Craig Simpson & Jamie Sale

[jackson]

You are in a privileged position to be able to put things in a “metaphorical box”.

Are you serious? I'm not speaking for @Louis but you just put them in a literal box. Have you met Louis, and know they are privileged first hand? Please!

 

[Prancer]

Have you met Louis, and know they are privileged first hand?

I have, as have a lot of other posters here, but it isn't necessary to actually know Louis to know he's privileged. He will tell you so right up front and has posted it on this board many times.

I would think, however, that just about anyone who posts here is privileged.

Is there a particular reason we all need to argue about Louis so often?

 

[Amy L]

Is there a particular reason we all need to argue about Louis so often?

Someone has to fill the role of the late Tinami.

 

[Japanfan]

I would think, however, that just about anyone who posts here is privileged.

Doesn't that depend on how you define privilege.

Does having internet access and a computer make a person privileged? Depending on your POV, arguably yes?

 

[once_upon]

I imagine that most of us on FSU, have internet access, computers, ability to read and write, access to food, shelter, ability to stay warm when it is cold outside, etc.

Some of us have more privilege than others on FSU - by virtue of who we are, where we live, what level of stature society has deemed us to be. That's where in first world problems much of who is more privileged that others come into play. Where we get hung up on. Where "woke" comes into the conversation.

When I see pictures, hear stories of 3rd world conditions, people having to walk great distances for water, starvation, horrors of disease ravaged people with maggots eating away. I do reflect on how life is so different for me.

Yes, I'm pissed about the white, older man privileges. But Prancer is right, we ate privileged. Some more than others

 

[On My Own]

Are you serious? I'm not speaking for @Louis but you just put them in a literal box. Have you met Louis, and know they are privileged first hand? Please!

Are you Louis' burner account?

 

[nlloyd]

Are you serious? I'm not speaking for @Louis but you just put them in a literal box.

Let's hope not.

Have you met Louis, and know they are privileged first hand? Please!

There are countries where homosexuality will put on individual in a literal box. To be able to place disapproving attitudes in a metaphorical box is to hold a privileged position.

ETA: I do wonder, though, how much self-respect a person can maintain while engaging with someone who holds the unwavering belief that one is deviant, sinful, and/or perverse.

 

[On My Own]

No one’s worth is less than zero.

A lot of people's worth is less than zero. There are a lot of nazi, war-mongering zealots out there, just as an example. Doesn't mean I want them dead, since it'd make me no different from them. But it does mean I see them as stinkier than donkey poo.

It’s not acceptable for any person to call for the murder of another person.

So you do have a line you draw, but you cannot accept that someone else's line with their own personal life might come before yours? You take the questions I've asked on here and show them to an Islamist zealot from the middle east, they'd be fine with both the Jewish genocide and murder of gay men, as would their close friends and family. Their line comes even farther away from yours.

I’ve had militantly religious employees of various types and as long as they get their work done and don’t bring their religion to the office, it’s fine with me.

You were not talking about "bringing their religion to the office". Here's what you said after which I posed my first question:

If my family told me I had to change my core beliefs to continue seeing them, I’d value being true to my core beliefs above all else.

Fortunately for me, I can maintain friendships and family relationships with people who believe very different things than I do. I’ve always viewed that as part of life and maturity.

What is your problem with people having different boundaries in their own lives for the sake of their own mental health and self-respect? Why is THAT not "part of life and maturity"?

People like Jamie Sale have kept shoving their beliefs into everyone's faces for a bit now. It's not "civil disagreement" from what I can see on twitter. You need to get off your high horse and maybe attempt to see why people want her cut off from their lives. No one's saying "I had an argument with my aunt about this new tax law at Christmas and I cut that bitch out of my life forever".

 

[dogbert]

Jamie is probably obsessed with QANON and all her other right wing rhetoric and doesn’t talk about anything else. She’s probably the aggressor with anyone who disagrees with her, who isn’t totally gung ho the way she is, and/or anyone who wants to talk about something else or asks politely that since they disagree it’ll be better to not talk about such things with them.

Looks like Jamie and Theo Fleury are using their status as gold medallists as a draw for an upcoming event which is reported (and snarked about) by this blogger. Warning - content may be offensive to some readers.

If You Want To Spend An Evening With Theo Fleury, Jamie Sale And Convoy Organizer Chris Barber, Have We Got A Show For You! — Dean Blundell's Sports, News, Podcast Network

If you have an extra $50 and feel like doing some mild reporting from the Cardel Theater in Calgary on October 22,

deanblundell.com

 

[Coco]

Wow, that article was too much, even for me. Not sure what is gained by going after people you disagree with so personally.

 

[VGThuy]

I swear, I haven’t heard the word “convoy” in decades and now I’ve heard it too many times.

This is what I imagine that kind of convoy being like:

 

[allezfred]

I’m fine with the 2002 Olympic silver medalist holding whatever views she likes.

 

[Winnipeg]

I’m fine with the 2002 Olympic silver medalist holding whatever views she likes.

Only if you accept that judge cheating is acceptable. It is a fact one judge cheated which affected the original outcome.

In fairness, the gold medals should have been taken back from the Russians and switched to silver as that would have been the outcome had cheating not occurred.

Having said that, I find JS current views idiotic and reflect her brain and emotional attributes not her skating abilities.

 

[greenapple]

Only if you accept that judge cheating is acceptable. It is a fact one judge cheated which affected the original outcome.

In fairness, the gold medals should have been taken back from the Russians and switched to silver as that would have been the outcome had cheating not occurred.

In fairness, the gold medals should never have been awarded to the Canadians. Even with a tiny mistake the Russian team was superior and did not need any help to win the gold - they did it all by themselves.

S/P skated a tired program we had seen a gazillion times, same costumes, same choreography, same everything.

 

[Winnipeg]

In fairness, the gold medals should never have been awarded to the Canadians. Even with a tiny mistake the Russian team was superior and did not need any help to win the gold - they did it all by themselves.

S/P skated a tired program we had seen a gazillion times, same costumes, same choreography, same everything.

I would preface this by "with all due respect" but check the thread on trite phrases.

Without due respect, throughout the season before the Olys, S and P consistently beat the Russians when they both skated cleanly. At the Olys, the Russians did not and the Canadians did AND it was proven one judge cheated.

OMG, here we go again

 

[Vagabond]

Regardless of who should have won the Pairs Competition in Salt Lake City, Jamie Sale has made her programs unwatchable for me. I feel the same way about Berezhnaya & Sikhularidze's 2002 Olympic programs, but that's down to Marie-Reine Le Gougne & Co., not the skaters themselves.

 

[Winnipeg]

Vagabond - I agree with you re watching those 2002 programs again!

 

[canbelto]

OMFG FOR THE LAST ****ING TIME HOW A SKATER SKATES AND WHETHER YOU LIKE HER SKATING HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HER OFF-ICE BEHAVIOR OR BELIEFS. I CANNOT BELIEVE PEOPLE STILL THINK "JAMIE SALE'S SKATING WAS TRASH SO OF COURSE SHE'S A Q-NUT." WHAT THE ****. THE TWO ARE NOT RELATED FOR THE LAST ****ING TIME.

 

[Vagabond]

OMFG FOR THE LAST ****ING TIME HOW A SKATER SKATES AND WHETHER YOU LIKE HER SKATING HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HER OFF-ICE BEHAVIOR OR BELIEFS.

Here, have a chill pill.

If you want to rewatch Kamila Valieva's programs knowing that she was doped, go right ahead. No one is stopping you.

If you want to rewatch Evgeni Plushenko and Mark Kondratiuk's old programs knowing that they support Russia's invasion of their ancestral homeland, go ahead. No one is stopping you.

If you want to rewatch Wolfgang Schwarz's old programs knowing that he has subsequently been convicted of human trafficking and kidnapping, go ahead. No one is stopping you.

If you want to rewatch Tonya Harding's programs at the 1994 Olympics knowing that the only reason why she was able to skate there at all was that the USFSA was powerless to prevent her, go ahead. No one is stopping you.

All I ask is that you respect my personal decisions as I respect yours.

 

[canbelto]

Here, have a chill pill.

If you want to rewatch Kamila Valieva's programs knowing that she was doped, go right ahead. No one is stopping you.

If you want to rewatch Evgeni Plushenko and Mark Kondratiuk's old programs knowing that they support Russia's invasion of their ancestral homeland, go ahead. No one is stopping you.

If you want to rewatch Wolfgang Schwarz's old programs knowing that he has subsequently been convicted of human trafficking and kidnapping, go ahead. No one is stopping you.

If you want to rewatch Tonya Harding's programs at the 1994 Olympics knowing that the only reason why she was able to skate there at all was that the USFSA was powerless to prevent her, go ahead. No one is stopping you.

All I ask is that you respect my personal decisions as I respect yours.

What you're doing is bullying. You're saying "if you watch these skaters you are a bad person."

 

[Vagabond]

@canbelto Look at your own post. You are trying to control what others think. I sure hope that you don't behave the same way with your students as you do on FSU.

 

[tony]

What you're doing is bullying. You're saying "if you watch these skaters you are a bad person."

No, he's actually not. I think you screaming at people in caps was actually doing it more-so.

Everyone here is allowed to associate off-ice actions with on-ice actions without your nonsense conclusion that 'because the skating was bad, of course they must be this'. For some people, the two actions cannot be separated and that's okay, but it's not because of the way you are phrasing it.

Look in the Nathan Chen/Fauci post. Figure skating fans saying they are unfollowing him, never watching him again, etc. because of associating with Fauci. They loved Nathan just fine until he supported something that bothers them personally.

I personally can separate the two and still enjoy programs of skaters like idiot Alexei Yagudin who has put his foot in his mouth more times than countable now about trans people, about trashing little children who try to skate tribute programs to him, etc. I still think most of his 1999-2002 programs were some of the best in men's skating.

That's me doing me and I don't care what anyone else thinks about the situation.

 

[VGThuy]

In more annoying news, I’ve had that stupid “Convoy” song stuck in my head all day. Now my son keeps going “Convoy!”

 

[canbelto]

@canbelto Look at your own post. You are trying to control what others think. I sure hope that you don't behave the same way with your students as you do on FSU.

No I'm not. What I'm saying is that it's ****ing dumb as shit to think that someone's skating has anything to do with how someone is off the ice. Like if Lebron James is amazing on the court, that must make him a great person?

How well you do triple jumps has ****ING NOTHING to do with how you are off the court. Your on-ice accomplishments and off-ice personality are not related, and I can't believe grown adults actually think they're related.

 

[tony]

No I'm not. What I'm saying is that it's ****ing dumb as shit

You're a teacher; you certainly know better.

How well you do triple jumps has ****ING NOTHING to do with how you are off the court. Your on-ice accomplishments and off-ice personality are not related, and I can't believe grown adults actually think they're related.

Who said that in this thread?

 

[VGThuy]

No I'm not. What I'm saying is that it's ****ing dumb as shi

to think that someone's skating has anything to do with how someone is off the ice. Like if Lebron James is amazing on the court, that must make him a great person?

How well you do triple jumps has ****ING NOTHING to do with how you are off the court. Your on-ice accomplishments and off-ice personality are not related, and I can't believe grown adults actually think they're related.

How many people have said she’s a bad person because she’s a bad skater? Or vice versa? I haven’t really seen that expressed here. I think most people think she’s either a bad person or both a bad person and a bad skater for separate reasons. Now that’s different from saying her off-ice behavior has made me unable to watch her skating anymore, and I think that’s valid. But I still haven’t seen anyone saying it made her a bad skater. They just can’t watch her in general anymore.

Also, we shouldn’t use the “r” word like that.

 

[Wyliefan]

@canbelto Can you please make your point without using the r-word?

 

[canbelto]

Who said that in this thread?

Vagabond and a whole bunch of others. Somehow, Sale's sad mental meltdown is related to her not being as good of a skater as B&S in SLC and thus her gold should be revoked? What the ****. It's not related. You can think she wasn't as good as B&S and that her current mental state is sad. You can think that S&P deserved the gold and that her current mental state is sad.

 

[canbelto]

@canbelto Can you please make your point without using the r-word?

Removed. But my point still stands. It astounds me that grown adults think that someone's skating is reflective of that person's off-ice behavior.

 

[Wyliefan]

Thank you.