2023-24 ISU Junior Grand Prix

jlai

jlai

Question everything
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14,083
Karen-W said:
The USFS really should be more strategic here and swap Everhardt and Lin-Gracey, IMO. They won't, because that's not how they roll, but they could screw Lin-Gracey out of the JGPF with this lack of strategic assigning for the remaining skaters.

Sherry Zhang is also going to be in that Budapest field and could play spoiler for other skaters' JGPF dreams.
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I don't agree. We don't strategize by sending strong skaters to weak field in senior GPs. I don't see why such strategizing matters in the jr circuit, esp by the time jr world rolls around. Jr world medals have been won by skaters who don't make it to the final
 
H

Holy Headband

Yuna Aoki's Olympic journey starts here
Messages
1,660
I'm looking at the preliminary standings in the men's event here:


And what jumps out at me is that JGP Poland will probably decide Seo Minkyu's fate. If Ebihara and Strommer finish 1-2 in either order and Lim finishes third, all three will overtake Seo in the standings. And looking at the lineup for that event, it doesn't seem unlikely that the three of them will make up the podium.

Meanwhile, Seo's other compatriot, Kim Hyungyeom, will overtake him if he medals in Budapest this week. Seo will be hoping that Hagara takes gold again and two of Rossi, Supatashvili and Sanchez get on the podium. Any of them will place ahead of Seo with a gold medal, so it will be best for him if Hagara sweeps—but he'll be counting on those three to keep Kim off the podium.

Plus, Chen Yudong is currently registered for both these events and he has the potential to throw all my calculations into disarray. I'm very excited to finally see him. This season's junior men's field has been kinda mediocre, so I hope he can bring the heat.
 
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jlai

jlai

Question everything
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14,083
her grace said:
GPS are seeded, though, which in theory prevents the very lopsided fields that are occurring this JGP season.

OTOH, the very deep events probably more accurately simulate what Jr. worlds will be like. In the words of Edna Mode, “Fight! Win!”
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I guess it depends on what the skater’s goal is. If he/she knows they will likely be going to jr worlds, then it helps to get a taste of a deeper field under the radar. Otoh, if a skater wants to do a jgp or two then go to college, then a chance to medal will matter
 
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L

Lutzes&Loops

Member
Messages
50
Karen-W said:
The USFS really should be more strategic here and swap Everhardt and Lin-Gracey, IMO. They won't, because that's not how they roll, but they could screw Lin-Gracey out of the JGPF with this lack of strategic assigning for the remaining skaters.

Sherry Zhang is also going to be in that Budapest field and could play spoiler for other skaters' JGPF dreams.
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So screwing Sarah not once, but twice (first, giving her the much later assignment and now suggesting that she gets assigned to the war zone competition that might not even happen) is perfectly acceptable and "strategic"... :rolleyes: glad, that's not how they roll.
 
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happycamper2554

Well-Known Member
Messages
381
Katyaever said:
So screwing Sarah not once, but twice (first, giving her the much later assignment and now suggesting that she gets assigned to the war zone competition that might not even happen) is perfectly acceptable and "strategic"... :rolleyes: glad, that's not how they roll.
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This is how they should roll if they want to win. They can give her a late senior as consolation. She’s senior eligible.
 
Karen-W

Karen-W

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43,338
Katyaever said:
So screwing Sarah not once, but twice (first, giving her the much later assignment and now suggesting that she gets assigned to the war zone competition that might not even happen) is perfectly acceptable and "strategic"... :rolleyes: glad, that's not how they roll.
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I'm not sure that Sarah was screwed anymore than any other US Junior woman this season when there were only 8 spots up for grabs to begin with. She should count herself lucky to have been one of the 6 Jr women given any JGP assignment.

As far as the USFS' decison-making in who got what assignment, it seems pretty clear that she was already low on the priority list since she got assigned to JGP #6. She would have been higher had she scored better at the Junior Team Cup - which is why Annika and Elyce got JGP #1 and JGP #3 respectively.

Now, given the tenor of your response to me, I can only surmise that you would be similarly aggrieved had the USFS assigned Sarah to JGP #4 with a field that included 3 Japanese women instead of the usual 2, but so perhaps you should consider it a blessing that Sarah wound up with such a late JGP instead.

As it is, no one knows what will happen with JGP #7 and 2 weeks ago when the initial assignments were due, the conflict between Azerbaijan and Armenia had not yet flared up again. But, perhaps you should direct your ire toward the ISU for awarding this JGP to Armenia less than a year after they had to cancel the one Armenia was to have hosted. I'd have certainly not been awarding them another JGP so soon given the regional instability, but I'm not a member of the ISU Council.

To conclude, go get mad at the people who can do something rather than us armchair quarterbacks who think the USFS isn't making that good of a strategic decision in not switching the assignments around.
 
L

Lutzes&Loops

Member
Messages
50
Karen-W said:
I'm not sure that Sarah was screwed anymore than any other US Junior woman this season when there were only 8 spots up for grabs to begin with. She should count herself lucky to have been one of the 6 Jr women given any JGP assignment.

As far as the USFS' decison-making in who got what assignment, it seems pretty clear that she was already low on the priority list since she got assigned to JGP #6. She would have been higher had she scored better at the Junior Team Cup - which is why Annika and Elyce got JGP #1 and JGP #3 respectively.

Now, given the tenor of your response to me, I can only surmise that you would be similarly aggrieved had the USFS assigned Sarah to JGP #4 with a field that included 3 Japanese women instead of the usual 2, but so perhaps you should consider it a blessing that Sarah wound up with such a late JGP instead.

As it is, no one knows what will happen with JGP #7 and 2 weeks ago when the initial assignments were due, the conflict between Azerbaijan and Armenia had not yet flared up again. But, perhaps you should direct your ire toward the ISU for awarding this JGP to Armenia less than a year after they had to cancel the one Armenia was to have hosted. I'd have certainly not been awarding them another JGP so soon given the regional instability, but I'm not a member of the ISU Council.

To conclude, go get mad at the people who can do something rather than us armchair quarterbacks who think the USFS isn't making that good of a strategic decision in not switching the assignments around.
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I wasn't seeking advice from you on where to direct my "ire". No ire here.
I disagreed with your comments about what you called "strategic thinking". Didn't think they were fair or "strategic". Sarah was 4th at Milwaukee and score-wise was pretty much tied with 3rd place. Why should she have been prioritized below those that were in 5th, 6th and 9th. and now on top of it, reading opinions from "armchair quarterbacks" that she should be shuffled even further down the list...
 
Karen-W

Karen-W

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43,338
Katyaever said:
I wasn't seeking advice from you on where to direct my "ire". No ire here.
I disagreed with your comments about what you called "strategic thinking". Didn't think they were fair or "strategic". Sarah was 4th at Milwaukee and score-wise was pretty much tied with 3rd place. Why should she have been prioritized below those that were in 5th, 6th and 9th. and now on top of it, reading opinions from "armchair quarterbacks" that she should be shuffled even further down the list...
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Well, some of those lower-ranked skaters are ones who medaled on the JGP last season or finished 5th at SENIOR Nats last season. Agree or disagree with the USFS' thought process on those assignments, but I'm not sure why you think Sarah deserved priority assignment over either Soho or Josephine. And, Sherry only got Josephine's spot after Sarah had been assigned to Poland. So, I would hardly call that "prioritizing". Or, do you believe Sarah should have been bumped up to Budapest this week instead?

Clearly, you have some personal affinity for Sarah, otherwise you wouldn't be snitting this argument on a message forum out with some random fan, which is another reason why you wouldn't dare take your beef to the people who can actually do a damn thing about it. But, feel free to bring it. I'm feeling punchy tonight and could use a good sparring match. ;)
 
C

crzesk8dad

Where am I? How do I get off? Do I get ice cream?
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airgelaal said:
It seems that the main problem now is the protests in Yerevan.
news.am

Protesters left Republic Square in different directionsÖ Ð¢hey are blocking streets of Yerevan

Some of the citizens moved to Arshakunyats Avenue, some to the City Hall, and others to Mashtots Avenue.
news.am news.am
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Its even causing protests here in California. The 101 freeway was blocked and shut down by Armenian protesters. The section that was effected passes near Glendale, CA, which has a rather large Armenian population.

ktla.com

Pro-Armenian demonstrators block 101 Freeway in downtown Los Angeles

Pro-Armenian demonstrators shut down the 101 Freeway near downtown Los Angeles late Tuesday night to highlight the ongoing conflict between Armenia and Azerbaijan that some fear could escalate into…
ktla.com ktla.com
 
Sylvia

Sylvia

Rino Rocked in Halifax!
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82,062
I was just typing a farewell positive message to fellow fans who didn't break the chat rules and wishing all the JGP skaters well when it was disabled. :( (I had "met" a very nice Gordeeva & Grinkov fan from Russia in there and had enjoyed reminiscing with her.)
 
O

On My Own

Well-Known Member
Messages
7,562
Now from an aesthetic point of view, I'd prefer actual shots of the skater in the YouTube thumbnail instead of "Amazing!" "Powerful!" "Wonderful!" "Fierce" "Based" "Slayage" "Wig" or whatever bs they come up with next... Like just ask the on-site photographer to hand you one, you can even make it an exclusive shot, god.
 
Sylvia

Sylvia

Rino Rocked in Halifax!
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82,062
Re-posting @her grace's helpful post re. Yuseong Kim's 2 silver medals/JGP Final qualification here from the JGP Budapest Women's PBP thread:
her grace said:
But in this case, with the configurations of how points have been earned this year, she's [Yuseong Kim] almost mathematically clinched. Since a maximum of five skaters will win gold this season since Shin and Nakai have already won 2, only 5 skaters can possibly have a higher point total than 26. So at the worst, she would be in a tiebreak at 26 points. Moreover, since Kim is currently in third in the qualification standings, to get knocked out she would need four skaters to come up with 26 points or higher in the next two events. In Poland, it looks like only 2 skaters could achieve 26 points or higher: Uezono (13) and Kwon (11). So she could only be beaten by two skaters there. In Armenia, only Shimada can beat her total, but here's where the slight wrinkle exists that keeps her from being 100% in: any skater whose 2 assignments are Poland and Armenia could potentially achieve 26 points. In reality, that's probably not happening since the only skater in that position is Poland's Aleksandra Janikowska. So basically, she's in.
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JGP Women's standings after 5 events: https://results.isu.org/events/jgp2023/jgpswomen.htm
 
Karen-W

Karen-W

Well-Known Member
Messages
43,338
Sylvia said:
JGP Ice Dance standings after Budapest: https://results.isu.org/events/jgp2023/jgpsdance.htm
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Neset/Markelov are the only team 100% qualified for the JGPF. After next week, we'll know for sure if Pedersen/Chen have also qualified.

Mathematically, Zehnder/Sieber and/or the Peals could knock PedChen out of the Final with a win at their 2nd JGPs.

Grimm/Savitskiy and Pinchuk/Pogorielov are both in with bronze or higher next week, while Tkachenko/Kiliakov will be in with at least silver in Yerevan.

That leaves two spots and PedChen's 26 points SHOULD hold them in good stead but nothing is certain until we see where ZehnSieb place next week.

The last spot is probably going to come down to Fradji/Forneaux and the Peals (and possibly ZehnSieb if they can win silver next week). FradForn have the edge with their total combined score likely much higher than either of the other two teams.
 
Karen-W

Karen-W

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43,338
airgelaal said:
Did I understand right that strong pairs refused to go to Armenia? :rolleyes:
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Well, I wouldn't call Tkachenko/Kiliakov a weak team, and the Peals are stronger than their Linz score would indicate. As far as the rest of the feds/teams... :shuffle:
 
Karen-W

Karen-W

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43,338
airgelaal said:
They just turned out to be the smartest and took advantage of it :D
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Hey, that's on Skate Canada and the FFSG that they didn't rearrange assignments strategically. ;)

Well, and Ukraine too, because they could have sent PidKov there instead of Linz and probably snuck two teams into the Final.
 
airgelaal

airgelaal

Well-Known Member
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5,986
Karen-W said:
Hey, that's on Skate Canada and the FFSG that they didn't rearrange assignments strategically. ;)

Well, and Ukraine too, because they could have sent PidKov there instead of Linz and probably snuck two teams into the Final.
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We didn't have any spots in Armenia :(
 
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