ISU Statement on Russia's war against Ukraine - Participation in international competitions of Skaters and Officials from Russia and Belarus

[airgelaal]

I have a feeling it's not the skaters who will be the biggest problem, but the fans. I somehow doubt it will only be the real figure skating fans who will show up for the competition, but the payed morons who don't know the difference between figure skating and football. We already witnessed that in Sochi Olympics, when the real Russian figure skating fans couldn't afford much more than the highest stands and most of the crowd were people who knew how to wave flags, but had no idea what figure skating was. As badly as sending a `wave' in the audience during the pairs warm up.
Imagine what the payed trolls with the flags would do in a competition with the `neutral' skaters....

To be honest, I'm sure that the skaters will also try to make themselves known. I'm sure everyone will start using russian music. So that no one forgets what a great country they are from.
Wherever there is music and costumes, they will be in the russian style.

 

[TAHbKA]

To be honest, I'm sure that the skaters will also try to make themselves known. I'm sure everyone will start using russian music. So that no one forgets what a great country they are from.
Wherever there is music and costumes, they will be in the russian style.

5 swan lakes in one competition? 10 kalinkas?
What's new?

 

[MacMadame]

... or rather was as pushed to do so. A direct question was asked to him, so it was not he who stood up and said this by his own initiation. And it is a huge difference.

I don't think it's a huge difference. I think it's a minor difference. Or maybe even a distinction in search of a difference.

 

[airgelaal]

5 swan lakes in one competition? 10 kalinkas?
What's new?

I don't think they will just use the classics. I think they will use like this

World Record Pair Volosozhar & Trankov - Stunning Short Program at Sochi 2014!

Tatiana Volosozhar and Maxim Trankov are the historic World record holders for the short program, before the scoring change in the 2018â19 season. They are t...

www.youtube.com

 

[Ananas Astra]

I don't think they will just use the classics. I think they will use like this

World Record Pair Volosozhar & Trankov - Stunning Short Program at Sochi 2014!

Tatiana Volosozhar and Maxim Trankov are the historic World record holders for the short program, before the scoring change in the 2018â19 season. They are t...

www.youtube.com

Which was one of the best SPs in the history of pairs skating.

So what should the ISU do now? Ban Russian MUSIC altogether?

 

[thvu]

So what should the ISU do now? Ban Russian MUSIC altogether?

Nah, just Russian skaters until their government sponsor stops annexing the lands of sovereign countries and filling mass graves with dead children.

 

[Ananas Astra]

Nah, just Russian skaters until their government sponsor stops annexing the lands of sovereign countries and filling mass graves with dead children.

They are already doing this.
@airgelaal was proposing something else.

 

[morqet]

What I think @airgelaal was saying was that if Russian athletes are allowed to compete under a neutral flag, they will still find ways of reminding everyone exactly which country they are really representing by using patriotic cultural symbols like music. Just as in 2018, when they were supposed to be OAR with no country signifiers, their Olympic kit had Russian flags hidden under patches and flaps, which they tore off to display the flag as soon as they were on the plane home; here's Medvedeva

 

[airgelaal]

What I think @airgelaal was saying was that if Russian athletes are allowed to compete under a neutral flag, they will still find ways of reminding everyone exactly which country they are really representing by using patriotic cultural symbols like music. Just as in 2018, when they were supposed to be OAR with no country signifiers, their Olympic kit had Russian flags hidden under patches and flaps, which they tore off to display the flag as soon as they were on the plane home; here's Medvedeva

Exactly. Russian athletes cannot be neutral because they consider themselves victims. They are the same propagandists of this criminal regime as politicians.

 

[alexikeguchi]

What I think @airgelaal was saying was that if Russian athletes are allowed to compete under a neutral flag, they will still find ways of reminding everyone exactly which country they are really representing by using patriotic cultural symbols like music. Just as in 2018, when they were supposed to be OAR with no country signifiers, their Olympic kit had Russian flags hidden under patches and flaps, which they tore off to display the flag as soon as they were on the plane home; here's Medvedeva

Wow, I now feel completely justified in canceling Medvedeva for the past year.

I have a feeling it's not the skaters who will be the biggest problem, but the fans. I somehow doubt it will only be the real figure skating fans who will show up for the competition, but the payed morons who don't know the difference between figure skating and football. We already witnessed that in Sochi Olympics, when the real Russian figure skating fans couldn't afford much more than the highest stands and most of the crowd were people who knew how to wave flags, but had no idea what figure skating was. As badly as sending a `wave' in the audience during the pairs warm up.
Imagine what the payed trolls with the flags would do in a competition with the `neutral' skaters....

That behavior can cut two ways. If I were a spectator in the arena while a Russian "neutral" was performing to this accompaniment, I would boo loudly, then stand up and turn my back to the athlete. Officials can cite "non-discrimination" all they like, but they can't control audience response. I think the IOC is going to have some really ugly scenes in the stands if they insist on including Russians.

 

[4rkidz]

Well if Russians are allowed to compete in Paris if still at war I am not volunteering. They rely on volunteers to carry these events so we should start our own boycott.

 

[greenapple]

Exactly. Russian athletes cannot be neutral because they consider themselves victims. They are the same propagandists of this criminal regime as politicians.

And if Bach's insane concept is enacted, the Russians will consider it a victory against the West. Someone needs to tweet the video of Medvedeva and tag the IOC so everyone in the world can see how they circumvented his "neutral" athlete scam in 2018 and really don't give a flying you know what about the sanctions. They will just do what they want anyway.

 

[caseyedwards]

Nah, just Russian skaters until their government sponsor stops annexing the lands of sovereign countries and filling mass graves with dead children.

It was ok when america did it and China doing it and the reason it was ok it was because there was recognition that a country is NOT its government. Government policies come and go. You can’t have Olympic participation based on approved government policies

 

[On My Own]

What I think @airgelaal was saying was that if Russian athletes are allowed to compete under a neutral flag, they will still find ways of reminding everyone exactly which country they are really representing by using patriotic cultural symbols like music. Just as in 2018, when they were supposed to be OAR with no country signifiers, their Olympic kit had Russian flags hidden under patches and flaps, which they tore off to display the flag as soon as they were on the plane home; here's Medvedeva

Wasn't she the one who addressed the IOC on the doping issue before PyeongChang?

 

[On My Own]

I don't think they will just use the classics. I think they will use like this

World Record Pair Volosozhar & Trankov - Stunning Short Program at Sochi 2014!

Tatiana Volosozhar and Maxim Trankov are the historic World record holders for the short program, before the scoring change in the 2018â19 season. They are t...

www.youtube.com

What is wrong with the Masquerade Waltz? Or do you mean because he's in army attire?

 

[airgelaal]

What is wrong with the Masquerade Waltz? Or do you mean because he's in army attire?

Nothing bad, but it all leaves no doubt that this is a pair from russia. Neutral athletes without a flag and an anthem in this case turns into a farce

 

[TAHbKA]

These damn Russian athlets...

 

[Ananas Astra]

Nothing bad, but it all leaves no doubt that this is a pair from russia. Neutral athletes without a flag and an anthem in this case turns into a farce

Mao Asada also used to skate to "Masquerade Waltz", does that make her Russian as well?

Also, skaters from different countries are still using Rachmaninoff, Tchaikovsky, Prokofiev, etc. Are they automatically supporting Russia in this war now?

 

[airgelaal]

There is nothing wrong with the letter Z either. That is why russian athletes actively use this letter. They just like it and there is no hidden meaning in it. This is exactly what you are trying to tell me.
Thank you but no.

 

[Ananas Astra]

There is nothing wrong with the letter Z either. That is why russian athletes actively use this letter. They just like it and there is no hidden meaning in it. This is exactly what you are trying to tell me.
Thank you but no.

So the letter "Z" equals ALL of Russian culture EVER and whoever uses music by Russian composers, supports the war, Putler and wants Ukrainian children dead?
Is this what you are trying to tell me?

 

[Bigbird]

How can they not support Putin, there entire lives and careers are funded by the Kremlin. He is their boss. It is simply a conflict of interest. There are only two plausible solutions; the ban continues until the war ends or they participate as neutrals for the forseeable future, provided the
Team Gold medal is stripped from them in Beijing due to their history of doping. The Gold Medal goes to the Americans and that's a wrap. That's the only card they have. Don't know why they're taking so long to just get on with it. They are caught. This isn't the first time either, Bobrova/Soloviev were stripped of their European medal, they served their sentence and that was it. These delay tactics are just petty.

 

[Bigbird]

How long can they expect people to believe they're the victims here? Nobody's buying it. In the meantime they're throwing extraordinary sums of monies at S/K, Valieva, Tuktik etc from monies gained from the Kremlin. No shame in their game. As if to tell the whole world we are above all this. It just seems rather toxic and narcissistic.

 

[TAHbKA]

I do agree though taking a Russian music would ve tone deaf for a skater now. I don't recall anyone skating to anything Russian this year. Can't say I miss 'ochi chernye' or yet another Rakhmaninov too much.
However, cancelling the compositors who have been dead for more than 100.years is kinda.. weird?

 

[On My Own]

However, cancelling the compositors who have been dead for more than 100.years is kinda.. weird?

I am not too sure about it either. I 100% get airlegaal's concern about symbolism and victimhood, and I can see the concern of that Masquerade Waltz in that army outfit. Or Dark Eyes as you mention, I believe the most famous rendition IS by the Russian Army. Not too sure where I sit on Tchaikovsky though. Would say his ballets are pretty much international heritage.

 

[airgelaal]

I didn't say anything about composers, only about intentions.
Neutral status suggests that athletes are allowed to distance themselves from the criminal regime. While the athletes themselves show their connection with the criminal regime in every possible way. Then what is the point of being "neutral"?

 

[TAHbKA]

I didn't say anything about composers, only about intentions.
Neutral status suggests that athletes are allowed to distance themselves from the criminal regime. While the athletes themselves show their connection with the criminal regime in every possible way. Then what is the point of being "neutral"?

None. The suggestion is stupid to begin with. Just how is it Shostakovich's fault?

 

[gkelly]

How can they not support Putin, there entire lives and careers are funded by the Kremlin. He is their boss. It is simply a conflict of interest. There are only two plausible solutions; the ban continues until the war ends or they participate as neutrals for the forseeable future, provided the
Team Gold medal is stripped from them in Beijing due to their history of doping. The Gold Medal goes to the Americans and that's a wrap. That's the only card they have. Don't know why they're taking so long to just get on with it. They are caught. This isn't the first time either, Bobrova/Soloviev were stripped of their European medal, they served their sentence and that was it. These delay tactics are just petty.

Except these are two different issues.

Even if Russians agreed to accept a doping ban for Valieva and disqualify the Russian team from the skating team event and forfeit the gold medal, that doesn't stop the war.

The Russian athletes in general are not being banned because of doping.

Resolving the team event medal issue shouldn't affect decisions by the IOC and other sports' federations regarding whether Russian athletes should be allowed to compete in those other sports.

 

[Vagabond]

Mao Asada also used to skate to "Masquerade Waltz", does that make her Russian as well?

Also, skaters from different countries are still using Rachmaninoff, Tchaikovsky, Prokofiev, etc. Are they automatically supporting Russia in this war now?

Alysa Liu even skated to the ROC national anthem after the invasion and won a World Bronze Medal.

 

[Bigbird]

Except these are two different issues.

Even if Russians agreed to accept a doping ban for Valieva and disqualify the Russian team from the skating team event and forfeit the gold medal, that doesn't stop the war.

The Russian athletes in general are not being banned because of doping.

Resolving the team event medal issue shouldn't affect decisions by the IOC and other sports' federations regarding whether Russian athletes should be allowed to compete in those other sports.

And that's the tragedy. Using the war is an act of cowardice on the part of the ISU and IOC. The whole team medal debacle should have been resolved months ago. If Russians were banned as they should have we wouldn't even be having these conversations about bans and war and Russia knows this. A whole lot of cowardice has resulted in what we have today.

 

[gkelly]

And that's the tragedy. Using the war is an act of cowardice on the part of the ISU and IOC. The whole team medal debacle should have been resolved months ago. If Russians were banned as they should have we wouldn't even be having these conversations about bans and war and Russia knows this. A whole lot of cowardice has resulted in what we have today.

I wouldn't be surprised if there are other sports that feel strongly about the current ban and who have no idea that figure skating even has a team competition much less what happened with that event last year.

The current ban of all Russian and Belarussian athletes across sports is not about anything to do with figure skating or with doping. Resolving a doping issue in figure skating will not have an effect on whether the ban continues.