The Race for the 2020 POTUS elections

Japanfan

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Not questioning if a human being deserves healthcare. Putting words in my mouth. It's a matter of who ends up paying for it. Ok, so according to you, the US taxpayer should be responsible for covering health care for basically everyone and anyone in the world who wants to come here, illegally or not? How in the world could that be financially feasible?
I don't know how much coverage the Canadian and other public healthcare systems provide to people who are in the country illegally. I would expect there is compassionate care provided to refugees who are here seeking asylum, but also expect that there would be limitations to the healthcare provided to non-Canadian citizens/residents/workers, if any healthcare was offered to those people at all. Non-Canadians citizens/residents/workers can't just show up at a Canadian doctor's office or hospital and expect their care to be paid for by Canadian taxpayers.

However, demetriosj, there is reason for the term 'universal healthcare'. Residents, immigrant residents, and refugees/asylum seekers (presumably) are entitled to receive care in the public health system. The concept of public health care is based on the view that care is a 'right' and the view that equal access to healthcare makes society better for all. And taxpayers contribute to the system believing that to be the case.

It is financially feasible for pretty much all countries in the western developed world - though many of those systems are in crises these days, especially given that populations are aging.

But I don't think you'll find anyone in those countries who prefers a private system, unless they are very wealthy.
 

topaz

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Well if you have extra cash to donate to illegal's health care, go right ahead and donate it to the cause. Don't expect US taxpayers to be able to afford any more taxes, especially to pay for health care for people here illegally. Most of us can't afford to be taxed anymore than we are already.
But Trump gave a tax credit to ALL US taxpayers right? The tax deductions that corporations and the rich receive are the reasons that most Americans may pay more in taxes. But you can blame healthcare costs for undocumented immigrants if you want. I guarantee if you're not self employed, the CEO of your employer pays less taxes(federal) than you.
But you're ignorance as to what your tax dollars go towards is showing. You believe that undocumented folks are taking your money but you have no problem with the rich and persons who over a certain annual salary paying less in taxes than you.

States have more flexibility with their health care spending. Also, It's about doing what is right and humane. It's inhumane to allow anyone suffer unnecessarily due to an illness or medical condition because they are not a citizen of a nation. In fact, it's cruel. If an old lady needs her diabetes meds and she's seeks asylum by your standards she should not receive medical attention(prescriptions) and just be allowed to go into a diabetic coma and die.

You better never travel outside the country and need medical attention, you may find yourself in a situation that your US HEALTH INSURANCE may not be accepted.

ETA: I live in Wisconsin. Wisconsin's law:
You or your family may be able to get health care coverage even if you are not a U.S. citizen or legal resident. You do not need a sponsor. If you meet all program rules, you may be able to get health care:
For your children who were born in the U.S.,
• If you are a pregnant woman, or
• If you have a medical emergency
https://www.dhs.wisconsin.gov/publications/p1/p10164.pdf

Not sure of your state, but Wisconsin had a PRICK as a governor for more than 8 years(until recently). Medical coverage for undocumented folks outside of the criteria I listed above does not happen. In fact, many undocumented workers in Wisconsin pay out of pocket for healthcare. For example, if an undocumented worker needs meds they pay prescription costs for themselves. So stop writing like undocumented workers are getting unnecessary medical treatments.

Lastly, undocumented immigrants contribute to their communities; sales, property, and state income taxes for Wisconsin. A few years ago a report stated that Wisconsin would lose almost 3b without undocumented workers.
 
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Andora

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But... is she wrong, though? Trump was successful in stepping out in front amid a crowded group. He dominated the conversation. I've seen it happen in other elections elsewhere. No one is commanding a lead right now in the Democratic leadership race, even though it's crowded race with solid candidates. Even if you could argue the Republicans didn't run any real future stars in 2016, someone should be a bigger deal by now other than Biden's nostalgia lead.

The field still seems open if you can make an impact. So far, everyone still joining seems to have an over-inflated sense of their said potential impact. :p
 

Peaches LaTour

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I don't think ALL Republicans are the problem, just those who voted for Trump or one of his enablers. So rather than all, we should say that the vast majority of Republicans are the problem. :shuffle:
Trump Republicans are definitely the problem. Non-Trump Republicans are the problem, too, because they are too cowardly to stand up for their country, their party & their own dignity.
 

Andora

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Trump Republicans are definitely the problem. Non-Trump Republicans are the problem, too, because they are too cowardly to stand up for their country, their party & their own dignity.
Outside of lawmakers, I imagine non-Trump Republicans aren't cowards... they just enjoy enough perks (tax breaks, etc.) to not get fussed over some issues they don't see as important enough. Imvho.
 

Peaches LaTour

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Outside of lawmakers, I imagine non-Trump Republicans aren't cowards... they just enjoy enough perks (tax breaks, etc.) to not get fussed over some issues they don't see as important enough. Imvho.
I am talking about those in the Senate who are allowing Trump to defecate on our Constitution.
 

Vash01

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If he becomes the nominee I will vote for him over Trump any day. But Biden and Sanders have at least 3 things against them in my book. 1. OLD 2. WHITE 3. MEN.

I hope that the comments that Biden "looks more presidential" aren't true. Because if they are, it means that the status quo of old white men being more presidential that say a woman, a person of color, a gay candidate, etc.

I would hope that we could move away from the patriarchal society, but looks like we aren't.
Biden is the most experienced candidate with the most name recognition. If you want to reject him for being white, old, male, you are showing bias too. If you disagree with his policy, philosophy, etc. I can accept that.
 

Japanfan

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Biden is the most experienced candidate with the most name recognition. If you want to reject him for being white, old, male, you are showing bias too. If you disagree with his policy, philosophy, etc. I can accept that.
White, old, wealthy men control the machinations of the world and and hold a very disproportionate number of high positions in public life and most facets of business/social life. Wanting people in power to more accurately represent the populations they wield power over is a fair call. I don't think 'bias' is the right word here - rather, the call is to address bias.
 

topaz

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Biden is the most experienced candidate with the most name recognition. If you want to reject him for being white, old, male, you are showing bias too. If you disagree with his policy, philosophy, etc. I can accept that.

Biden just represents status quo for me. Lots of people were struggling under a status quo political system and going back to that because we've experienced a republican agenda is not going to change that.

Trump Admin are made up of corporatists, conservatives(religious and non religious), White nationalists and oligarchs. I don't for second think these folks came out of nowhere. They have existed in US politics forever but they found a vessel to achieve their goals with Trump. Their goals or agenda will continue.
 

VIETgrlTerifa

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A part of me thinks we sort of lost the option of being able to choose someone more progressive and lefty because thanks to Trump's election, we've undid a lot of progress happening under Obama (even if you consider him Republican-lite like many of my friends) after 8 years of Bush and we're still reeling from the effects of the way Reagan shifted everything to the right so right is now considered "moderate". Trump is now normalizing some really far right things that we again have to shift back.

However, another part of me thinks Trump means we have to go hard left and not compromise and that passion will carry the next election. The pro-Biden polls tell one story but polls aren't everything, and the campaign hasn't really started yet.
 
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Personally, I'm much more liberal/left than some of my posts suggest.

My main priority is to support the Democratic candidate who is able to gain the confidence of the electorate; and defeat Trump.
Most of the people who have presented themselves thus far, do not seem to have a realistic chance to do so.

Even the appearance of a "fractured" party, doesn't "inspire"
I hope that they are able to unite behind a few strong candidates, eventually.
 

Vash01

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Personally, I'm much more liberal/left than some of my posts suggest.

My main priority is to support the Democratic candidate who is able to gain the confidence of the electorate; and defeat Trump.
Most of the people who have presented themselves thus far, do not seem to have a realistic chance to do so.

Even the appearance of a "fractured" party, doesn't "inspire"
I hope that they are able to unite behind a few strong candidates, eventually.
Eventually they will.
 
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It's the same thing they got Clinton for as well. I think Sanders got away with it despite voting for it because he was more convincingly able to frame his reasons for voting for it as a compromise and he has speeches from that period and after that pretty much showed he hated "tough-on-crime" bills and saw them for what they were whereas Clinton seemed more much gung-ho about being "tough-on-crime". Plus, Sanders supporters know he's much more about economic reform and his whole thing has always centered on economic policies so they see him as someone who is willing to change his position from what he had in the early 90s. If Biden should learn anything from the 2016 Presidential race, is that he needs to find away to frame his vote and rhetoric from the early 90s to the more progressive wing of the Democratic Party whose rhetoric on this has gained traction in the 20+ years since the 1994 Crime Bill.
 
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Clinton was not able to vote on the crime bill in 1994. It was early in Bill's first term. She was first lady, and not in Congress. Sanders voted for it and got a pass.

She also got blamed for Bill's affairs.
Right, but a lot of her rhetoric and speeches at the time made it seem like had she been a member of Congress she would have voted for it and afterwards.
 

topaz

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And..........this is how the Biden campaign handled today’s criticism over the 1994 Crime Bill.

:watch:

We’re a little over a month away from the first primary debate. I’m calling it right now: They are going to go after Biden over this. He better knock discussing this out of the park.
As they should. He's has never apologized for it only expressed "regret". His reasons for the crime bill are shady too. It's about appeasing the other side, that was his compromise as he states. So exerbarating the US prison system of mass incarceration, this is his contribution.

I'm just hoping Warren, Sanders and Harris bring up Anita Hill.

Clinton was not able to vote on the crime bill in 1994. It was early in Bill's first term. She was first lady, and not in Congress. Sanders voted for it and got a pass.

She also got blamed for Bill's affairs.
She was the first lady who promoted and supported the bill. The infamous statement of "super predators" is what she has to atone for. Her part in promoting the bill was the issue. It didn't help much when she dismissed the young woman who confronted her about the remark in the primary in 2015. I can tell for young African Americans this was a huge issue and it will for Joe Biden too.

Also, Bernie did not get free pass for his. Many young people of color had a major issue with it.
 

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