U.S. Men in 2018 - articles & latest news

[Sylvia]

Starting a new thread in the New Year with the Championship Men's SP start order draw, posted late last night (SP is Thursday night in San Jose): http://www.usfigureskating.org/leaderboard/results/2018/26192/results.html

1 Sebastien Payannet, Los Angeles FSC
2 Jordan Moeller, Northern Ice SC
3 Daniel Kulenkamp, FSC of Southern California
4 Max Aaron, Broadmoor SC
5 Kevin Shum, SC of Boston

6 Sean Rabbitt, Glacier Falls FSC
7 Emmanuel Savary, University of Delaware FSC
8 Aleksei Krasnozhon, Dallas FSC
9 Timothy Dolensky, Atlanta FSC
10 Alexander Johnson, Braemar-City of Lakes FSC

11 Grant Hochstein, SC of New York
12 Ben Jalovick, Centennial 7k SC
13 Ross Miner, SC of Boston
14 Vincent Zhou, SC of San Francisco
15 Jimmy Ma, SC of New York

16 Nathan Chen, Salt Lake Figure Skating
17 Scott Dyer, All Year FSC
18 Andrew Torgashev, Panthers FSC
19 Adam Rippon, SC of New York
20 Jason Brown, Skokie Valley SC
21 Tomoki Hiwatashi, DuPage FSC

 

[Sylvia]

Jackie Wong's preview/predictions (he also is tweeting practice jump notes and archiving them in his blog): http://www.rockerskating.com/news/2018/1/1/2018-us-championships-preview-men-who-stays-vertical

Nick McCarvel's article for IceNetwork: With Chen seemingly a lock, four men to battle it out for two Olympic spots

 

[ChelleC]

NBC sports article about Jason Brown just before he took the ice at Nationals in 2014.

http://olympics.nbcsports.com/2018/01/03/jason-brown-nationals-figure-skating/

 

[Seerek]

Jr Worlds Team likely to be Camden, Alex K and Andrew T?

 

[Stephanie]

Jr Worlds Team likely to be Camden, Alex K and Andrew T?

Not if Torgashev skates like he did at the JGPF. Tomoki Hiwatashi has a good shot, but if neither Torgashev or Hiwatashi skates particularly well Dinh Tran could get the third spot.

 

[insideedgeua]

I’d like to see Andrew Torgashev on the team but I think he’d really benefit from a bit more time with Christie Krall first. He’s got the jumps but not the consistency.

On a daily basis I’d say that Torgashev is more consistent than Hiwatashi though. Plus, it’s Nationals, anything could happen.

 

[olympic]

From Twitter, it appears Zhou and Aaron looked great and Jason looked better. Adam was nailing it as usual. Unfortunately, our little Quad King spent a lot of time with his fanny on the ice today. WTF happened

 

[flyingsit]

Wouldn’t surprise me if Alex K gets 4CC.

 

[jlai]

From Twitter, it appears Zhou and Aaron looked great and Jason looked better. Adam was nailing it as usual. Unfortunately, our little Quad King spent a lot of time with his fanny on the ice today. WTF happened

Pressure? Tough as he is, the media and the public are giving him tons of pressure, and he is VERY young and new to this.

 

[Firedancer]

From Twitter, it appears Zhou and Aaron looked great and Jason looked better. Adam was nailing it as usual. Unfortunately, our little Quad King spent a lot of time with his fanny on the ice today. WTF happened

Also from twitter was that the ice at SAP today was different from the ice in the practice rink yesterday so perhaps this was part of the problem?

 

[Marco]

Wouldn’t surprise me if Alex K gets 4CC.

That would be awesome. Although I would also love it if he could go to Jr Worlds too because I think he has a good shot to win it.

 

[Firedancer]

I found highlights of Nathan’s practice from yesterday on instagram: https://instagram.com/p/BdgPBdbDUwV/

 

[aftershocks]

Yay AdaRipp! Lousy IN jerky streams for practically every entertaining top performance, but I still enjoyed how Adam laid it down.

Aside from Max being down so far, I would be happy with the top six standings remaining this way with 4, 5, and 6 going to 4CCs, but anything can happen. I was sorry to hear that Nathan has had some ankle issues. Hopefully, he's conservative in his fp at Nats, and then rest his ankle and get it treated as best he can. I wonder when he began having problems with it (during the season or earlier?)

I did not care for Nathan's Vera Wang sp outfit. It looked suspiciously like a warm-up suit, or a speedskating outfit. This is figure skating, I thought. Oh well, I'm not a fan Vera. The outfit has nothing to do with the Nemesis musical theme either. Nathan, you overpaid. I liked much better what you originally wore for your sp at Salt Lake City competition earlier in the pre-season. I loved the red shirt and dark slacks. Maybe Nathan didn't like the long sleeves on the red shirt, because he changed to a purple shirt with sleeves rolled up for later performances on the GP.
ETA: Okay, I see Nathan said in an interview that the Wang costume was designed for aerodynamics in mind. I still do not see any Nemesis theme connection though. I like Nathan's haircut. Great comments by Adam in the presser; very inspirational.

Hugs for Max. I love Max. He's gonna be alright. Hang in there. Come back strong in the fp.

I love Alex Johnson (such a sexy, jazzy performance; shout out to Rohene's choreo). Sean Rabbitt, Grant Hochstein and Ross Miner absolutely put smiles on my face. Kudos also to Alexei Krasnozohn, Tim Dolensky, and Andrew Torgashev too. Vincent did very good to start but he ran into a bit of trouble; still he had good attack. Jimmy Ma was entertaining too, as was Emmanuel Savary who had great twizzles. Kisses for Jordan Moeller, and others who faltered. Come back with confidence in the fp Jordan!

 

[alchemy void]

Deadspin, which is a general sports site, just tweeted out this article about Jimmy Ma's SP at Nationals tonight:

This Figure Skater Performs To "Turn Down For What"



Now THIS is the kind of way to increase public interest in figure skating, even if it's just a little bit.

 

[Spun Silver]

From Twitter, it appears Zhou and Aaron looked great and Jason looked better. Adam was nailing it as usual. Unfortunately, our little Quad King spent a lot of time with his fanny on the ice today. WTF happened

It's been posted that he was sick, presumably from the virus in the hotel.

 

[NAOTMAA]

Grant was totally robbed!

I've always said Jason was a USFSA golden boy and that they back him big time. They'll hold him up and put him on the team unless he implodes and makes it impossible for them to do so. No quad and a clear ur on the messy 3A completely ignored yet scores a 93. That's a joke even by nationals standards

All these years and he has yet to show a quad and his 3A remains inconsistent and unreliable yet they still back him full force. They should have dumped him tonight like they did Ashley on Wednesday

if it comes down to petty points

 

[tylersf]

If we talk about the Top 5:

1. Nathan was sick, but he got the job done in 1st place.
2. Adam skated beautifully for 2nd.
3. Although, I'm a Jason fan, I had to agree with Johnny Weir and Tara Lipinski when they felt that Jason was overscored because the judges overlooked the underrotated 3 axel. I do think that judges prop up Jason and put him in 3rd, because he is well-liked by the international skating community.
4. I was so happy for Grant and his performance. If he skates like that in the LP, it could be a surprise trip to the Olympics. I hope.
5. Vincent was great except for the 3 axel. I didn't expect for him to end up in 5th.

Grant was totally robbed!
I've always said Jason was a USFSA golden boy and that they back him big time. They'll hold him up and put him on the team unless he implodes and makes it impossible for them to do so. No quad and a clear ur on the messy 3A completely ignored yet scores a 93. That's a joke even by nationals standards
All these years and he has yet to show a quad and his 3A remains inconsistent and unreliable yet they still back him full force. They should have dumped him tonight like they did Ashley on Wednesday if it comes down to petty points

 

[Willin]

Deadspin, which is a general sports site, just tweeted out this article about Jimmy Ma's SP at Nationals tonight:

This Figure Skater Performs To "Turn Down For What"



Now THIS is the kind of way to increase public interest in figure skating, even if it's just a little bit.

Seriously - my sister said she'd watch skating a lot more if more skaters would avoid "screechy violin music" (this after the ladies short). For men's there were more creative choices and it showed - many more standing ovations and loud cheering, yelling, and whistling to cheer on competitors. Even skaters who weren't at the top got a lot as long as they had fun music. (Also the audience felt much more like they were at a concert or club for Adam's program than a skating competition - it was so much fun!)

@NAOTMAA Yeah, 93 is high for him and that UR was definitely a bad overlook (it looked 2 footed in real time as well), but who deserved to be higher than Jason? Hochstein isn't better all around than him, but he had a 4T-3T to keep it close - with the UR he probably should've beat Jason. Vincent had a noticeably UR 3A (like Jason, but with a fall to boot) and a very UR 4F before it. I'm surprised Zhou's 3A wasn't downgraded. Miner is also good and has insane transitions, but wasn't as fast as Hochstein and with slightly messier landings. I could go down the list, but really no one deserved to be as high as Jason.
Frankly I think everyone here was about 3-4 points above what they should be for various reasons (no UR/<<, high PCS, it being an unusually good day) except Max - who was really lowballed. But then again the judges were hammering people score-wise until Aleksei and Tim skated (numbers 8 & 9). I thought it would be another ladies event where they showed everyone but a couple skaters what they really thought of them all these years.
It should also be noted that Jason's had consistent 3As for a couple seasons before this one. He also consistently landed really strong, clean 3As in both the warm up before the competition start and the warm up during the competition. I think it's a confidence issue that can be fixed.

It was really interesting to see Andrew Torgashev. He's really fast - probably one of the fastest in the field - when doing basic crossovers and stroking. I thought he'd clip the boards with how close he was getting on some passed. But, he's also the slowest by far on footwork. If he fixes that I think he can be a much better skater.

On the issue of Nathan's new costume, I was very unimpressed. It's just so... so plain. It almost looks like a discount Tron costume. I get that Vera Wang has done other sort of plain costumes like Evan's, but the snake made it look expensive. In the past there's always been something - Sparkles, clean lines, that straight-off-the-runway look. This looks like someone bought a morph suit and put some electrical tape on it.

 

[aftershocks]

Of course, Jimmy Ma is not the first to skate to this unorthodox song. Hubbell/Donahue used it also as one of their many funky hip hop music clips for their last season's sp. But nice p.r. re Jimmy Ma in Deadspin, complete with a clip of his performance. I must find better clips of all entertaining performances. G$d d**n f'ing MLB and lousy IN who repeatedly show they don't care about figure skating fans. Upgrade your streaming service already IN!!!

 

[aftershocks]

Vincent was sick, but he got the job done in 1st place.

Freudian slip @tylersf. You mean Nathan Slaythan Chen. I couldn't figure Mike Weiss' insistence upon making out some kind of rivalry between Nathan and Vincent. Not since they were in juniors really has there been a rivalry. Nathan is a bit older and has better polish and maturity. Vincent is great at tackling the quads, but he still has to put it all together consistently. Sure Vincent can land the quads and rack up points, but I hope he just gets to go to 4CCs, and maybe Worlds for this season.

Oh yes, I meant to mention: Kudos for the Dick Button Effect (DBE) on display after the first group finished and Dick was honored in-between in the arena. So deserved! Thanks Uncle Dick!

I've always said Jason was a USFSA golden boy and that they back him big time. They'll hold him up and put him on the team unless he implodes and makes it impossible for them to do so. No quad and a clear ur on the messy 3A completely ignored yet scores a 93. That's a joke even by nationals standards

Calm down @NAOTMAA. Geesh. I'll bet Grant is not worried or upset about it like you are. That's a record score for Grant and he deserves it. Of course it can be argued that Grant should be ahead of Jason, but I actually guessed 93+ for Jason and I was right. Sure the judges were lenient on Jason for the mistake on the 3-axel. Somewhat similar to how the judges were lenient on Karen Chen in placing her over a clean Angela Wang the other day, and then keeping Ashley behind Angela.

It can definitely be argued that Jason should be slightly behind Grant. But the judges are giving Jason a vote of confidence like they did Karen Chen. And Jason has even more reason than Karen to be rewarded with 3rd in the sp. In Jason's case, his charisma and superb presentation skills combined with exquisite attention to detail are what gave him the highest PCS score.

 

[CoolGuy]

It was really interesting to see Andrew Torgashev. He's really fast - probably one of the fastest in the field - when doing basic crossovers and stroking. I thought he'd clip the boards with how close he was getting on some passed. But, he's also the slowest by far on footwork. If he fixes that I think he can be a much better skater.

.... I thought Torgashev had good speed during the footwork, especially considering how deep his edges were and the amount of directional changes there are.
https://youtu.be/_BqpbxHgIz8?t=107

 

[tylersf]

Thanks aftershocks...I fixed it.

I don't see a rivalry between then at all either. Nathan IMHO is developmentally farther along than Vincent, and it's almost like Vincent could have been in juniors a little longer and unleashed as an OGM contender for 2022.

Freudian slip @tylersf. You mean Nathan Slaythan Chen. I couldn't figure Mike Weiss' insistence upon making out some kind of rivalry between Nathan and Vincent. Not since they were in juniors really has there been a rivalry. Nathan is a bit older and has better polish and maturity. Vincent is great at tackling the quads, but he still has to put it all together consistently. Sure Vincent can land the quads and rack up points, but I hope he just gets to go to 4CCs, and maybe Worlds for this season.

Oh yes, I meant to mention: Kudos for the Dick Button Effect (DBE) on display after the first group finished and Dick was honored in-between in the arena. So deserved! Thanks Uncle Dick!

 

[zigzig]

Ridonk score for Jason with that $hitty 3A that should have been < and -3 across the board. And that Hamilton program is so dorky - not that dorkiness is a PCS component but that smarmy program makes me cringe every time.

Still, in the judges’ defense and I rarely ever have one for them, Jason does get those cuckoo scores internationally so I understand their motivation.

 

[misskarne]

Interesting how many people are up in arms about Jason's 3A, but barely a peep about the joke that's Rippon getting 9s in transitions for that SP.

I thought Zhou was marked too high also on the PCS. Hochstein was excellent.

And hopefully Max comes out with all guns blazing on Sunday.

 

[stjeaskategym]

Grant was totally robbed!

I've always said Jason was a USFSA golden boy and that they back him big time. They'll hold him up and put him on the team unless he implodes and makes it impossible for them to do so. No quad and a clear ur on the messy 3A completely ignored yet scores a 93. That's a joke even by nationals standards

All these years and he has yet to show a quad and his 3A remains inconsistent and unreliable yet they still back him full force.

Yeah Jason did UR the 3A. But he's a little like Carolina Kostner in that he tends to get very good international scores even if he doesn't have the tech. He's the one US guy who won't get slaughtered internationally if there is no quad and the 3A is a little off.

I think gone are the days where you can pretty much sleepwalk through the year, and then show up at Nationals and make a team with a skate of your life. Grant has had a hard season, and the perception of him probably won't change in one competition. There are some skaters who really only have their best stuff at Nationals.

 

[Marco]

I wonder if Jason is considered to have a significant amount of body of work to be picked ahead of Grant even if he placed behind Grant overall. Same question for Vincent.

Jason's body of work is no different to Ashley's - similar Nationals and Worlds placements last season and kept/regained that 3rd spot, solid but underwhelming GP season. Jason did make the GPF though.

 

[stjeaskategym]

I wonder if Jason is considered to have a significant amount of body of work to be picked ahead of Grant even if he placed behind Grant overall. Same question for Vincent.

Jason's body of work is no different to Ashley's - similar Nationals and Worlds placements last season and kept/regained that 3rd spot, solid but underwhelming GP season. Jason did make the GPF though.

It's different than Ashley's because she didn't even make it through her second GP. That's a separate discipline anyway... They would really just have to look at the men relative to each other.

 

[olympic]

Stayed up til 12:30am to watch the men's SP on DVR.

I had no idea that Nathan was sick until the interview w/ Andrea Joyce. Wow! Good job in keeping it together and performing like that.

That was the best Adam ever skated the SP. JW and Tara made it sound like he was considering / will consider the 4Z in the SP. Also, he should try the 3F-3L in the SP. Points are points.

I would have put Grant ahead of Jason. Period. That was also the performance of a lifetime for Grant.

Zhou's placement was correct even if JW disagreed. I tip my hat to him though for having the jump combo of the evening - 4Z-3T(Rippon).

Ross skated so much better than I've seen in a long time. I know it's the twilight of his career but I do wish he could have nailed down the 4S. He would've been a serious player.

Tim Dolensky was also the best he's been all season. Small SO on the 3A but everything was excellent.

I've seen Alexei Krasnozhon skate that program a tad better at the Jr. GPF, but still very effective here.

Torgashev hits the 3A! Fought for the 3-3. That is also the best I've seen him skate recently.

Alex J. had trouble w/ the 3A in practice but hit it in the program. Too bad about the 3-2. He would've been close to Dolensky and Krasnozhon if he had executed it.

The dagger in my heart came from both poor Max and Jordan Moeller. I had my eye on Jordan because he has potential but that program was a disaster!

 

[Firedancer]

Overall the men were really great last night. Lots of strong performances. I thought Nathan did a great job considering he has been so sick and made a smart decision in giving himself a break here considering that.

This was the best Adam has performed this program and I am so happy for him. And most of the ladies should ask for his help on their laybacks.

I thought Jason’s 3A looked ur and it’s a concern that it continues to be a problem. It seems like it was better than it had been in practices but still not fixed. I do hope he will be going for the 4T tomorrow.

Vincent’s opening combo is fantastic. But the rest was pretty much what we saw on the Grand Prix and I definitely thought his placement was correct.

Grant & Ross performed the best they possibly could have. Tim & Alexei were really good as well. Smart going for the clean program. It was sad to see Max struggle.

I really like Torgashev and I was happy to see him hit the 3A. I hope he can go to junior worlds and work more with coaches other than mom & dad.

 

[wickedwitch]

From the replay, I thought Jason's 3A could go either way. In general, I prefer they give the skater the benefit of the doubt, but I wouldn't have rioted if it had been marked UR.