to improve aesthetically as a skater after 1988, albeit as a professional. By 1992, Brian B was still at the top of his game technically, and he likely would have won another Olympics if he'd been allowed to return for that year's Olympics. By the 1994 Olympics when he was allowed to make a comeback, Brian B was injured and past his peak.

Kristi Yamaguchi became a better skater after she won Olympic gold in 1992, also skating professionally. Virtue/ Moir are arguably better skaters than when they first won Olympic gold in 2010. Katarina Witt skated better during her 1984 OGM performance than she did in 1988. However, at her third Olympics, Witt had become a better skater than in her first Olympic appearance, and certainly better than her second showing. I'd also say that Sale/Pelletier were great skaters professionally, so there was improvement in their skating after 2002, even though the technical side is not emphasized as much professionally. Kurt Browning never won an Olympic medal, but he was a great World champion who became a better skater as a professional. Scott Hamilton, 1984 OGM, improved as a professional too, as did Paul Wylie, who some felt should have won OGM in 1992.

Like Virtue/Moir, Hanyu was young when he won his OGM, so he has had time and opportunity to improve as an eligible skater.

Well that's why I said "not many". I didn't say no one. And most you list improved after turning pro. I am talking more about those who got better while they are still ameteurs and have to produce the demanding tech while still developing everything else. And as great as Kurt and Paul are, they aren't OGMs and poor Kurt has no medal at all as great as he is. So in terms of what's relevant to what I was saying, it still seems like a pretty short list to me. More often than not many look at the OGM as the pinnacle and leave whether they are a flash in the pan or not, whether they are young or not. But good for them regardless. And Button wasn't the only man to win back to back gold, he is just the most recent one.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ Recent as how long ago. It was so cool seeing Dick and Peggy being honored at this year's U.S. Nationals.

You actually repeated a lot of what I said in my previous post. Every era is different and so many varying factors are involved for every skater. There is obviously a short list by narrowing it only to Olympic gold medalists. And 7 of the 9 skaters (& partners) I listed are Olympic gold medalists. The other point is obviously Hanyu's youth, and that's why I mentioned V/M in connection with Hanyu because they all won OGM at a young age which as I said has given them the time and opportunity to improve. Since Hanyu didn't retire, that's another reason he's had the chance to improve as an eligible skater. Conversely, Ilia Kulik won OGM at a young age, and he made the decision to retire. Plushenko is obviously another skater who at least made some effort to improve although he focused more on the technical side. Whether or not Plushy improved significantly from his younger days, he certainly appears to hold the record for hanging around competitively. Unfortunately, Yagudin had to quit due to injury.

Many of those who turned pro and improved did not let up on their technique (particularly Brian Boitano, Kurt Browning, and Scott Hamilton). Scott Williams is another U.S. skater who grew tremendously in the professional competitive ranks that he was so fortunate and honored to be a part of in the golden days of pro events that gave many skaters, including those at the top championship level as well as those who didn't quite break through internationally, the opportunity to continue skating and making a bit of money participating in the sport they loved.

 

[danibellerika]

Whether he wins again or not, out of the many eras of this sport I think there's something to be said for it being 66 years since a man has even entered a games as the reigning World and Olympic champion, especially with the insane technical demands required to be competitive for a podium spot these days. He still skates hungry, as if he didn't win it before. Just because he won it young that doesn't mean he couldn't lose that competitive drive after he made it to the top. Ice Dance is great but that isn't the same to me as singles skating that requires quads all day and then some. I'm one of the biggest Plushenko fans there is but in 2010 he was not as good as he was when he won the OGM in '06. And he really was MIA after that win for years and decided to come back only that season. He almost did it, but he didn't put in the same kind work for a full quad as he did between 2002 and 2006.

I remember my favorite Sasha Cohen saying that if she won in 2002 she would have retired, and she was only 17. Really glad I got to see her for a full quad after that. And yeah she came up short in 2006, but I have my doubts she would have bothered at all in 2010 if she did win overall (though she didn't have a realistic shot in '10 anyway).

 

[Meoima]

Not many I suppose, but they do exist: Dick Button who is still the only man to win two back-to-back Olympic gold medals. Brian Boitano definitely continued to improve aesthetically as a skater after 1988, albeit as a professional. By 1992, Brian B was still at the top of his game technically, and he likely would have won another Olympics if he'd been allowed to return for that year's Olympics. By the 1994 Olympics when he was allowed to make a comeback, Brian B was injured and past his peak.

Kristi Yamaguchi became a better skater after she won Olympic gold in 1992, also skating professionally. Virtue/ Moir are arguably better skaters than when they first won Olympic gold in 2010. Katarina Witt skated better during her 1984 OGM performance than she did in 1988. However, at her third Olympics, Witt had become a better skater than in her first Olympic appearance, and certainly better than her second showing. I'd also say that Sale/Pelletier were great skaters professionally, so there was improvement in their skating after 2002, even though the technical side is not emphasized as much professionally. Kurt Browning never won an Olympic medal, but he was a great World champion who became a better skater as a professional. Scott Hamilton, 1984 OGM, improved as a professional too, as did Paul Wylie, who some felt should have won OGM in 1992.

Like Virtue/Moir, Hanyu was young when he won his OGM, so he has had time and opportunity to improve as an eligible skater.

Anyone with Sale/Pelletier in their list lost credit to me.

 

[aftershocks]

^^ That's fine @Meoima, as I don't see anyone applying to gain any kind of credit with you or from you.

 

[dawnie]

Interesting article. Frank Carroll is such a bitter old man lol. I remember him saying the same thing about Yuna, calling her nothing special. Speaking of Yuna, I find it odd that especially on this board, Yuna's fans are called crazy yet I haven't seen any comments calling Hanyu's fans crazy. His fans possess some next-level obsession...

 

[Sylvia]

Re-posting these 2 posts from the Hanyu injured thread in GSD and replying to @BlueRidge here:

Can't wait to send the link of that NYT article to family and friends. When I tell people I'm following figure skating again, they look at me like I just said I was following professional bowling. As it was Hanyu who pulled me back into the sport, this lovely article may give them a better understanding of why I go on and on about this remarkable creature.

So, @GreatLakesGal, did any of your family members or friends read/comment in any notable way on this Hanyu feature article?

its amazing alright. do we know anything about the writer?

From a recent NYT article by Jeré Longman about the I, Tonya film:

In 1993, I came to The Times myself from The Philadelphia Inquirer and have now covered figure skating, off and on, for a quarter century. There is no sport more fun to write about in an Olympic year. Skating is full of creative people, individuals who are not muzzled by the team ethos. At the same time, their careers are held in constant judgment by others. Somehow this eternal tension between the objective and the subjective is liberating instead of stifling.
...
Today, interest in skating is greatly diminished, except in Japan, where it thrives.

Funny anecdote from 4 years ago after Polina Edmunds was named to the Olympic team... Longman was reminded that he had written a feature article on Polina Edmunds when she was just an 11-year-old Novice level skater competing at 2010 U.S. Nationals. When reminded of this fact, he said he had forgotten that he wrote it!

 

[aftershocks]

He still skates hungry, as if he didn't win it before.

Hanyu did not win OGM in 2014 the way he wanted to win it: skating clean. Surely that's a factor in his determination to 'still skate hungry.'

 

[Meoima]

Interesting article. Frank Carroll is such a bitter old man lol. I remember him saying the same thing about Yuna, calling her nothing special. Speaking of Yuna, I find it odd that especially on this board, Yuna's fans are called crazy yet I haven't seen any comments calling Hanyu's fans crazy. His fans possess some next-level obsession...

Frank Caroll also called Mao nothing special as far as I recall...