The Shibutanis Thread 4: Ready for Paradise

I completely agree. I'm still lukewarm on this program (Evolution was just it for me), but I preferred their earlier outings. I agree with @SpunSilver that Fix You is done. Leave it where it is. I will say that I did like the "the stuck in reverse" with Maia dismounting the lift in reverse in the earlier iteration, that was subtle and and wonderfully done.

I think the harking back to FU so explicitly will also feed the perception that they've skated to Coldplay for "3 years straight". Also self-referential programs make me nervous in Olympic year after V/M's Seasons.

I hope they have enough time tbh. The tinkering really worked with Evolution because you saw the evolution of the program over the entire season.
 
I'm so sad for them! :( Hopefully they skate perfectly at the Olympics. I mean they barely lost here with a very noticeable mistake which is different from skating cleanly and getting passed up by another team. Anyway, they just looked like they needed a hug so... (((Shibs)))
 
Thanks, I will listen for that.

About the team event: everyone seems to think the Shibs will do the SD only. I agree. I actually think whoever does the FD is a little screwed because it's longer and makes it a tad less likely that they can hit twice. (Cf Julia Lipnitskaya.) It's better that the Shibs be fresh for the individual event IMO.

Just took a look at the rumormongering in the Ice Dance thread. It was just one person (whom I don't know at all) and it wasn't so much the content as the snarky insinuation. "The Shibs always get what they want." Yeah right. Is there a rich-Asian stereotype like rich-Jew stereotype? I am picking up racist undertones.
 
Firedancer said:
Other than H/D’s cosmo article, the Shibs are the only US dance team I have seen getting attention.
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All of the top three teams got a Cosmo article. Here's the Shibs.
The Shibutanis and Chock and Bates have both received a fair bit of press partially because they were invited to both media events while Hubbell and Donohue were only invited to the later media summit.
 
Spun Silver said:
Thanks, I will listen for that.

About the team event: everyone seems to think the Shibs will do the SD only. I agree. I actually think whoever does the FD is a little screwed because it's longer and makes it a tad less likely that they can hit twice. (Cf Julia Lipnitskaya.) It's better that the Shibs be fresh for the individual event IMO.

Just took a look at the rumormongering in the Ice Dance thread. It was just one person (whom I don't know at all) and it wasn't so much the content as the snarky insinuation. "The Shibs always get what they want." Yeah right. Is there a rich-Asian stereotype like rich-Jew stereotype? I am picking up racist undertones.
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Agreed. I've been hearing things about that about the Shibs on FSU for like 8 years now. It wasn't a lot, but it was little comments and ideas about them and their parents. It's happening again.

As for doing both, it worked for Meryl and Charlie and I think them and Tessa/Scott doing both made it clear that they were gold medal favorites.
 
DreamsofBliss said:
All of the top three teams got a Cosmo article. Here's the Shibs.
The Shibutanis and Chock and Bates have both received a fair bit of press partially because they were invited to both media events while Hubbell and Donohue were only invited to the later media summit.
Click to expand...
Oh, I saw those! They're good! I didn't notice they were from Cosmo. Thanks!
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
Agreed. I've been hearing things about that about the Shibs on FSU for like 8 years now. It wasn't a lot, but it was little comments and ideas about them and their parents. It's happening again.

As for doing both, it worked for Meryl and Charlie and I think them and Tessa/Scott doing both made it clear that they were gold medal favorites.
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Maybe it is the same person who makes similar comments about Isabella Tobias and others.
 
I would prefer they do only SD too, I got traumatized with Yulia in Sochi. If it were up to me, the team event would not exist
 
It's not going to happen, but I would love them to do both because I think it'd be a real vote of confidence in them by the USFS and they could replicate Meryl/Charlie. That said, the USFS doesn't give a shit about ice dance and about promoting their top ice dance team for the past two seasons and politicking for them the way all the other feds do.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
It's not going to happen, but I would love them to do both because I think it'd be a real vote of confidence in them by the USFS and they could replicate Meryl/Charlie. That said, the USFS doesn't give a shit about ice dance and about promoting their top ice dance team for the past two seasons and politicking for them the way all the other feds do.
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Alas, I think that ship just sailed. So it's best IMO to look at it positively. They will still have a chance at a team medal and an individual medal and be fresher for the later event. No point dwelling on what they can't have. I feel worse for whichever team doesn't get to do the team event, likely C/B. Which is weird with their winning the FD two years in a row at Nats, but Maddie and Zach are hotter in both senses of the word.
 
I think the team event will depend on whether USFS feels they want/need to split the ladies.

DreamsofBliss said:
All of the top three teams got a Cosmo article. Here's the Shibs.
The Shibutanis and Chock and Bates have both received a fair bit of press partially because they were invited to both media events while Hubbell and Donohue were only invited to the later media summit.
Click to expand...

Thanks! I saw the Shibs & H/D but didn’t know C/B got one as well.
 
VIETgrlTerifa said:
Agreed. I've been hearing things about that about the Shibs on FSU for like 8 years now. It wasn't a lot, but it was little comments and ideas about them and their parents. It's happening again.
Click to expand...
I'm sorry to hear that. It's ugly and disgusting even if it actually reflects on the speaker, not the Shibs. No wonder you are so sensitive about them. The only thing I was aware of was something or another to do with Dave Lease and I didn't know or care what it was. I've had it with him.
 
Damn, last year we never got see their gala performance, and it seems will be the same this year :wall:
 
I love the Shibs and want them always to do well, but this season I just think H/D have the stronger programs. I don't think this result will bring Maia and Alex down though and I know that by the time the Olys roll around, they'll be in fighting shape to try for the podium. And if they get it, I'll be cheering.
 
I'm sure the more in teknik people here are already aware so excuse me if I'm belaboring the obvious. I realize that the Shibs haven't been maximizing their step levels all season. What shocked me into noticing today was the high TES score put up by HB. I found they got lev 4 on both their step sequences. HD and CB each got a 3 and a 4. Shibs got two 3s. Same at Ros Cup and SA. At the GPF they got a 3 and a 2. Now that's a lot of points. It almost looks like they're not trying for lev 4 steps but trying to win by other means. What do you guys think?

HB's TES went from 52.65 at Skate America to 61.04 today by raising their three level 3s to 4s, with higher GOE as well. But Maia and Alex only went from 56.01 at Ros Cup to 57.95 at SA to 57.26 today. It's almost like running in place. It's a little worrisome.

I am also a big fan of Mirai, another skater who doesn't get gifted by judges. Her strategy this season has been to rack up massive TES so there is less latitude for the judges to kill her on the more subjective components. A poster in her fan thread has been drumming this point into us so it's on my mind. Again, sorry if I'm repeating the obvious.
 
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Spun Silver said:
I'm sure the more in teknik people here are already aware so excuse me if I'm belaboring the obvious. I realize that the Shibs haven't been maximizing their step levels all season. What shocked me into noticing today was the high TES score put up by HB. I found they got lev 4 on both their step sequences. HD and CB each got a 3 and a 4. Shibs got two 3s. Same at Ros Cup and SA. At the GOF they got a 3 and a 2. Now that's a lot of points. It almost looks like they're not trying for lev 4 steps but trying to win by other means. What do you guys think?

HB's TES went from 52.65 at Skate America to 61.04 today by raising their three level 3s to 4s, with higher GOE as well. But Maia and Alex only went from 56.01 at Ros Cup to 57.95 at SA to 57.26 today. It's almost like running in place. It's a little worrisome.

I am also a big fan of Mirai, another skater who doesn't get gifted by judges. Her strategy this season has been to rack up massive TES she can so there is less latitude for the judges to kill her on the more subjective components. A poster in her fan thread has been drumming this point into us so it's on my mind. Again, sorry if I'm repeating the obvious.
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Not the best angle but in the circular step seq I think Maia lowered her left foot here https://youtu.be/HNx-mhZGJ34?t=85, probably touched the ice, and the mistake in the diagonal is obvious. I hope they fix it, they can do it.
 
Spun Silver said:
I am also a big fan of Mirai, another skater who doesn't get gifted by judges. Her strategy this season has been to rack up massive TES so there is less latitude for the judges to kill her on the more subjective components. A poster in her fan thread has been drumming this point into us so it's on my mind. Again, sorry if I'm repeating the obvious.
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Don't forget though that Single and Pair elements are much more easier to see and understand, rather than ID elements. In ID there is room for "subjectivity" (;)) even in TES.
 
chapis said:
Not the best angle but in the circular step seq I think Maia lowered her left foot here, probably touched the ice https://youtu.be/HNx-mhZGJ34?t=85, and the mistake in the diagonal is obvious. I hope they fix it, they can do it.
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(Are you an ice dancer?)
I can imagine the bigger mistake would account for the loss of a level, but do you think that just touching her foot down would? In other words, do you think without those two mistakes they would have two level 4 steps?
 
Spun Silver said:
(Are you an ice dancer?)
I can imagine the bigger mistake would account for the loss of a level, but do you think that just touching her foot down would? In other words, do you think without those two mistakes they would have two level 4 steps?
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hahah, no, I am not ice dancer. But as far as I understand it, all turns must be completed correctly to get a level 4, and those mistakes were made in the turns, the stumbling was doing a turn too. Teams lost levels for no visible mistakes, so of course when it is visible they should lost the level, I mean, I know of a particular team where this kind of mistakes are overlooked often but the technical pannel never overlooked those mistakes with the Shibs
 
Was kind of sad to see the final result. But hopefully these are errors that they're gettting out of their system now as opposed to making them at the Olympics. It's too bad for them though that they couldn't hang onto first place.

I can't believe how close the top 3 couples were. This is going to make the race to the medals even more heated and exciting.
 
teacakes said:
Also self-referential programs make me nervous in Olympic year after V/M's Seasons.
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I have had that gut feeling all season. But this program can be magical on its own ... just not so much listening to them explain it as their journey. (Frankly, I have come to hate it when anyone uses the word journey. Meryl did it all the time! It's so hackneyed!) Paradise works for me as a universal story of having a dream, losing it and finally capturing it. That anyone can identify with.
 
chapis said:
And did you notice how close Alex was again to the boards?:eek: https://imgur.com/a/ry037 I was afraid that he would hit the boards again, I know they are trying cover the most ice possible but my poor heart was with tachycardia :drama:.
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Maybe it's a sign that they're pushing it in terms of their ice coverage and making their patterns as large as possible? If so, it's a step in the right direction as opposed to skating conservatively.

Of course, you have to find the right balance and make sure you stay in control as well. I still remember Denkova & Stavisky going all out during their 2006 Olympic OD and they were times where they looked almost out of control which resulted in errors.
 
gk_891 said:
Maybe it's a sign that they're pushing it in terms of their ice coverage and making their patterns as large as possible? If so, it's a step in the right direction as opposed to skating conservatively.

Of course, you have to find the right balance and make sure you stay in control as well. I still remember Denkova & Stavisky going all out during their 2006 Olympic OD and they were times where they looked almost out of control which resulted in errors.
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yes, they have been so criticized about it that they do not want to leave doubts about their ice coverage, since last season we saw the improvement but this season is definitely very visible. And Alex told a reporter that the Olympics are to take risks, then they are definitely taking risks, the speed of their twizzles plus the amount of twizzles they are doing is also very risky in my opinion.
 
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