Craig Simpson & Jamie Sale

[Judy]

I listened to this podcast too. He was very clear that their mutual friend said the dads will not allow the kids to be with her.
Of course, this is a bit of hearsay, but I have heard the same thing from a different source about David with Jesse (who is also old enough to make his own choices), so I believe it's true. Craig Simpson travels a lot but my understanding is he has a very close family, so I expect their daughter is with his family or with Sale's mom.
Blundell also said the mutual friend said all of Sale's friends and family have peaced out, which is terribly sad, but there comes a point where there isn't much else you can do.

Yes. I know his son is with David. Everyone is silent on the daughter.

’This has nothing to do with SLC Olympics. You have a person in a cult. That would be so awful for the families/friends .. the kids dads. The kids.

There’s a lot unknown about the daughter. I’m thinking there would have had to be a court case or if she was just removed. That is likely to remain unknown. I’m glad the kids are in good hands though.

Theo Fleury just posted he had a great telephone conversation with Putin re hockey.

Thankfully none of my family are involved in this crap.

 

[Habs]

Theo Fleury just posted he had a great telephone conversation with Putin re hockey.

Talk about losing the plot. Yikes.

 

[Judy]

Talk about losing the plot. Yikes.

I wonder if his wife has stayed. Putin is NOT talking to any Canadian regarding hockey.

 

[canbelto]

I saw a podcast with her and another Qnutter where she said she was frustrated because her mother was not "awake" yet. Talked about the frustration of being with people who aren't "awake." I can see why her family has distanced itself.

 

[Slushee]

The linguistics major in me finds it both amusing and confusing that apparently Qanon is all about being "awake" and absolutely not okay with being "woke."

 

[VGThuy]

I saw a podcast with her and another Qnutter where she said she was frustrated because her mother was not "awake" yet. Talked about the frustration of being with people who aren't "awake." I can see why her family has distanced itself.

Right? It says to me that people have distanced themselves from her because these conspiracy theories have consumed her entire life and being. She probably cannot talk about anything else and has now made this her life's mission both professionally and personally. Being around someone like would be exhausting unless you're also totally consumed by this.

 

[VALuvsMKwan]

Being monomaniacal on a subject can, I believe, be a warning sign for possible current or future dementia.

My older brother, in the years before his diagnosis, would somehow or another bring every conversation in which he participated around to trying to talk about arcane sports statistics from decades before.

I also wonder if in his case being a running back (playing US football) may have caused CTE damage. Honestly not trying to be funny - does Jamie Sale have a history of (perhaps undiagnosed) concussions from falls on throws or lifts?

 

[skategal]

I’m not discounting that Jamie could have concussions contributing to this.

However, most Qanon/anti-vax people I’ve encountered IRL are not athletes, have not had concussions and are completely one-track minded when it comes to this stuff.

My family and I have had to distance ourselves from certain people because the topic of conversation never changes no matter how much you try, even if if you say to them that we can’t talk about this anymore because we won’t ever agree, they don’t take the clue to stop taking about it.

 

[tony]

More than the concussions, I think we should ask if the media, yes NORTH AMERICA, and the people around her constantly claiming scandal in figure skating in that Olympic cycle also had something to do with her not being trustworthy of anything and leading her to a place like this.

We've discussed the result of SLC to death and even if you take that situation and the specific judge away, there were plenty of other examples of Canada crying about how there was cheating behavior happening (Jean Senft, anyone?) or US TV pushing scandals that weren't really there.

 

[allezfred]

Another elite athlete whose anti-vax views (and anti- a lot of other things) get more attention than they should because of his athletic success is Curt Schilling, the baseball pitcher. He was great back in the day, but now he's a QAnon election-denying racist sexist nutbar.

But did he ever have a fake snowball fight?

Allezfred repeatedly thinks that all North American skaters are bad people bc he doesn’t like their skating. That is well known at fsu. That’s the logical fallacy I hate.

Wait - you know what I repeatedly think? Are you inside my brain? What am I thinking about now?

I’ll give you a hint: it’s not North American skaters. Or even skaters from Europe or Asia.

Man, now I'm mad because I have to defend Allezfred. None of what you've posted is true. Is he a self-important a-hole with sometimes questionable taste in skating that has a weird fixation for attempting to dunk on Canadians? Of course, and I wish some proverbial Canadian hadn't kicked his dog or pissed in his cornflakes in the past. But you are sadly wrong on top of being beyond dramatic. I know I've seen Allezfred say lovely things about Patrick Chan, V&M, etc. etc., and I don't think he's ever personally insulted, nor wished ill upon, even the worst of Canadian skaters.

Now, we CAN question why he values trying to insult Canadians using Jamie Sale rather than unite with us in shared dislike of her. But because I know he doesn't kick puppies on purpose, I hope he simply values being a provocative and "funny" poster over much else on FSU, and NOT that his sometimes questionable taste reflects in sometimes questionable morals...

Love you too!

Who is this "allezfred" person about whom posters in this thread seem to be so fixated on debating?

Don’t you know who I am?

 

[skategal]

More than the concussions, I think we should ask if the media, yes NORTH AMERICA, and the people around her constantly claiming scandal in figure skating in that Olympic cycle also had something to do with her not being trustworthy of anything and leading her to a place like this.

We've discussed the result of SLC to death and even if you take that situation and the specific judge away, there were plenty of other examples of Canada crying about how there was cheating behavior happening (Jean Senft, anyone?) or US TV pushing scandals that weren't really there.

And yet Shae-Lynn Bourne, Victor Kraatz, and Elvis Stokjo are not Qnuts.

I think there were WAY more made up wuzrobbed media scandals about those skaters than there ever was about Sale/Pelletier.

 

[Sparks]

But did he ever have a fake snowball fight?

Good point

 

[tony]

And yet Shae-Lynn Bourne, Victor Kraatz, and Elvis Stokjo are not Qnuts.

I think there were WAY more made up wuzrobbed media scandals about those skaters than there ever was about Sale/Pelletier.

Did I or anyone ever suggest that controversies definitely led to Qnut outcomes? I mean, yourself.

Some people move past it, some people can't move on from said event or the past and always are suspicious of everyone around them. Maybe Sale is an extreme version of such.

 

[skategal]

Did I or anyone ever suggest that controversies definitely led to Qnut outcomes? I mean, yourself.

Some people move past it, some people can't move on from said event or the past and always are suspicious of everyone around them. Maybe Sale is an extreme version of such.

Some people moving past it and some people not being able to move past it suggests that there is something innate about the person rather than the situation itself.

There is something about Jamie herself innately that made her act the way she did during SLC, after SLC and during the Pandemic.

The situations didn’t cause her reactions. She caused her own reactions.

David, Jamie, Anton, Elana, were all in the situation and 3 of them moved on from it.

The problem lies within Jamie that she can’t.

 

[VGThuy]

I think she misses feeling important and being part of a something bigger. She probably lost direction in her life and just being a OGM in Canada wasn't enough to keep people that interested in her. Now she found an audience who will listen to what she has to say and found an audience where that OGM helped put on her on a pedestal. Add in her not being very bright...and well.... Let's just say she now has direction and a goal in life and feels like she's a part of something bigger.

Some people moving past it and some people not being able to move past it suggests that there is something innate about the person rather than the situation itself.

There is something about Jamie herself innately that made her act the way she did during SLC, after SLC and during the Pandemic.

The situations didn’t cause her reactions. She caused her own reactions.

I agree with this. I think the SLC scandal and all the players involved in politicking and making deals where athletes' careers and results were played with like disposable toys ... aka playing with people's lives without care for the victims...none of that helped her at all and probably was a triggering event. But if that never happened, something else would have triggered her obsessive-compulsive, attention-seeking behavior. It was always there ready to be let out. It just manifested itself in this anti-authoritarian, distrustful of the "powers that be" persona because of her life experience.

 

[tony]

Some people moving past it and some people not being able to move past it suggests that there is something innate about the person rather than the situation itself.

There is something about Jamie herself innately that made her act the way she did during SLC, after SLC and during the Pandemic.

The situations didn’t cause her reactions. She caused her own reactions.

I never said otherwise, and I don't know why my suggestion that the environment around her led to an extreme response FROM HERSELF is so hard to comprehend. I forgot that FSU has a hard time realizing that no one reacts the same, as evidenced by your claim that other skaters with scandals didn't follow the same path so it just can't be a contributing factor. No environmental factor is going to have the same effect on people.

I think she misses feeling important and being part of a something bigger. She probably lost direction in her life and just being a OGM in Canada wasn't enough to keep people that interested in her. Now she found an audience who will listen to what she has to say and found an audience where that OGM helped put on her on a pedestal. Add in her not being very bright...and well.... Let's just say she now has direction and a goal in life and feels like she's a part of something bigger.

And this, too. Some people know how to keep the attention on them when they actually are in the spotlight, and then need to find other ways to do it when their star is just about burnt out.

 

[VGThuy]

I never said otherwise, and I don't know why my suggestion that the environment around her led to an extreme response FROM HERSELF is so hard to comprehend. I forgot that FSU has a hard time realizing that no one reacts the same, as evidenced by your claim that other skaters with scandals didn't follow the same path so it just can't be a contributing factor. No environmental factor is going to have the same effect on people.


And this, too. Some people know how to keep the attention on them when they actually are in the spotlight, and then need to find other ways to do it when their star is just about burnt out.

Did you ever watch that NBC Tara Lipinski's husband-produced documentary that came out months ago on Peacock/NBC? If you did, remember how super dramatic she was when they did that "intro" with her and David walking in together and seeing each other face-to-face. She did that prolonged sigh (it was like she wanted to give the world a hint that something was off between her and David) but then really lit up when she got to talk about herself and the scandal again. I think she really likes the spotlight.

 

[skategal]

I never said otherwise, and I don't know why my suggestion that the environment around her led to an extreme response FROM HERSELF is so hard to comprehend. I forgot that FSU has a hard time realizing that no one reacts the same, as evidenced by your claim that other skaters with scandals didn't follow the same path so it just can't be a contributing factor. No environmental factor is going to have the same effect on people.


And this, too. Some people know how to keep the attention on them when they actually are in the spotlight, and then need to find other ways to do it when their star is just about burnt out.

You said that you wondered how much the North American media and others crying skandal led to Jamie being Qanon.

I just don’t buy that at all. Sorry.

I agree 100% with @VGThuy that it is for attention, belonging and purpose.

It’s tough when the limelight fades and this is a way for her to prolong it.

 

[tony]

Did you ever watch that NBC Tara Lipinski's husband-produced documentary that came out months ago on Peacock/NBC? If you did, remember how super dramatic she was when they did that "intro" with her and David walking in together and seeing each other face-to-face. She did that prolonged sigh (it was like she wanted to give the world a hint that something was off between her and David) but then really lit up when she got to talk about herself and the scandal again. I think she really likes the spotlight.

Yes, and even on this particular documentary, the idea was floating out there that Sikharulidze intentionally crashed into them (I think from both Jamie and either their agent or someone else), and IIRC some people here were trying to argue that B/S would've known S/P's typical warm-up pattern. Scandals everywhere.

But that's another thing, this documentary comes out almost 20 years later and, along with the Netflix one, it's so North American-centric, with a bunch of 'experts' in the sport saying they have no idea how they could've lost, how it was obvious, etc. She's certainly lived in a world around those types.

You said that you wondered how much the North American media and others crying skandal led to Jamie being Qanon.

I just don’t buy that at all. Sorry.

I agree 100% with @VGThuy that it is for attention, belonging and purpose.

It’s tough when the limelight fades and this is a way for her to prolong it.

I can go all day with you. I said I wondered if the constant scandals in the sport, the SLC happenings, the media constantly digging for things that weren't there, the people around her probably telling her for a long time, et al led to her not being trustworthy of anything. Qanon is based on a lot of not trusting real, established information. She herself had to get to that conclusion, but like with ANY OTHER SCENARIO, there could've been a push to get there. Not hard to understand if you ask me, but we don't seem to be getting anywhere.

 

[VGThuy]

It’s ridiculous how some of my friends bought into the crash thing after they watched that documentary. I was so angry. I kept telling them there was no way B/S would have crashed to them on purpose and that B/S were preparing for a jump and had their backs to her, who was just skating around by herself at that point.

As to B/S knowing S/P’s pattern by then…I mean just because S/P skated to Love Story for a hundred years and their fans can remember every crossover (there were a lot of them) in that program doesn’t mean B/S had that entire program memorized. And further, Jamie wasn’t really doing a pattern from the program during the crash from what I remember. She was skating backwards away from David. Again, I know there was a lot of partner separation between Jamie and David during Love Story but not that much.

 

[skategal]

Yes, and even on this particular documentary, the idea was floating out there that Sikharulidze intentionally crashed into them (I think from both Jamie and either their agent or someone else), and IIRC some people here were trying to argue that B/S would've known S/P's typical warm-up pattern. Scandals everywhere.

But that's another thing, this documentary comes out almost 20 years later and, along with the Netflix one, it's so North American-centric, with a bunch of 'experts' in the sport saying they have no idea how they could've lost, how it was obvious, etc. She's certainly lived in a world around those types.

I can go all day with you. I said I wondered if the constant scandals in the sport, the SLC happenings, the media constantly digging for things that weren't there, the people around her probably telling her for a long time, et al led to her not being trustworthy of anything. Qanon is based on a lot of not trusting real, established information. She herself had to get to that conclusion, but like with ANY OTHER SCENARIO, there could've been a push to get there. Not hard to understand if you ask me, but we don't seem to be getting anywhere.

There is so much false and made up wuzrobbed skandal in figure skating circles.

I mean we’ve had skaters say they were told before they competed in events by people supposedly in the know that they would not win.

But these skaters haven’t taken up the Qanon life so I am reluctant to attribute it to that.

YMMV.

 

[Amy L]

However, most Qanon/anti-vax people I’ve encountered IRL are not athletes, have not had concussions and are completely one-track minded when it comes to this stuff.

My family and I have had to distance ourselves from certain people because the topic of conversation never changes no matter how much you try, even if if you say to them that we can’t talk about this anymore because we won’t ever agree, they don’t take the clue to stop taking about it.

Q peeps tend to take arguments against them, or even just suggestions to switch subjects, as a clue that they have to talk about it even more. Because if you aren't as obsessed with it as they are, then it's proof that you've been reprogrammed by the Chinese microchips, or you've been taken over by a lizard person duplicate, etc

There are tons of Q-adjacent splinter groups, so the reason you aren't Awake yet are vast and progressively nuttier the longer they're involved.

 

[skategal]

Q peeps tend to take arguments against them, or even just suggestions to switch subjects, as a clue that they have to talk about it even more. Because if you aren't as obsessed with it as they are, then it's proof that you've been reprogrammed by the Chinese microchips, or you've been taken over by a lizard person duplicate, etc

There are tons of Q-adjacent splinter groups, so the reason you aren't Awake yet are vast and progressively nuttier the longer they're involved.

Yeah they are definitely on a mission to “save people from themselves.”

 

[overedge]

I think she misses feeling important and being part of a something bigger. She probably lost direction in her life and just being a OGM in Canada wasn't enough to keep people that interested in her. Now she found an audience who will listen to what she has to say and found an audience where that OGM helped put on her on a pedestal. Add in her not being very bright...and well.... Let's just say she now has direction and a goal in life and feels like she's a part of something bigger.



I agree with this. I think the SLC scandal and all the players involved in politicking and making deals where athletes' careers and results were played with like disposable toys ... aka playing with people's lives without care for the victims...none of that helped her at all and probably was a triggering event. But if that never happened, something else would have triggered her obsessive-compulsive, attention-seeking behavior. It was always there ready to be let out. It just manifested itself in this anti-authoritarian, distrustful of the "powers that be" persona because of her life experience.

I agree with this. She truly loves skating - she stuck with it after her partnership with Jason Turner ended, and a lot of people were telling her she was too old to be a successful singles skater. And then she paired up with David and got a whole new phase to her skating career. It would be really hard to leave that world and the status she had in it. Stars on Ice and Battle of the Blades was work (which a lot of ex-skaters don't have) but it probably didn't feel the same. And now she has something else to focus her energies on, and somewhere she can build on her reputation.

 

[canbelto]

Probably way more likely that two failed marriages (with rather public divorces) pushed her off the edge. It didn't seem like she was particularly popular within the close-knit skating community, whereas her ex David Pelletier definitely is.

 

[overedge]

Probably way more likely that two failed marriages (with rather public divorces) pushed her off the edge. It didn't seem like she was particularly popular within the close-knit skating community, whereas her ex David Pelletier definitely is.

Lots of people get divorced without turning into Q-Anon conspiracy theorists. I don't know about popularity within the skating community, but David stayed in that community more because he became a coach and a power skating instructor. I don't think Jamie ever coached - she was a life coach for a while, but her involvement with skating post-retirement was mostly as a professional performer. I think that has more to do with their individual life choices rather than how popular each one was in the skating world.

 

[Andora]

First of all, I'm disappointed to hear people would still intimate that Anton intentionally crashed into Jamie. My god - he could have hurt himself just as much. The way he responded and attended to Jamie immediately said to me, a then-S&P-uber, that it was a simply an accident, though a dramatic one.

Probably way more likely that two failed marriages (with rather public divorces) pushed her off the edge. It didn't seem like she was particularly popular within the close-knit skating community, whereas her ex David Pelletier definitely is.

I do agree that the loss of her second marriage could have set her off further down this isolating path, especially if she already started to feel isolated and misunderstood.

Lots of people get divorced without turning into Q-Anon conspiracy theorists. I don't know about popularity within the skating community, but David stayed in that community more because he became a coach and a power skating instructor. I don't think Jamie ever coached - she was a life coach for a while, but her involvement with skating post-retirement was mostly as a professional performer. I think that has more to do with their individual life choices rather than how popular each one was in the skating world.

I think you're underestimating how traumatic the end of a marriage can be. I agree many do not become Q-Nuts, but many turn to unhealthy coping strategies still, such as drugs, alcohol, etc. Jamie was already primed for this kind of direction, so this was her poor choice. If only she'd turned to abusing prescription medication instead.

It's unendingly interesting to me that David has remained closer to the skating community, as he had been fairly open about not enjoying the sport despite being good at it. I vaguely recall him saying he'd never put his kids in skating, he always preferred hockey, etc. I think his job as power skating instructor would have taken him further away from skating, really, and yet he kept coming back to BOTB, dated skaters (and Tessa's sister )post-Jamie, married ostensibly the greatest pair skater in modern history. Now he's going to be some ridiculous-sounding Canadian program with Katia. Surprising for someone who didn't enjoy the sport itself.

It's too bad Jamie never got into coaching, and didn't find her own spot within skating after retiring from shows. I mentioned earlier she was a guest coach on All Round Champion and was helping sporty kids learn how to perform in two days. It's the most likeable I'd found her since January 2002. I'm not sure what chased her away from the sport, but I would never have guessed 20 years ago that she'd be the one to go down this path.

 

[Coco]

I was surprised and then almost a little uncomfortable with how available she made herself for Tara and Mr Tara's documentary. She struck me as someone without a lot of boundaries who was perhaps unable to guard her own heart, so to speak.

She seemed to have lots of unresolved grief and anger over her childhood and teenage years. But who knows, maybe the producers asked her to play up those stories. I mean they needed something to balance out being beaten by your former partner and getting a skate blade into the head.

 

[Vagabond]

Don’t you know who I am?

One of Theo Fleury's former teammates?

 

[overedge]

@Andora I agree with you, but becoming a power skating instructor isn't necessarily leaving the skating community. There are a lot of hockey power skating instructors that are former (figure) skaters, some at very high levels, like Barb Underhill and Victor Kraatz. I don't think figure skaters get ostracized because they go to work with the loud smelly hockey players.