The Race for the 2020 POTUS elections

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BittyBug

The missing ingredient
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I posted a link to a tweet earlier that said this, but for those who don't read links, I'll quote it outright. If Biden is asked again whether he'll take a cognitive test, he should just answer, "Person, woman, man, camera, TV. And if you say it in order, you get extra points."
 

Aussie Willy

Hates both vegemite and peanut butter
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That is not what happened. He is pushing back on people asking him if he's taken a cognitive test and saying it's a ridiculous question (which it is) and compared it to asking the reporter to take a drug test and, if the reporter doesn't, assuming he must be a junkie.

Personally, I think Biden should learn from Warren's mistake and not take the test. She let Trump push her into taking a DNA test and look at how that turned out.

No one gets a cognitive test unless there is suspicion of cognitive decline or they have a health condition that could impair their cognitive abilities. There is absolutely no reason for Biden to take such a test and the constant asking him if he has and, if not, why not, is yet another example of how the media gets obsessed with stupid shlt and won't let go.

ETA this better not turn into the 2020 version of "but her emails."
I agree. I saw the video and didn't think anything of it. I wasn't even aware the journalist was black. I would be pretty peeved if people kept pushing me on that issue.
 

VGThuy

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I didn't see the reporter on the clip I saw. So no I couldn't.

Ah ok. I thought all the clips out there had the panel of journalists being shown like in the original video. Like they cut to that reporter's reaction and further question as Biden was still answering.
 

once_upon

Voter
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The clip I saw, I didn't see reporters either. I thought his comment referred to people undergoing drug tests for employment, specifically looking for one drug.
 

vvh.equ9art

Well-Known Member
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I didn't need to play a game to figure that out. :fragile:

ETA: re: Susan Rice from the Axios article @Vagabond posted:


This impresses me a lot because the knock on Rice is that she's difficult or blunt or not politic in terms of personality and communication style, yet this indicates the people who worked with her like her and hold her in high esteem.
There's a thread on Twitter today (I'm going to try and get the whole thing over here) from her former Special Assistant Ravi Gupta while she was Ambassador to the U.N. The one thing he said relevant to this is that, while she is very tough, her staff, especially her non-policy staff, loved her.
 

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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There's a thread on Twitter today (I'm going to try and get the whole thing over here) from her former Special Assistant Ravi Gupta while she was Ambassador to the U.N. The one thing he said relevant to this is that, while she is very tough, her staff, especially her non-policy staff, loved her.

oh that is cool. I realized there has to be some reasons she has been at the top of the list despite her lack of electoral experience.
 

caseyedwards

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Why would democrats want such a rabid regime changer?! Literally she supported overthrowing governments of syria, Libya, serbia, and more and now even Includes Russia in her regime change agenda for human rights! You may as well be talking about Samantha power. Left wing wolfowitz!
 

mrinalini

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There's a thread on Twitter today (I'm going to try and get the whole thing over here) from her former Special Assistant Ravi Gupta while she was Ambassador to the U.N. The one thing he said relevant to this is that, while she is very tough, her staff, especially her non-policy staff, loved her.
Good to know. From watching her speak, she comes across as the opposite of Harris who is all flash with little substance. Rice is still too hawkish and won't excite the organizers who'll put in the work to drive up voter turnout, but if she's VP I think the country will be in competent hands should anything happen to Biden.

And it looks like Harris is making last-minute phone calls lobbying her case; good, as that shows she's desperate and not looking so likely. Warren has shockingly made it into the final rounds although I don't know why she even bothers.
 

Dobre

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I still think she won't be the pick due to her never having run for office and not even being from any state.

Neither candidate gets the campaign any electoral votes based on her state.

Don't know what Biden's goals/priorities are for a running mate. I assume the Washington Post is gunning for the Biden campaign to win those Obama voters that did not vote last time around. That this seems more plausible than flipping voters who went for Trump.

Personally, I think there should be plenty of motivation for non-voters from the last time around to vote, regardless of the VP nomination. But this is the strategy I think the paper is pushing. There was a meme on facebook right after the BLM movement got started about at least three states that would have flipped their votes if all the black voters that hadn't voted would have voted for Clinton. I assume those voters are the goal.
 

b-man

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Yes it’s very strange. I very much supported Albright meeting with Kim jong il and So many Obama supporters were a huge fan of obamas statement he would meet with anyone anywhere including ahmadinajad Castro Putin etc. so this extreme hatred of meeting with jong un is very strange and weird. Or maybe the regime changers have so much more power now and everyone on the left is supposed to want to overthrow Putin, un, assad, etc etc. like I’m pretty sure bidens policy on Russia will be some kind of regime change excluding Iraq style regime change but maybe that too
My objection wasn't to having a meeting, but the results. Slick Willie and another negotiator reached an agreement with N. Korea in '94.. The North was to cease development of a major weapons grade reactor, while the US + allies were to supply two non weapons grade reactors, plus fuel oil until they could be constructed. Slick Willie made a major announcement, i. e., an agreement leading to the end of N. Korea's nuclear weapons program. Madaline Albright negotiated an agreement with the North in 2000 to limit the North's missile programs, She was widely photographed being wined and dined by the then dear leader, Kim Jong-il, and made announcements of success. The CIA discovered in 2002 that the North had been secretly developing enrichment facilities in violation of the agreements, with the agreements then collapsing. Slick Willie and Albright were heavily criticized by the opposition for having been duped by the north.
 

b-man

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You don’t have much understanding of immigration law to define who is an asylum seeker.

And with that last paragraph, I am done with you.

90% plus do not qualify.

Bye.
 

ballettmaus

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Almost none of the illegal border crossers are legitimate refugees, they are trespassers, invaders, or some would call economic migrants.

They may not be legitimate refugees, but I doubt that you'd want to trade places with them even for a day.
They pay traffickers or walk thousands of miles with their children on foot and they risk everything coming here. That should give you some idea about how desperate they are.

The other issue is that just because many are not classified as refugees doesn't mean that they shouldn't be.
 

VGThuy

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I have to agree with @VGThuy that the above paragraph is indeed extremely telling.

Until recently, I had little idea why so many Central Americans were attempting to reach the U.S. border right now. A couple articles (one of which I posted here before) have shed light on this and made me realize this is truly a humanitarian issue. Anyone who wishes may read these or other articles to become more informed.

"I Can No Longer Continue to Live Here": What's driving so many Honduran women to the U.S. border (previously posted)


Pope says killing of women has become a "plague" in Central America



The Great Climate Migration Has Begun


The last article is the biggest wake-up call of all. It makes clear that not only will the numbers of Central Americans seeking asylum/refuge in the U.S. not decline any time soon, in fact, those numbers will almost certainly increase with every passing year for the foreseeable future. (And BTW, the environmental policies of the Trump Administration, and other rightist regimes, arguably make this situation worse on the daily.)

You can wish this problem would go away. But it won't. Nor will the moral (and practical) obligation to face it.

You've really hit the nail on the head. And so for as long as we're creating situations for them to come here and situations back home are reaching a point where they seek refuge here, we need an improved system that actually recognizes asylum seekers as the law actually states and recognize all the humanitarian crises. Depending on the culture of this country and who's in charge, that interpretation of that definition seems to change. In my current experience doing pro bono work for asylum seekers and other migrants wading through this ridiculous system and speaking with my colleagues who are immigration attorneys (some worked for the DOJ and immigration courts before quitting in disgust after a year or so under Trump after beginning work under Obama), it's that the enforcement of immigration law is up to the whims of those in charge at times. The reason so many aren't truly recognized as asylum seekers or refugees is due to animus. That's why there's been so many legal challenges and advocacy for enforcement agencies to follow the law properly.

This write-up from Amnesty International really shows why so many get wrongfully rejected, how we turn away those at points of entry, despite what the law says, how we make those migrants' lives a living hell, unlawfully detained those seeking asylum, and how we create a situation where we don't accept an accurate number of asylum seekers:


Anybody working in immigration law knows the system has been broken for very long time and has regressed even further under Trump. The odds were always stacked against asylum seekers in the way enforcement agencies idiotically define it and even with proper definition, how there are tools at their disposal to either deny them status or to ensure they never gain entry through illegal means and inhumane means. The whole thing is sickening.
 

caseyedwards

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I can’t believe Biden apologized for Latinos are more diverse than black Americans! undermining all the work of cnn NYT WAPO reporters in attacking conservatives for lying about what Biden said! Very strange
 

Jot the Dot Dot

Headstrong Buzzard
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I can’t believe Biden apologized for Latinos are more diverse than black Americans! undermining all the work of cnn NYT WAPO reporters in attacking conservatives for lying about what Biden said! Very strange
Maybe he should take a page out of Monty Python: "I apologize for my previous apology".
 

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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Here you go - 2 Twitter threads, from Ravi Gupta and Priya Singh, who worked for Susan Rice in the Obama White House. Both of them are rave reviews.
https://twitter.com/RaviMGupta/status/1291357150384717824?s=20

https://twitter.com/poursaltandrub/status/1291375886391025665?s=20

Thanks!

Now I'm reading a faction on the left has organized and sent a letter demanding Biden not pick Rice because she is a hawk. There's another group that has organized to demand that Biden not pick anyone who was a police chief or prosecutor. And I have to ask why wouldn't both groups be right from a leftwing perspective? But then I have to ask who would be acceptable to the left as VP except someone who was not acceptable to other large chunks of the party? Oh my gosh, democracy is so disappointing. :drama:

I've always thought Susan Rice was too much of a hawk. I don't happen to care at this point. I'm very pleased to hear the positive assessments of her. We'd have a different set of VP choices had Warren or Sanders won the nomination. They didn't. That's democracy.

I'm totally not in the same political grouping as Norman Solomon, uber Sanders supporter, but I was really cheered to see what he has to say:

Like it or not, the imperative of defeating Trump is directly in front of us. To make a progressive future possible, beating Trump is absolutely necessary while very far from sufficient. To organize against a government headed by Trump is to push against a thick stone wall. To organize against a government headed by Biden holds out the real potential of progressive breakthroughs.
 

Vagabond

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Now I'm reading a faction on the left has organized and sent a letter demanding Biden not pick Rice because she is a hawk. There's another group that has organized to demand that Biden not pick anyone who was a police chief or prosecutor.
And what do they threaten to do if he rejects their demands? Vote for Trump? Or not vote for Biden, which amounts to the same thing? What fools!
 

VGThuy

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To move away from attacking progressives, there's a new attack ad created:


Republican veterans against Trump. It's going to be aired on Fox News in swing states later this month during the Republican Convention.

I don't know how wise it is for Trump's people to call a bunch of veterans "the swamp" but I'm sure some of his supporters will eat it up.
 

Andora

Skating season ends as baseball season begins
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We keep talking about Trump's base/prime supporters, and how they're a lost cause this time around. But these people have families, friends, coworkers, well-wishers, etc. around them, who can't all possibly be that far down a scary path. As Trump's numbers decrease, ostensibly these perimeter conservatives are pulling away more and more, with LP and Republican Veterans against Trump providing the path. I have to believe it's picking away slowly but surely at the die-hards. One day the hardcore supporters will have to look up and see the crowd thinned-- and I mean their personal circles.

I watched versions of this happen in my family starting under Bush and throughout the Obama administration. A couple of the loudest and most frightening conservative cousins used to have mild support that evaporated over time as more people around them pushed back against ludicrous comments online and in-person. Over time their head of steam dissipated and fake news/proclamations dimmed as some close family & friends began pulling away, unable to find common ground anymore.

I'm wary of the Lincoln Project, Joe Walsh/Conway/etc., but these effective ads + Trump's increasing decline (in numbers, in mental acuity) is getting through to some people. And hopefully those people start talking sense milimetre by milimetre into their friends & family...
 

VALuvsMKwan

Wandering Goy
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As long as anyone on any side is labeled for the rest of their lives as having the equivalent of the BLACK MARK OF TARASOVA on them for any action or inaction, being marked as deserving shame for the rest of their days and into eternity by whosoever's measuring stick they fail to meet, extreme sides will exist and conciliation and steps toward consensus building will not happen.

Read the posts from every side here and you see examples of that. If we are supposedly so educated and aware and tolerant and brilliant, and that's going here, do you really expect it to be better "out there"?

We all have good and bad in us and all of us make mistakes and many of us are ashamed to admit mistakes because we are afraid we will be set upon by the zealots on whatever side or issue or area of morality. It is rare these days in society to be allow to fail or err and then try to do better.

What solution do any of the collective "you" have to deal with this? Must we all repent and face public punishment to be purged of our evil, sinful ways and beliefs?
 

VGThuy

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I blame the paranoia and fear mongering. I really do think the biggest Trumpists are the ones who devour Breitbart, Infowars, Fox News, and/or conservative talk radio. It makes people irrational. It's also an addiction. They put people into this state of panic and fear and that makes them ripe for tribal thinking. I think a lot of the loyal Trumpists may come around if Trump loses in November and Biden takes over and if he's relatively non-controversial. They may still dislike Biden and his policies, but they'll take off the tin foil hats.
 

VGThuy

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As long as anyone on any side is labeled for the rest of their lives as having the equivalent of the BLACK MARK OF TARASOVA on them for any action or inaction, being marked as deserving shame for the rest of their days and into eternity by whosoever's measuring stick they fail to meet, extreme sides will exist and conciliation and steps toward consensus building will not happen.

Usually, it's the mark lasts forever from people who continue that behavior. In most cases, things are forgotten. They're only not forgotten if there was never attempts to make meaningful amends and when defensive stances are taken, and they value their own well-being over the harm they caused others.
 

VALuvsMKwan

Wandering Goy
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Usually, it's the mark lasts forever from people who continue that behavior. In most cases, things are forgotten. They're only not forgotten if there was never attempts to make meaningful amends and when defensive stances are taken, and they value their own well-being over the harm they caused others.

You and I will have to agree to disagree about the "things are forgotten" part of your post. I'm seeing too much past history dug up and publicized to believe that such mining and shaming won't continue to take place.
 
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