Why isn't Zhulin being banned?

[Trillian]

If Leduc is not a man he is not eligible for pairs

2021/2022 Clarification from Sports Technical Director and Technical Committee PAIR SKATING Group 1 Lift
QUESTION: What part of the Woman’s body needs to remain below the Man’s Shoulder to be called a Group 1 Lift?
ANSWER: At least some part of the Woman’s body must remain below the Man’s Shoulder to be called Group 1 Lift.

Leduc must face ban if not man

*they

And good point, if we don’t keep enforcing the same regressive gender binary in pairs skating until the end of time, people’s shoulders are going to be just … like … everywhere. Total chaos. Thanks for enlightening everyone as to why Olympic coaches do in fact need to engage in hate speech against athletes. We must preserve the integrity of Group 1 lifts at all costs.

 

[caseyedwards]

*they

And good point, if we don’t keep enforcing the same regressive gender binary in pairs skating until the end of time, people’s shoulders are going to be just … like … everywhere. Total chaos. Thanks for enlightening everyone as to why Olympic coaches do in fact need to engage in hate speech against athletes. We must preserve the integrity of Group 1 lifts at all costs.

There is no hate speech at all. That’s ridiculous. There is a real issue if someone is taking a man’s place who is not a man the team is totally ineligible under existing rules and regulations

 

[love_skate2011]

I think Binary just a word to commit someone they belong like Demi Lovato
who is undergoing psychotic or mental breakdown at the moment.

Leduc I dont think he did a sex change like that Canadian Quinn who was a man and
that Laurel Hubbard from New Zealand who had gone testosterone changes to compete in women weightlifting

 

[overedge]

I think Binary just a word to commit someone they belong like Demi Lovato
who is undergoing psychotic or mental breakdown at the moment.

Leduc I dont think he did a sex change like that Canadian Quinn who was a man and
that Laurel Hubbard from New Zealand who had gone testosterone changes to compete in women weightlifting

It's hard to know where to start with the ignorance in this statement, but Quinn was never a man. Quinn was raised as a woman and identified as a woman, and competed (and still competes) on the Canadian women's soccer team.

And someone does not undergo a gender change just to be able to compete in the other gender's part of the sport.

 

[Trillian]

There is no hate speech at all.

Calling people “freaks” because of their gender identity in a public forum meets every definition of hate speech I’ve ever seen.

 

[love_skate2011]

Calling people “freaks” because of their gender identity in a public forum meets every definition of hate speech I’ve ever seen.

Its the right to Free Speech so No

 

[caseyedwards]

Calling people “freaks” because of their gender identity in a public forum meets every definition of hate speech I’ve ever seen.

It’s only rude not hateful

Pair skating is the skating of two persons in unison who perform their movements in such harmony with each other as to give the impression of genuine pair skating as contrasted with independent single skating. Attention should be paid to the selection of an appropriate partner.
A. In pair skating competitions, only pairs of the same composition (lady and man, two ladies or two men) may compete
against each other.
7030 Clothing and Equipment – Pairs

So this means USFS is guilty of hate speech?

When is all USFS banned?

 

[overedge]

Its the right to Free Speech so No

Free speech doesn't include the right to say hateful or discriminatory things. In most countries, free speech only means that you are free to speak out against the government.

 

[Trillian]

A. In pair skating competitions, only pairs of the same composition (lady and man, two ladies or two men) may compete
against each other.
7030 Clothing and Equipment – Pairs

So this means USFS is guilty of hate speech?

When is all USFS banned?

If that’s supposed to be a direct equivalent to Zhulin’s language, you must have forgotten to quote the name-calling portion of it. Otherwise, all I see is outdated language that needs to be re-evaluated.

 

[love_skate2011]

Free speech doesn't include the right to say hateful or discriminatory things. In most countries, free speech only means that you are free to speak out against the government.

Defamation ? Slander ? whatever applies to countries if the person involve files a case, but it doesn't apply from two different countries.
So Free Speech wins here.

It would be ridicoulous if you get arrested or punished just for saying that Hubbard and that Quinn shouldnt have been allowed to compete in ladies discipline.

 

[love_skate2011]

It’s only rude not hateful

. In pair skating competitions, only pairs of the same composition (lady and man, two ladies or two men) may compete
against each other.


So this means USFS is guilty of hate speech?

When is all USFS banned?

maybe some posters here want a real "Blades of Glory"

 

[love_skate2011]

And someone does not undergo a gender change just to be able to compete in the other gender's part of the sport.

wow that's even more shocking, even if you take pills to lower down testosterone, teh advatange physically will still be there.

 

[overedge]

Defamation ? Slander ? whatever applies to countries if the person involve files a case, but it doesn't apply from two different countries.
So Free Speech wins here.

It would be ridicoulous if you get arrested or punished just for saying that Hubbard and that Quinn shouldnt have been allowed to compete in ladies discipline.

Defamation and slander are about speech that insults a person's character or morals or reputation. That is completely separate from free speech.

 

[overedge]

wow that's even more shocking, even if you take pills to lower down testosterone, teh advatange physically will still be there.

The IOC wants you to know that testosterone levels are no longer important for trans athletes. https://www.insider.com/ioc-trans-women-shouldnt-reduce-testosterone-to-compete-at-olympics-2021-11

 

[skatingguy]

It's so nice when two of the biggest FSU trolls can come together and agree on something.

 

[Trillian]

Defamation ? Slander ? whatever applies to countries if the person involve files a case, but it doesn't apply from two different countries.
So Free Speech wins here.

It would be ridicoulous if you get arrested or punished just for saying that Hubbard and that Quinn shouldnt have been allowed to compete in ladies discipline.

The IOC’s rules apply. We’re talking about a single governing body for athletics, not two countries whose laws disagree. They’re not going to start randomly arresting people around the world, but they can certainly decide that participants in their events aren’t allowed to discriminate against other participants in their events.

 

[attyfan]

The right of free speech would protect Zhulin from criminal prosecution. It doesn't mean that there are no consequences, such as professional discipline.

 

[MacMadame]

The right of free speech would protect Zhulin from criminal prosecution. It doesn't mean that there are no consequences, such as professional discipline.

It's also not a right everywhere.

 

[sjs5572]

The right of free speech would protect Zhulin from criminal prosecution. It doesn't mean that there are no consequences, such as professional discipline.

Delete

 

[VGThuy]

It's so nice when two of the biggest FSU trolls can come together and agree on something.

It’s like the romance of our time is unfolding before our very eyes.

 

[On My Own]

A. In pair skating competitions, only pairs of the same composition (lady and man, two ladies or two men) may compete

Wait, there are F/F and M/M pairs?

Can someone link

 

[kirkbiggestfan]

I do hope Leduc gets invited to the Olympic gala and gets to perform I’m a freak with Zhulin’s face on his fabulous outfit. There are other ways to respond to fools.

 

[overedge]

Wait, there are F/F and M/M pairs?

Can someone link

The Gay Games has a category for same-sex pairs, and I think ISI has a category that can include them too.

I don't know if this woman is still competing. https://www.plover.com/rainbowice/laura.html

 

[bcash]

It’s only rude not hateful

Pair skating is the skating of two persons in unison who perform their movements in such harmony with each other as to give the impression of genuine pair skating as contrasted with independent single skating. Attention should be paid to the selection of an appropriate partner.
A. In pair skating competitions, only pairs of the same composition (lady and man, two ladies or two men) may compete
against each other.
7030 Clothing and Equipment – Pairs

So this means USFS is guilty of hate speech?

When is all USFS banned?

I'm sure USFS meant "Man" as a physical definition, not a gender identity one.

 

[Trillian]

I'm sure USFS meant "Man" as a physical definition, not a gender identity one.

Timothy has referred to themself as “the lifting partner,” which is a great example of how the language in the rule books could be updated to be more inclusive.

 

[VGThuy]

Timothy has referred to themself as “the lifting partner,” which is a great example of how the language in the rule books could be updated to be more inclusive.

This may also give way to same sex pairs.

 

[On My Own]

I don't think same sex pairs are going to happen for the ISU competitions, nor are they going to change the "man/woman" language any time soon.

 

[love_skate2011]

If Leduc even gets featured news in Breitbart or Fox, He wouldnt be praised at all.

His support is not Universal, sorry.

 

[On My Own]

If Leduc even gets featured news in Breitbart or Fox, He wouldnt be praised at all.

His support is not Universal, sorry.

It doesn't matter what people who read Breitbart and watch Fox News really "think", unfortunately.

It also doesn't matter if Le Duc's support isn't universal. There's no reason to be calling anyone a "freak". All Zhulin had to do was shut up, but he chose to be an indecent human being instead.

 

[overedge]

If Leduc even gets featured news in Breitbart or Fox, He wouldnt be praised at all.

His support is not Universal, sorry.

yes, I think Zhulin's comments made it pretty clear that not everyone supports him.