Shibutani Return for Olympic Season

[Karen-W]

Please don't take this the wrong way, but do you get any enjoyment whatsoever watching skating?

That is not the correct question to ask of that poster. It's "why do you continue to participate in the FSU community when you clearly think you're better/smarter/more evolved than everyone else here?"

 

[MacMadame]

I can’t wait to see all of your expressions when Turkkila and Versluis podium.

They are pretty popular here so I think people's expressions would be along the lines of surprised delight.

 

[Karen-W]

They are pretty popular here so I think people's expressions would be along the lines of surprised delight.

Now, now, now... You know that there are limits to "surprised delight" entirely dependent on where who they beat falls within each fan's own Ice Dance Uber Matrix.

 

[MacMadame]

Now, now, now... You know that there are limits to "surprised delight" entirely dependent on where who they beat falls within each fan's own Ice Dance Uber Matrix.

I should have said some people.

 

[skatfan]

Fanwarring between Shibs and Hubbell/Donohue is like fanwarring between Russian team 1 and Russian team 2: I literally don't remember what they've done at this point, and am baffled others do, so I'll have to take your word for it.

It's like when a Kaetlyn Osmond tweet got 500 likes. Why? How? Who? And yet there she was. I had to google how to type her name, even, apparently she won worlds?!

And a bronze medal in Pyeyoungchang (plus Canada team gold).

 

[On My Own]

Please don't take this the wrong way, but do you get any enjoyment whatsoever watching skating?

I think there's a reason why singles is more popular, it's because people can scream over more intuitive things like jumps, much like they do over football/soccer. So the suggestion is a completely serious one, but one that cannot be done because it's too hard to do with ID.

And yeah, I used to love skating, but haven't at all during this quad. I think it's a combination of ever worse rules, and skaters who've learned how to game the system a bit too well. Beijing was also the last full quad where skaters who'd been raised under 6.0 ideals competed (Sui/Han and Hanyu), unless I'm forgetting someone, and it kinda shows. (ETA: No one @ me with Jason)

If this is purely about ID though, I stand by every word I've said - awful sport that barely is a sport, looks terrible, is an insult to the word 'dance', and is filled with predators and people should stop supporting its existence already.

 

[VGThuy]

On a more serious note, even though I’m a Shibs uber, I did root for Chock/Bates in the last quad thanks to the snake charmer FD and the Daft Punk FD. I really hope I love this coming season’s FD too.

 

[cholla]

You're right that teams 5-15 are so much more interesting! S/D always own the FD and it will be a true tragedy if L/B are left off the French team in favor of that new team that shall not be mentioned.

France has 2 spots. Even if the Unmentionables take one (and I assume they will), no other couple can logically surpass L/B for the 2nd.

 

[kwanette]

The Runthrough (Ashley Wagner and Adam Rippon's pod) came out of their planned hiatus to do an "emergency" episode on the Shibutani's return (and implored all other skaters planning on making a comeback to wait till September so they can have a break ) and I kind of like their take--whether or not they medal or not, the Shibs combined with F-B/C (so weird to write) return could--or at least should--light a fire under certain teams to be more creative and up their games.

Like some have already written, the last two seasons have felt stale. F-B/C have a lot of and are a new team and the Shibs have been gone so long they might as well be a new team, has made me A LOT more curious about this upcoming season. While I don't think C/B, and G/P have that much to be worried about and probably won't change their plans at all, if I were F/L and G/F are at the very least...concerned about F-B/C and will (hopefully) be a little more intentional in their choices of FD. I doubt C-Pom are that concerned about making the Olympics, but I'm really interested to see how G/P, Browns, and Z/K react to the Shibs.

I don't see any situation where the Shibs are #1 or even #2 US but depending on the programs, I can see them having AT LEAST an outside shot at #3 based on the programs of US 4-7.

I'm excited for this season in dance, if not for the teams at least the . I hope the Shibs get everything they want out of their return, especially Maia. While I think maybe too much time has passed for them to be truly competitive, their retirement felt unfinished and I feel like if it had not been for cancer/covid, they might have been at the top of the podium in Beijing, or at least had another Worlds Championship.

Why did their retirement feel unfinished? Why did they not compete at 2018 Worlds? I forget..Without V/M there..they would..or could have moved up a spot..

 

[VGThuy]

Why did their retirement feel unfinished? Why did they not compete at 2018 Worlds? I forget..Without V/M there..they would..or could have moved up a spot..

They went on a whirlwind press tour right after the Olympics. They were not training in the period in-between the Olympics and Worlds. I think people don’t remember just how popular they became with the mainstream audiences after Pyeongchang. Everyone makes fun of them doing Coldplay for the second time as their FD, but the Olympic audience is much broader than the skating one and most of the global audience who would pay more attention to skating at the Olympics never saw “Fix You”, so their “Paradise” FD was also a hit. They were not close to being V/M or even Meryl/Charlie big, but for ice dance in the late 2010s, they had enough fanfare that kept them busy.

That’s why I think some of the posts and podcast takes are really undermining their performance abilities because people are forgetting how much audiences actually enjoyed watching them. Look at Nationals and some Worlds, even during their rut, they almost always had enthusiastic audience support for their performances.

 

[Former Lurve Goddess]

And a bronze medal in Pyeyoungchang (plus Canada team gold).

And a world silver medal. Osmond was Canada's first women's world champion in 45 years and only our 3rd overall - Barbara Ann Scott and Karen Magnussen were the other 2. We knitting needle-holding, standing ovation-giving, maple syrup-drinking Canucks definitely know who Kaetlyn Osmond is and we'll engage in bench-clearing hockey brawls with folks who dispute her greatness.

 

[VGThuy]

Kaetlyn Osmond is one of the best skaters I’ve seen in the 2010s. She had power, clean movement, and was a joy to watch. Her flaw was her flutz, but every other jump she did was probably higher quality than the skaters who typically beat her.

 

[her grace]

Osmond had the best technique of skaters in her era and did it without the Eteri political machine and

 

[On My Own]

Unfortunately, joking aside, I actually do remember Osmond.

She was one of the first skaters on the women's side who overstuffed pointless transitions with less than amazing basic skating into her programs, just look at her 2013 Worlds SP. Which I'm guessing people ignore because she's Canadian. Or perhaps it's okay to be bad as long as we're not drinking to be bad.

ETA: And here's the 2013 LP step sequence for that matter. https://youtu.be/FX3pNX0ce-g?si=anrZimIAXXCv6hnD&t=190 <- all that when the requirements were simpler than in 2015-16 season, where I'd say Medvedeva did much better.

I also wouldn't call her technique the 'best' of her time. Leaving aside the Sochi quadrennial, she competed against Kostner, Tuktamysheva, and Asada, and I'd say all three of them were better jump technicians, and Kostner and Asada also had (far) better basic skating and Asada even had (far) better spins.

Skaters like Higuchi also had some better jumps (axel, most especially). Sakamoto also had better basic skating and some better jumps. Do I need to mention Miyahara's better basic skating, or will we only focus on jumps for her?

Her Lutz was a mess, and she used to lose her axis in the air a lot of the time on the Flip. She also didn't have a particularly amazing axel much of the time.

 

[kwanette]

They went on a whirlwind press tour right after the Olympics. They were not training in the period in-between the Olympics and Worlds. I think people don’t remember just how popular they became with the mainstream audiences after Pyeongchang. Everyone makes fun of them doing Coldplay for the second time as their FD, but the Olympic audience is much broader than the skating one and most of the global audience who would pay more attention to skating at the Olympics never saw “Fix You”, so their “Paradise” FD was also a hit. They were not close to being V/M or even Meryl/Charlie big, but for ice dance in the late 2010s, they had enough fanfare that kept them busy.

That’s why I think some of the posts and podcast takes are really undermining their performance abilities because people are forgetting how much audiences actually enjoyed watching them. Look at Nationals and some Worlds, even during their rut, they almost always had enthusiastic audience support for their performances.

"Everyone"? I did not.. I missed the Kwan-like whirl wind tour..

 

[manhn]

I think it depends. Entertainment these days is so siloed. My podcasts that I listen to are more likely to have the Shibs over, say, Adam, even though I suspect people in this forum believe Adam is more widely known.

 

[On My Own]

While I'm on the topic, I thought this from Alaine Chartrand was better than anything Osmond had ever done in her entire career: https://youtu.be/NHQVHGPnE84?si=fs9AoAELCp3P5W3R

 

[VGThuy]

"Everyone"? I did not.. I missed the Kwan-like whirl wind tour..

Like I said, it wasn’t V/M-level, much less Kwan, but it was enough that it would have stopped their training regiment. They were all over the place doing interviews and appearances. Many of which, you could still watch on YouTube. They could have competed but they wouldn’t have been in top competitive shape, kind of like Kwan as evidenced by her Worlds LP performance.

 

[kwanette]

Like I said, it wasn’t V/M-level, much less Kwan, but it was enough that it would have stopped their training regiment. They were all over the place doing interviews and appearances. Many of which, you could still watch on YouTube. They could have competed but they wouldn’t have been in top competitive shape, kind of like Kwan as evidenced by her Worlds LP performance.

Which one?

 

[olympic]

Kaetlyn Osmond is one of the best skaters I’ve seen in the 2010s. She had power, clean movement, and was a joy to watch. Her flaw was her flutz, but every other jump she did was probably higher quality than the skaters who typically beat her.

Honestly, was superior to those 2 Eteri skaters at Pyeongchang and should've won OGM ....

 

[olympic]

Sorry, they were not going to beat P/C in Beijing. And SinKats unfortunately were a political lock, so they would have bumped H/D off the podium? Nope nope nope.

Bold mine. One of the most unfortunate issues of recent ID history was watching them win medals they IMO did not deserve.