2025 4CC - Free Dance: “Meet Me at The ChSt”

[Wyliefan]

I didn't have my phone on me at the time because I'd just woken up, but I really enjoyed Yoshida/Morita. Very smooth and powerful. (I knew Chris was going to say "didn’t put a foot wrong," and he did. )

 

[Debbie S]

Hard to tell whether the judges are throwing G/P a bone, i.e. C/B are going to win Worlds, so we'll give you this one, or whether the plan is for a reversal of last year, Canadians winning in the U.S. after the Americans won in Canada. Maybe it was due to the skating order, but the GOEs and PCS for G/P were....unusual. And while I don't think C/B's FD is the best one they've ever had, G/P's FD this year is a hot mess.

 

[MacMadame]

Are we using the same card for tomorrow or starting fresh with the Women's FS? I say start fresh.

I wasn't sure what people would want. I'm happy to start over.

 

[Colonel Green]

Just occurred to me, this was probably Piper & Paul and Madison & Evan's final 4CC. Between them 5 event titles, and counting former partnerships 22 appearances and 15 medals.

 

[marbri]

Just watched the FD and couldn't be more pleased with the podium. I maintain G/P have really really good programs this year and am glad that was recognised by the panel. C/B are good and everything and I get their program is "sophisticated" but christ I feel like I am watching a double run through while being held hostage in an elevator that got stuck between two floors.

I think there is still a gulf of skill difference between L/L to C/P so am a bit concerned for Boston that the scoring is so close here regardless of the botched twizzle. But also to C/P and their team, those two have come so far from their Igor days and I am at the point where I watch them and expect them to hit their elements. So much more confidence and attack and choreographically I think they have one of the best RDs this season. A+ for effort and the balls to be doing Carmen. I don't think it stacks up to the really great Carmens of the past but it is a respectable attempt and they make it work for them.

 

[skategal]

You'll have to ask Chris as I still can't figure out what he means.

It means nothing between the scores of the two teams. It will be super close.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

I thought the free dance was later on today with the women’s free, oh dear, I’m watching it now

ZingKol. Just breathtaking, they need to be world silver medalist this year. They are mesmerizing. I’m gonna make them world silver medalist even though not on the world team. I mean come on now. Did they just have a Kissypoo on that last dance spin?

CarPon. Oh dear, I’ll try to get through a Carmen program. Molested the judges and almost took out a panel. Not my cup of wild turkey.

LaLa I just have had too much of this music. Twizzle mishap. Not my cup of makers mark.

ChoBat. Best dressed, even though he usually looks like car valet. I like the mood of the program, and I generally am a fan of Take Five. quite nice I have enjoyed this program all year long.

GilHusband. BEST MALE COSTUME EVAHHHHHHHHHHHHH. Is her dress new? And the red flower in the hair complements the entire look. This is spectacular. OK the technical score is 1/2 a point behind Madison and Evan but they have a one point lead going into this. Now this is a competition. I have a feeling they’re gonna squeak this out with a few tenths of a point.

They did it. Wow.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

No BINGOs so we can't kill GilPor's costumes.

Who would want to? His costume needs to go onto the Smithsonian. I love it.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

I am watching the ceremony, oh my goodness his costume is everything. This costume is that all the right sorts of everything. Brilliant.

 

[PRlady]

I am watching the ceremony, oh my goodness his costume is everything. This costume is that all the right sorts of everything. Brilliant.

And this is why gay men and straight women misunderstand each other. As in, I can’t understand how you can stand that costume. He doesn’t even have a great back.

 

[victorskid]

Does Judge No.3 have some relationship or money tied up with Fabbri/Ayer? Her relative scoring of Chock/Bates, Gilles/Poirier, Lajoie/Lagha, Carreira/Ponomarenko, and Fabbri/Ayer is interesting.

The judges:

Judge No.1	Ms. Virpi KUNNAS-HELMINEN	ISU
Judge No.2	Mr. Mark STORTON	ISU
Judge No.3	Ms. Akiko KOBAYASHI	ISU
Judge No.4	Mr. Massimo ORLANDINI	ISU
Judge No.5	Ms. So Young AN	ISU
Judge No.6	Ms. Vera TAUCHMANOVA	ISU
Judge No.7	Mr. John MILLIER	ISU
Judge No.8	Ms. Limin JAO	ISU
Judge No.9	Ms. Fan YANG	ISU

 

[Former Lurve Goddess]

And this is why gay men and straight women misunderstand each other. As in, I can’t understand how you can stand that costume. He doesn’t even have a great back.

He does have a pretty good butt but that jacket does him no favours.

 

[peibeck]

Nothing to do with the podium, but the tech calling here seemed very severe. I know some here find no issue, but if you're scratching your head going "How did that only get a level one?" it makes it appear like a bit of shenanigans.

A few impressions:
LOVED Jianing Xing. Incredible detail, down to his fierce head bops! Sadly I'm guessing the younger Chinese team is headed to Boston, as they didn't impress me at all.

Yoshita/Merida were really lovely. I really enjoyed them a lot more than the hometown Korean team, even though Hannah Lim is a fierce dive.

I don't know that I'd noticed before how brilliant Harris/Chan's spins are, as they are rather lost in that oil spill in the "Blue Danube" program, but props to them on those elements which are top notch.

Zingas, Carreira, and LaJoie seemed way off their game today, and not just on the twizzles. Clunky out of lifts, inconsistent in the spacing with their partners... sigh.

Not a fan of the program, but CarPom did their best skate here at 4CC. Can I reiterate for the 1000th time, how much I detest the dry hump against the judges stand though?

I think for LaLa I've finally figured out why this "Sound of Silence" doesn't work for me... it's actually too pretty, too tame. When James/Cipres first used this music their explosiveness and rawness worked for the music. It was gritty, like the singer's voice. LaLa are the exact opposite. Beverly Sills could sing Metallica, but... should she?

In his commentary Chris mentioned Gilles/Poirere's dance is fluid, but lacks detail, and I think that's a prime reason it falls short for me. Just compare their "tango" with the Finns. It's like play-acting. I do love them, but honestly this FD is a weak version of the Joni Mitchell program.

Chock/Bates need to bring more attack in Boston. Going into the Olympic cycle, if they want to win... they need to win decisively. Getting by with a half point or point margin isn't a secure place to be in, as these results reflect. As much as I rail about the Disco Brits, they don't hold back. C/B need some of that chutzpah. And since Evan is apparently a jazz fan, I'll throw out they could do a FIERCE "Fabulous Baker Boys" program. Maddie in a slinky red, Michelle Pfeiffer dress, shimmying about to "Makin Whoopee"? Yes, please.

 

[peibeck]

Who would want to? His costume needs to go onto the Smithsonian. I love it.

Erm... He's not American, it wouldn't go into the Smithsonian. Unless Mango Mussolini gets his way and makes Canada our "51st state." And even then I doubt he'd be celebrating a gay guy's skating outfit.

 

[Karen-W]

LOVED Jianing Xing. Incredible detail, down to his fierce head bops! Sadly I'm guessing the younger Chinese team is headed to Boston, as they didn't impress me at all.

Xiao/He don't have the CTES mins for Worlds, so Ren/Xing will get the nod for Boston since they earned the CTES mins last week at AWG.

 

[peibeck]

Xiao/He don't have the CTES mins for Worlds, so Ren/Xing will get the nod for Boston since they earned the CTES mins last week at AWG.

Alas, but thanks for the info.

 

[kwanfan1818]

He doesn’t even have a great back.

It’s not about his back.

——-
Gilles/Poirier’s full-program tango is one of my favorite tango programs ever. This program’s tango interlude is just generic.

 

[SkateFanBerlin]

Don`t know much about dance (any of it, really). But it was the choreo of Zing/Kol I found so interesting. Richaud (sp) did it, I think. I watched every bit of it.

 

[NinjaTurtles]

The judges:

​

Judge No.1	Ms. Virpi KUNNAS-HELMINEN	ISU
Judge No.2	Mr. Mark STORTON	ISU
Judge No.3	Ms. Akiko KOBAYASHI	ISU
Judge No.4	Mr. Massimo ORLANDINI	ISU
Judge No.5	Ms. So Young AN	ISU
Judge No.6	Ms. Vera TAUCHMANOVA	ISU
Judge No.7	Mr. John MILLIER	ISU
Judge No.8	Ms. Limin JAO	ISU
Judge No.9	Ms. Fan YANG	ISU

Weird, shouldn’t the judges and their numbers stay the same between the RD and the FD? I think the ISU page might be screwed up.

Hmm, SkatingScores has it consistent between RD and FD (Limin Jao of Canada).

 

[tony]

Weird, shouldn’t the judges and their numbers stay the same between the RD and the FD? I think the ISU page might be screwed up.

Hmm, SkatingScores has it consistent between RD and FD (Limin Jao of Canada).

As always, panels shift between segments of the competition in ISU Championships. Some(times***) judges are dropped, some are added.

Limin Jao was judge 3 in the RD, judge 8 in the FD- Skating Scores reflects that, too.

 

[NinjaTurtles]

As always, panels shift between segments of the competition in ISU Championships.

Cheers. Totally forgot that.

Interesting to consider how much position on the table could reasonably bias results to justify the segment shift.

 

[tony]

Cheers. Totally forgot that.

Interesting to consider how much position on the table could reasonably bias results to justify the segment shift.

Actually, looking at the panels for the completed events, it looks like the ISU only sent enough representatives for one panel but they still followed procedure of the draw for judging seats in each segment. At Euros and certainly at Worlds, those panels shift between events (if, of course, they have enough judges present).

It may very well be that 4CC always only sends one panel that rotates seats, haven't really checked in the past.

 

[victorskid]

Cheers. Totally forgot that.

Interesting to consider how much position on the table could reasonably bias results to justify the segment shift.

To identify the judges, you could easily check on the Entries/Start Orders/Results page for each segment of each discipline:

ISU Four Continents Figure Skating Championships 2025

Event results for ISU Four Continents Figure Skating Championships 2025

results.isu.org

 

[PRlady]

I noted that the caller gave higher levels to the men in each of the top five teams. Agree that Christina, Marjorie, Piper looked a bit off today, and Emilia’s tech still lags Vadym, but I actually thought Chock was precise today. Compared to Nats, anyway.

I like LaLa trying angst. It’s harder to believe in comedic Zack in the RD.

I will never understand that GilPoi FD although I’ve liked the Procol Harem version for 50 years. It’s the worst FD of the top ten teams for me. And I’ve liked many of their other FDs so it’s not bias against the team.

Evan is particularly good at jazz.

 

[tony]

I noted that the caller gave higher levels to the men in each of the top five teams. Agree that Christina, Marjorie, Piper looked a bit off today, and Emilia’s tech still lags Vadym, but I actually thought Chock was precise today. Compared to Nats, anyway.

AFAIK, it's still technical specialist 1 calling the women's element levels and technical specialist 2 calling the men's element levels.

Chock is simply... not as good.. as Bates even on her best day, though.

Outside of the top 5, there were instances when the woman out-leveled the man, though.

 

[~tapdancer~]

Isn't Judy Blumberg the tech specialist? She's always brutal on the calls. And for me it's LaLa, CarPon, and Z/K for the great skates. Always usually is. You all talking about Worlds...how about the Brits and the Italians? I don't think it's a given for C/B (which it shouldn't be anyway) or G/P.

Canada came out pretty well here. Two medals in both pairs and dance.

 

[MacMadame]

It means nothing between the scores of the two teams. It will be super close.

OKay, that makes sense. Even if the phrase makes no sense to be used this way.

Who would want to? His costume needs to go onto the Smithsonian. I love it.

I like the idea of it but I do have two issues. One is that you can kind of see parts of his tattoos on the sides and I find that distracting. Either all of the tattoos or none of them! Second, the material makes the keyhole not even everywhere and that also distracts me. I think it should be made from a smoother fabric or a less thick one -- the type of which I'll leave to the sewers in the group to suggest.

 

[skateboy]

ChoBat. Best dressed, even though he usually looks like car valet.

 

[MacMadame]

Who would want to? His costume needs to go onto the Smithsonian. I love it.

I forgot to say that it's her dress. It's HORRIBLE.

 

[AngieNikodinovLove (ANL)]

I forgot to say that it's her dress. It's HORRIBLE.

Lol Piper? I think it’s really really nice, and a bit different I think that’s how it was earlier in the season.