Essential Ice Dance

If the worst comes to the worst, then it'll be a Spun Silver, VIETgrlTerifa, and gk_891 geeking out about classic ice dance thread. It actually sounds really fun to me, haha.

I also lied and want to share this:

Pakhomova/Gorshkov Exhibition to La Cumparsita. There aren't really a lot of videos of the first Olympic champions of ice dance, but I really like this video because it really shows what a star Pakhomova was and you see the beginning of this sport as an Olympic sport.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
Worst-comes-to-worst, it'll be a Spun Silver, VIETgrlTerifa, and gk_891 geeking out about classic ice dance thread. It actually sounds really fun to me, haha.
Click to expand...

Sounds fun to me too!

One team that was popular but I personally wasn't a fan of was Usova & Zhulin. But their best work was probably their free dance in 1991.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7m0xMDwr9HU

It was their brand of drama and intensity at its best.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
If the worst comes to the worst, then it'll be a Spun Silver, VIETgrlTerifa, and gk_891 geeking out about classic ice dance thread. It actually sounds really fun to me, haha.

I also lied and want to share this:

Pakhomova/Gorshkov Exhibition to La Cumparsita. There aren't really a lot of videos of the first Olympic champions of ice dance, but I really like this video because it really shows what a star Pakhomova was and you see the beginning of this sport as an Olympic sport.
Click to expand...

I've always wanted to see their OSP which became the tango romantica CD. Maybe one day footage of it will emerge.
 
Spun Silver said:
Thanks. I agree!! Their mastery of such different styles (and their brilliant choreography) really stands out. Forgot to mention the rock and roll program. I liked that one but didnt find it as amazing as the other three.
Click to expand...

Their rock and roll OSP had incredible content but to my eyes, it didn't flow quite as well as their other programs. It seemed more like segments and parts (relatively speaking anyways).
 
What was their music for the Rock n Roll OSP? It had some rock n' roll instrumentation, but it didn't seem to be an actual rock n' roll piece.
 
I am a late comer to this thread, but I like this topic. Will be adding to this. I miss that style of ice dance. Mot sure if this is about eligible competitions only or if pros are included (I will list them anyway). Will post links slowly.

Off the top of my head-

Usova-Zhulin's pro routine to Mozart (after they lost the OGM in 1994 to G&P)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQ-paGb1EII

Annenko-Sretenski's pro routines to Summertime and Thanksgiving. I also liked their Tango OD at the 88 Olympics.

Summertime (93)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITYvFGQGjoQ

Thanksgiving (93)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHBm_IcqEjc

88 OD: Tango

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlAuooDCCdo

A&S 94 tech program:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKhPKxa0Rz4

Pakhomova-Gorshkov: Masquerade waltz:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iWxUhuBEF2s


K&P's Tango OD and exhibition at the 88 Olympics (I saw the latter live in Sun Valley).
K&P's My fair lady FD in 1990

88 OD:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IgG89YpKM4k

Exhibition:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USo3e2w12C8

1990 FD: MFL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrW9-4SGTUw

1992 FD: Bach

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnvBMefCngc


Dushenays' Missing in 1991 FD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXkeiamsCew


Grishchuk & Platov's OD in 1995, also their Memorial FD in 98 and The feeling begins FD in 97.

95 OD:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uE_9XOe72B0

97 FD Euro:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hN34Qz35zgA

98 Oly FD: (I hated Tracy Wilson's commentary on this)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oCE1TwOjv3k

Krylova-Ovsianikov's Masquerade waltz FD (97) and their Argentine tango CD (98)
Masquerade waltz:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtcrMzot9hc

Tango CD:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5-WWjjuDKk

I will post more later.
 
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The Grishuk/Platov Olympic FD link with Dean's commentary has been silenced by Japan so here is a US version.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sYK1_D5Q4eA

Passing over K/P for the moment except to ask - is it just the above program, or just me, or the (hideous) theatrical costumes that obscure the movement, but do G/P have a notably lower technical level than K/P and T/D? Their program seems to lack a LOT of the intricacy and polish of the other two teams. I have only ever seen a couple of their programs though. Will keep watching.

I may not be able to comment again until tomorrow night but I shall return. :)
 
Vash01 said:
Annenko-Sretenski's pro routines to Summertime and Thanksgiving. I also liked their Tango OD at the 88 Olympics.

Summertime (93)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITYvFGQGjoQ

Thanksgiving (93)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RHBm_IcqEjc

88 OD: Tango

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlAuooDCCdo

A&S 94 tech program:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKhPKxa0Rz4
Click to expand...

I was never a big fan of this team when they were amateurs but they really blossomed as pros in terms of their performance abilities.
 
Spun Silver said:
The Grishuk/Platov Olympic FD link with Dean's commentary has been silenced by Japan so here is a US version.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sYK1_D5Q4eA

Passing over K/P for the moment except to ask - is it just the above program, or just me, or the (hideous) theatrical costumes that obscure the movement, but do G/P have a notably lower technical level than K/P and T/D? Their program seems to lack a LOT of the intricacy and polish of the other two teams. I have only ever seen a couple of their programs though. Will keep watching.

I may not be able to comment again until tomorrow night but I shall return. :)
Click to expand...

It depends on what program they skated because they've had some very poor material over the years. With that free dance in 1992, the first section was kind of meh but the middle section was nice and the final section had fantastic content IMO. But yeah, the costumes are hideous. They represent 2 robots who come to life.

A video of that free dance with better camera angles (the CBS camera angles doesn't show their speed and ice coverage very well) is the one from CBC.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rgaw0QaH_f0
 
Spun Silver said:
The Grishuk/Platov Olympic FD link with Dean's commentary has been silenced by Japan so here is a US version.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sYK1_D5Q4eA

Passing over K/P for the moment except to ask - is it just the above program, or just me, or the (hideous) theatrical costumes that obscure the movement, but do G/P have a notably lower technical level than K/P and T/D? Their program seems to lack a LOT of the intricacy and polish of the other two teams. I have only ever seen a couple of their programs though. Will keep watching.

I may not be able to comment again until tomorrow night but I shall return. :)
Click to expand...

That 1992 FD and their 1993 FD are actually my two favorite G/P FDs no contest. I think ice dance was going through a change, and became more theatrical. In context and in comparison to what Usova/Zhulin and the Duchesnays were providing, G/P's 1992 FD was full of real content and difficult footwork. They had more footwork than K/P's 1992 FD (which was probably due to them doing more theatrical dancing to compete with the Duchesnays and giving the judges what they were feeling at that time) as well, though K/P had difficulty elsewhere. What G/P introduced was speed, speed, and more speed. Bestemianova/Bukin were about that too, but G/P did it with more actual footwork and lots of twizzles and a lot less crossovers, posing, and mugging.

ETA: I think my favorite version of G/P's "Memorial" FD was from the GPF. It had more content than their Olympic version and they skated it a lot better.
 
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gk_891 said:
It depends on what program they skated because they've had some very poor material over the years. With that free dance in 1992, the first section was kind of meh but the middle section was nice and the final section had fantastic content IMO. But yeah, the costumes are hideous. They represent 2 robots who come to life.

A video of that free dance with better camera angles (the CBS camera angles doesn't show their speed and ice coverage very well) is the one from CBC.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rgaw0QaH_f0
Click to expand...

I couldn't open this link.
 
Spun Silver said:
The Grishuk/Platov Olympic FD link with Dean's commentary has been silenced by Japan so here is a US version.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=sYK1_D5Q4eA

Passing over K/P for the moment except to ask - is it just the above program, or just me, or the (hideous) theatrical costumes that obscure the movement, but do G/P have a notably lower technical level than K/P and T/D? Their program seems to lack a LOT of the intricacy and polish of the other two teams. I have only ever seen a couple of their programs though. Will keep watching.

I may not be able to comment again until tomorrow night but I shall return. :)
Click to expand...

The link you posted is for their 92 FD. T&D did not compete at the 92 Olympics.

Yes, the costumes are hideous and they were still developing, both technically and artistically. However, they wanted to try a more modern style and they succeeded in that. They placed 4th overall. Yes, their tech level was lower than K&P.

By 94 they had made major developments, and at that time they did compete against T&D (and I didn't care for T&D's FD that year). However, K&P had already turned pro. So I am a little confused by your post.
 
Vash01 said:
The link you posted is for their 92 FD. T&D did not compete at the 92 Olympics.

Yes, the costumes are hideous and they were still developing, both technically and artistically. They placed 4th overall. Yes, their tech level was lower than K&P.

By 94 they had made major developments, and at that time they did compete against T&D (and I didn't care for T&D's FD that year). However, K&P had already turned pro. So I am a little confused by your post.
Click to expand...

Spun Silver is watching the videos in chronological order so when SS got to G/P in 1992, SS felt that G/P seemed to have less content, intricacy, and polish than what T/D and K/P were providing in the earlier years. I do think most agree that G/P are rougher than their fellow Soviets/Russians who came before them and rougher than T/D. That roughness is actually a strength as well as a detriment because their roughness came from their energy and athletic style of dancing. I know some who can never get into G/P because they didn't have the finesse, polish, or leg-line of the more classic ice dance teams (very similar to critiques that Davis/White received). But I will say Oksana had a great natural timing and rhythm to the music.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
That 1992 FD and their 1993 FD are actually my two favorite G/P FDs no contest. I think ice dance was going through a change, and became more theatrical. In context and in comparison to what Usova/Zhulin and the Duchesnays were providing, G/P's 1992 FD was full of real content and difficult footwork. They had more footwork than K/P's 1992 FD (which was probably due to them doing more theatrical dancing to compete with the Duchesnays and giving the judges what they were feeling at that time) as well, though K/P had difficulty elsewhere. What G/P introduced was speed, speed, and more speed. Bestemianova/Bukin were about that too, but G/P did it with more actual footwork and lots of twizzles and a lot less crossovers, posing, and mugging.
Click to expand...

It's also one of my favourite FDs from G&P. They were still gelling together as a team but I really loved the middle section of that free dance (the beat sounded like raindrops) and I just loved the energy and content in the final section. Their youthful energy was very appealing IMO even if it meant being less polished than some of the other teams.
 
gk_891 said:
It's also one of my favourite FDs from G&P. They were still gelling together as a team but I really loved the middle section of that free dance (the beat sounded like raindrops) and I just loved the energy and content in the final section. Their youthful energy was very appealing IMO even if it meant being less polished than some of the other teams.
Click to expand...

I better watch the whole FD again.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
Spun Silver is watching the videos in chronological order so when SS got to G/P in 1992, SS felt that G/P seemed to have less content, intricacy, and polish than what T/D and K/P were providing in the earlier years.
Click to expand...

Not sure which years she was comparing this with. I would guess T&D in 1980 (I didn't watch them before 1984) and K&P in 1984?
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
That 1992 FD and their 1993 FD are actually my two favorite G/P FDs no contest. I think ice dance was going through a change, and became more theatrical. In context and in comparison to what Usova/Zhulin and the Duchesnays were providing, G/P's 1992 FD was full of real content and difficult footwork. They had more footwork than K/P's 1992 FD (which was probably due to them doing more theatrical dancing to compete with the Duchesnays and giving the judges what they were feeling at that time) as well, though K/P had difficulty elsewhere. What G/P introduced was speed, speed, and more speed. Bestemianova/Bukin were about that too, but G/P did it with more actual footwork and lots of twizzles and a lot less crossovers, posing, and mugging.

ETA: I think my favorite version of G/P's "Memorial" FD was from the GPF. It had more content than their Olympic version and they skated it a lot better.
Click to expand...

I had completely forgotten their 93 FD. Here is the link:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiHi7-jjWKo
(no sound)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFhf07juwUE
(with music)


Oksana looks so young!
 
Vash01 said:
Not sure which years she was comparing this with. I would guess T&D in 1980 (I didn't watch them before 1984) and K&P in 1984?
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It's from the second post where Sylvia listed a huge list of youtube videos that I had posted earlier. It lists a number of great T&D and K&P programs and then G&P. But it started with G&P in 92 when they were still young and gelling together so I'm sure for some, that program didn't seem as 'great' per se relatively speaking.
 
gk_891 said:
It's from the second post where Sylvia listed a huge list of youtube videos that I had posted earlier. It lists a number of great T&D and K&P programs and then G&P. But it started with G&P in 92 when they were still young and gelling together so I'm sure for some, that program didn't seem as 'great' per se relatively speaking.
Click to expand...

I remember watching the Christopher Dean commentary on their 1992 FD before it was unavailable for us Americans. He was super complimentary and thought they were the future. I think all that footwork and content they were doing and with the speed that they were doing it with impressed a lot of people. Even Tracy Wilson liked it and acknowledged the difficult footwork. How their tunes changed in 1994, :lol:. To be fair though, I think Dubova gave them better material than Linichuk and they seemed more polished under Dubova too and had closer holds.

Vash01 said:
Not sure which years she was comparing this with. I would guess T&D in 1980 (I didn't watch them before 1984) and K&P in 1984?
Click to expand...

SS was watching T/D videos provided by gk_891 linked by Sylvia on the first page, so it was mainly T/D's 1982-1984 programs and K/P's 1986-1992 programs.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
Spun Silver is watching the videos in chronological order so when SS got to G/P in 1992, SS felt that G/P seemed to have less content, intricacy, and polish than what T/D and K/P were providing in the earlier years. I do think most agree that G/P are rougher than their fellow Soviets/Russians who came before them and rougher than T/D. That roughness is actually a strength as well as a detriment because their roughness came from their energy and athletic style of dancing. I know some who can never get into G/P because they didn't have the finesse, polish, or leg-line of the more classic ice dance teams (very similar to critiques that Davis/White received). But I will say Oksana had a great natural timing and rhythm to the music.
Click to expand...

Indeed. This is very important. G&P had tremendous speed and skated very aggressively and with a lot of snap. They weren't really about polish. But to be fair, i thought Platov was a very polished skater with glorious posture, neck and shoulder line, and free leg extension. Oksana's free leg extension was impeccable in the compulsory dances but she could sometime let loose in those areas of her skating in the OD and FD.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
I remember watching the Christopher Dean commentary on their 1992 FD before it was unavailable for us Americans. He was super complimentary and thought they were the future. I think all that footwork and content they were doing and with the speed that they were doing it with impressed a lot of people. Even Tracy Wilson liked it and acknowledged the difficult footwork. How their tunes changed in 1994, :lol:. To be fair though, I think Dubova gave them better material than Linichuk and they seemed more polished under Dubova too and had closer holds.



SS was watching T/D videos provided by gk_891 linked by Sylvia on the first page, so it was mainly T/D's 1982-1984 programs and K/P's 1986-1992 programs.
Click to expand...

Is my video of G&P's 92 FD not available to watch in the U.S anymore? Do you know why?
 
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