Papadakis/Cizeron #5 - We're In Love With The Shape Of You

[Icetigger]

I don't want to spread gloom and doom, but that Ice Dance Technical Committee meeting gave some ominous news about wanting to make the idiotic Oly Team Event a regular normal part of Ice Skating competitions...

I'm not sure that's exactly what is happening. i took from it that they were just going to give a ranking per country at the end of each event. I.e. it was a strictly mathematical exercise. i don't particularly like this, though: because I don't like the team event, mostly because of its repercussions for selection and the entitling 3rd rate skaters from some skaters to a guaranteed medal at the Olympics which often places them in terms historical record above skaters who should be celebrated much more (I think we discussed this elsewhere): and this sounds like an effort to give the O team event more credibility by their being an equivalent mathematical record throughout the previous four years.

I thought most interesting was the whole "entertainment" (or was it "entertaining"?) thing for next year's free (or should that now be "free") dance, from that meeting. Because entertaining and good are not synonyms in my book, and I can think of plenty of "bad" things I have been entertained by. Plus I have to wonder at whom exactly this criterion is being aimed- whose skates have they identified as not being worthily scored and those whose scores lack an entertainment factor.

But also, what does it mean for P/C? (I Know there was qualification of what it might all mean- i.e. also colourful and engaging, and Halina Poltarak lead a discussion that veered towards saying that maybe that was not the right word). But at the same time, The Price is Right is entertaining, as is most reality tv........ Does every skate now need a set of real Housewives meme worthy moments.

 

[synian]

Accordind to this video of Gabriella & Guillaume at the exhibition yesterday (probably geoblocked) because french tv, we can learn that it is Philippe Candelero with his wife who are in charge of organise and manage the french olumpic tour in France. Gabriella and Guillaume will have the sd exhibition to ed sheeran and another one witch will be choreographed by Candelero and/or his wife. I have the feeling that the eshibition "pray you catch me" is not in the theme chosen by P.Candelero (or appreciated by him...)
Do you get the same feeling ?

https://sport.francetvinfo.fr/patin...gabriella-papadakis-et-guillaume-cizeron-lors
and I appologize to expose anybody to their commentary always without any relative information to it during the performances ....

 

[Anyasnake]

Who told you that?

I forgot to put the link : https://twitter.com/paul_peret/status/977987637037412352
A 2022 European championships in France is long overdue, I was waiting for it ! Well it's just a bid, but ISU would want to host Euros in an Olympic year in a place with medal contenders... This year it was Russia (obvious choice, although Spain could have been a choice too), but France seems like an excellent choice.

 

[Gotlev]

I'm not sure that's exactly what is happening. i took from it that they were just going to give a ranking per country at the end of each event. I.e. it was a strictly mathematical exercise. i don't particularly like this, though: because I don't like the team event, mostly because of its repercussions for selection and the entitling 3rd rate skaters from some skaters to a guaranteed medal at the Olympics which often places them in terms historical record above skaters who should be celebrated much more (I think we discussed this elsewhere): and this sounds like an effort to give the O team event more credibility by their being an equivalent mathematical record throughout the previous four years.

Thanks for the explanation.
The Oly Team Event seems indeed simply a cheap way to increase the medal count for some people. It's obviously childish to add team event medals in comparisons with people who skated when there was no such thing or who happen to skate for a country that isn't an all-rounder.
Yea, we discussed that over on GS.
I was happily over it until Halina started mentioning that team listing. It sounds rotten to me. They listen to the coaches, but clearly not to reason. Hey Halina and co, I am sure that you are absolutely good-willing nice and lovely people, but honestly: THE TEAM EVENT IS ROTTEN!!!! DO THE WORLD AND YOURSELVES A BIG FAVOUR AND THROW IT IN THE WASTE!!!

I thought that in fact the whole 'change' thing looked as if they wanted to promote GabGui's style. Everything sounded like 'we want everybody to be like Gabriella and Guillaume!'.
That's good of course to some extent (Gaby and Guillaume are THEMSELVES and that's what's special about them - it's not duplicable) but all these little rule changes which they seem to think will make a huuuuge difference just seem like a humongous waste of time to me. God, the complications of scoring. How fast can these judges tick off element features??

Dear Technical Committee, PLEASE do something that CHANGES the thing. Get same sex couples to skate together for instance. It's bound to come anyway, so bring it on while it still is an innovation instead of when it will be your last desperate attempt to save you from being left behind in the past.

 

[Gotlev]

I thought most interesting was the whole "entertainment" (or was it "entertaining"?) thing for next year's free (or should that now be "free") dance, from that meeting. Because entertaining and good are not synonyms in my book, and I can think of plenty of "bad" things I have been entertained by. Plus I have to wonder at whom exactly this criterion is being aimed- whose skates have they identified as not being worthily scored and those whose scores lack an entertainment factor.

But also, what does it mean for P/C? (I Know there was qualification of what it might all mean- i.e. also colourful and engaging, and Halina Poltarak lead a discussion that veered towards saying that maybe that was not the right word). But at the same time, The Price is Right is entertaining, as is most reality tv........ Does every skate now need a set of real Housewives meme worthy moments.

Yes, absolutely. What on earth does it mean now? What the hell is <<entertaining>>?
Dear ISU, you know what was REALLY entertaining and super and innovative and great ice dancing? The Duchesnays. They made Ice Dance super popular. And you know what you and your judges did with them? Underscore. And come up with all these technical requirements because you did not like that the Duchesnays were going avant-garde with Ice Dance and made the audience scream for that kind of ice dancing instead of ballroom holipoli hoompahpah.

So here we are today. Technically, ice dance got immensely further due to the requirements and strict rules.
But it also still is stuck in the past on an artistic level. Gaby and Guillaume are showing the way to something else.
The ISU seems to be running behind the facts with your silly '1-point extra if you are Entertaining!' thingy. Start giving 10 points extra for innovation etc. Do something bold. What on earth do you have to lose, I wonder.

 

[Icetigger]

Yes, absolutely. What on earth does it mean now? What the hell is <<entertaining>>?
Dear ISU, you know what was REALLY entertaining and super and innovative and great ice dancing? The Duchesnays. They made Ice Dance super popular. And you know what you and your judges did with them? Underscore. And come up with all these technical requirements because you did not like that the Duchesnays were going avant-garde with Ice Dance and made the audience scream for that kind of ice dancing instead of ballroom holipoli hoompahpah.

So here we are today. Technically, ice dance got immensely further due to the requirements and strict rules.
But it also still is stuck in the past on an artistic level. Gaby and Guillaume are showing the way to something else.
The ISU seems to be running behind the facts with your silly '1-point extra if you are Entertaining!' thingy. Start giving 10 points extra for innovation etc. Do something bold. What on earth do you have to lose, I wonder.

The subject to congress decision ruling on this "entertainment" point is now "enjoyable/colourful/engaging", rather than "entertaining/colourful/engaging" and "DANCE" is capitalised, as per the official isu communication. I am happier with enjoyable, and glad to see the capitalisation. Plus the character choreo step sequence looks interesting. With that amendment I am good; and overall I think the changes are positive ones.

The communication is here https://www.isu.org/communications/16863-isu-communication-2148/file

I think the changes will take everyone out of their comfort zones, including P/C, and that's probably a good thing. The character choreo step sequence is a bit of an anti-abstraction ruling by including the word "character". There seems to be nods to various couples through these rule changes. The choreo sliding movement (with optional spinning) is maybe a nod to the choreo spinning movement of P/C?

If the team event is going to stay am Olympic event, maybe it is best to have a guide through the various seasons as to how everyone is doing?

 

[Gotlev]

The subject to congress decision ruling on this "entertainment" point is now "enjoyable/colourful/engaging", rather than "entertaining/colourful/engaging"

According to the YT audience, skaters smashing on the ice and breaking their limbs are utterly entertaining and enjoyable...

 

[Anyasnake]

Media alert : https://twitter.com/cavousf5/status/978279861847543808
They will be in the "C a Vous" French tak show tonight at 7 p.m. French time, I'll do my best to provide a video

 

[Icetigger]

According to the YT audience, skaters smashing on the ice and breaking their limbs are utterly entertaining and enjoyable...

Well, the dance is capitalised in the communication, so I guess that would rule that out.

Overall though, I think the changes underline that the judges don't want a completely abstract programme. I think that is something that p/c will have to digest.

 

[Minou]

Bises for this: https://www.lequipe.fr/Patinage-art...n-commentent-leur-programme-de-minimes/876074
I won´t have time to type the commentary translation until tomorrow. In the interim, the intro states:

Twelve years ago, BP and GC took part in their first French (National) championships in Bordeaux, in the novice level. At the ages of 10 and 11, the young couple won the competition in their debut. We proposed that they have another look at these images, filmed by Guillaume´s parents. They (BP and GC ) comment on them with much (self-deprecating) humor.

Title cards:

First steps already golden

Novice champions, France, Bordeaux, 2006

Two time world champions

Four times European champions

World -record holders for long and overall program scores.

GP The white slacks were too much. That´s tops. … (laughs)

GC Lycra. Glitter in her hair.

GP Now that was a good idea!

GC High style there!

GP I think that´s going to come back for the Olympics.

Shimmering white slacks.

GC The return of the shimmering white lycra slacks.

GP What a pain those required dances were

GC The worst is that they still do them today.

GC It´s tedious to watch this...especially when it´s me in the video. It makes me peeved.

GP What a magical entrance to the ice we had.

GC We look like 2 big peaches. Papadanakis.

GP That´s us. That´s me Papadanakis. We fall on our faces (fig.) already in the beginning. It´s cute but I don´t remember it at all, the choreography. Nevertheless, it is pretty complicated for children.

GC Oh! Lovely lift. Graceful landing with finesse.

GP I wonder how we could have done that spin with that entrance pirouette.

GC You might say that I am skating with my little sister. We should do a tribute with the same costumes.

GP What was that music!

GC It´s strange because we ecognize the skaters. We´re the same skaters. It is as if someone could recognized someone from their gestures. They are the same. They haven´t changed.


(If you hear the announcer in the background, LeGac was 5th!)

 

[Gotlev]

https://streamable.com/gq4im
This is still working at the moment. Magic. I can watch again and again and again and again. It's mesmerizing.

 

[cocotaffy]

Here is the live stream for TV5 for those of you who speak French and want to watch the broadcast C a vous where they'll give an interview. It's live now but there is a bunch of little reports before the interview: https://www.firstonetv.net/Live/France/France-5-14

 

[Peepsquick]

Here is the live stream for TV5 for those of you who speak French and want to watch the broadcast C a vous where they'll give an interview. It's live now but there is a bunch of little reports before the interview: https://www.firstonetv.net/Live/France/France-5-14

 

[cocotaffy]

And now the video very quickly out on youtube and shouldn't be geoblocked
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrwHN1Ghocw
did they exchange jacket or what ??? way too small for him and way too big for her.

Nothing very new. They do talk about how they dealt mentally with the wardrobe malfunction. They looked at each other in panic but never considered for a moment stopping, mentioning the 5 points loss. Apparently MFD said to them afterwards she was about to shout to stop the music. Gaby talk about her thoughts process as it happened: "I can't believe it's happening at the Olympics but I also thought, this is the Olympics so we need to keep on". Guillaume explains how they are mentally trained to have extremely quick inner dialogue trying to rationalize when sg bad happens in order to get back in the game.
About downtime, they haven't taken any long vacations for 4 years and might do so at this end of such a tiring Olympic cycle (so I guess a late start for them next season).
Then you all get to finally see with your own eyes the famous Nelson Monfort, us French people keep b...ing about.
Little fun fact: Gaby's mum nearly gave birth on the ice, she had her contractions while skating and training.
They then mainly talk about how they begin together, how it was luck bringing them together at such a young age. They talk about her accident asking if they are now more worried about lifts now. She isn't particularly because she didn't fall on a lift. Sometimes trying new lifts she might ask him to put her down not feeling confortable but mainly they're confortable with it. He said he does feel a bit the pressure knowing if she falls it's his fault.
Finally, while on vacation Guillaume is adamant he won't go near a skating rink and the only ice he'll see is in his glass.
My comment: they really need a longer break than in a regular season, refresh, reset and restart.

 

[Miloune]

"C à Vous" has a big audience, it's so nice to see them doing mainstream media (outside of the regular 2 minutes at the 8 o'clock news report). Finally they receive some visibility!
Go P/C !!

 

[cocotaffy]

"C à Vous" has a big audience, it's so nice to see them doing mainstream media (outside of the regular 2 minutes at the 8 o'clock news report). Finally they receive some visibility!
Go P/C !!

Absolutely and the presentators look like they really like them as athletes, especially their composure despite that unfortunate incident, and of course their performances. They mentioned them quite a bit during the Olympics.

 

[Miloune]

Absolutely and the presentators look like they really like them as athletes, especially their composure despite that unfortunate incident, and of course their performances. They mentioned them quite a bit during the Olympics.

Personnally I always loved Anne-Elisabeth Lemoine (the blonde woman) so I'm glad (and not surprised!)

 

[dramagrrl]

The Oly Team Event seems indeed simply a cheap way to increase the medal count for some people. It's obviously childish to add team event medals in comparisons with people who skated when there was no such thing or who happen to skate for a country that isn't an all-rounder.

I tried to resist responding to the hilarity of the above, but the blatant saltiness overwhelmed me and I just couldn't resist.

Dear Technical Committee, PLEASE do something that CHANGES the thing. Get same sex couples to skate together for instance. It's bound to come anyway, so bring it on while it still is an innovation instead of when it will be your last desperate attempt to save you from being left behind in the past.

The only reason I wouldn't support having same-sex dance teams is that all the same-sex teams would inevitably be female-female teams. There is already a shortage of males in ice dance and there is no way two men would pair up when they could have the pick of dozens of girls, especially male dancers who are never going to be of Guillaume's skill and talent and can get female partners that are way better than they are just because there are so many girls looking for partners and so few males to partner them.

 

[MsZem]

Please take your drama to a different thread.

Here is the live stream for TV5 for those of you who speak French and want to watch the broadcast C a vous where they'll give an interview. It's live now but there is a bunch of little reports before the interview: https://www.firstonetv.net/Live/France/France-5-14

I didn't watch the whole thing, but was happy to find that I understood most of what was being said! Figure skating is actually a really good way for me to work on my French, since I usually have a pretty good idea of what's being discussed I'm glad to see them getting such nice coverage.

 

[synian]

Another smail interview after the competition http://rmcsport.bfmtv.com/sports-d-h...o-1403861.html

On the link, as we can learn that the grand prix final will be in france, they implied that Gabby and Guillaume may have thought taking long vacations and miss the grand prix saison next year, this final grand prix held in france could imply they will be push to be there all saison

 

[Twilight1]

Hockey developed around the world because it came to the Olympics. It will take time for the sport to become truly universal. Don't understand the saltiness about the team event...

Gabby looked stunning. LOVE that dress!!

 

[maya1985]

http://www.rtl.fr/sport/autres-spor...que-la-robe-lache-sourit-papadakis-7792784454

 

[Viscaro]

Well, now that I had time to watch, watch and rewatch their FD again (thanks B.ESP), I have to say a few things.

Guillaume really shines in this. In the SD, he's very good - but in the FD he was born for it. His hands and arms in the twizzles... He's wonderful.

And yes, Gabriella is an emotional machine. So touching. Like we discussed before in this thread, she has a softness, a vulnerability that reaches to you.

They really are a treat.

I don't wanna go gloom at the end of this season, maybe we will not see many programs like that anymore - if programs have to become more colorful, more entertaining. Not that colorful and entertaining is bad - but to see only colorful and entertaining programs by everyone is bad. Many great pieces of art aren't colorful, some of my favorites books, paintings or pieces of music are very depressing. One of them literally is called 'Grey clouds' (but hey, grey is a color. So maybe it's colorful ? : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ee1MO9p7xw8).

I understand at the end of the day it's a sport that wins money by TV and therefore you have to go more Hollywood than Berlinale but still.

These last paragraphs weren't only about P/C - I'm sure they will find their way in it. I don't even know how MS would be ranked on this factor. But the programs will be less diversified and interesting if all the teams feel they need to have the same fun vibe. I'll miss the freedom the teams had.

 

[Anyasnake]

Quebecois accent anyone ? https://twitter.com/infosportplus/status/978376812681203712