Russian women news & updates, 2021-22 season

soogar

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,080
Yeah I get that argument. She also normally even rotates them clean even if she falls. That being said, the same argument can be said about 5 different sr RUS, right? Including Tuk? In major Sr international events (Euro/WC, never been in a sr GPF), Trusova has lost to more Russians then she beats. She is 0-1 agnst Tuk and 0-2 agnst Anya.
Trusova beat Tuk at nationals. So I would say 1-1 for that. Trusova doesn’t have to skate clean- she has the base value.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
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53,256
How concerned should we be about Sasha and Anna struggling in the SP?

Any news on if KV and the Russian Figure Skating Olympic team is vaccinated?

They won't have any fun in Beijing they will have to probably stay in the bubble and maybe that will increase their chances of testing negative.

And wouldn't it be interesting if China is doing better with Omicron than the rest of the world is?
I am not worried about Sasha, but I am about Anna. That fall on the 3Lz was uncharacteristic for her. Sasha's fall on the 3A was not uncharacteristic. She has never landed the 3A in any competition. She needs to play it safe and do a clean SP with a 2A.

I am concerned that Anna's injury may still be bothering her, but in the warm up she did a beautiful 3Lz3R combination. I think the LP may give us a better idea.

I do remember a similar situation for Anna from the 2018 GPF. She fell in the SP but skated great in the LP. Of course she didn't have the injury back then. She did the 4Lz in the LP.
 

Wyliefan

Trying to appease the skategods
Messages
35,344
Anna needs a really good free skate to get her head right for the Olympics.

She is the most stable of the Russian skaters since Medvedeva. Seeing her make mistakes in programs it's becoming alarming and it's getting into her head according to her comments after her skate today.
Can I ask what her comments were? I missed the press conference.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
Messages
53,256
(Continued)

If Anna struggles again in the LP, I think the RSF may do something about it. A skate off is not out of the question, or they may just convince her to give up her Olympic berth, in exchange for something (Worlds?). I doubt that she will give it up though. The fed will have to make the decision. Actually she does not have that Olympic berth. Didn't they say they will decide after the Europeans?
 

olympic

Well-Known Member
Messages
10,512
First, I think Valieva would medal, if not win, at the Olympics in the men's singles if the short's rules and scoring were the same.
Are you assuming a 4S and 4T? I don't think she could ever beat Chen or Hanyu, or Jin, Uno or Zhou. These 5 have good SPs with jumps above the 4S level.
 

angi

Well-Known Member
Messages
578
From the translation she said it's in her head now. Which is shocking because she's just so stable. Anna is human and I think all the talk about her not deserving 3rd place at nationals has gotten into her mind.
I think it's basically the company line at this point to blame it on a mental block and act surprised since they rarely admit to injuries at Sambo unless they absolutely have to when it results in skaters withdrawing from competitions. I also saw Anna land a clean 3Lz3T during the warm-up but to me at least she has been looking visibly injured throughout most of the season and here her speed was lacking and her spins were slow and labored and she looked like she was struggling to change position during them. There's a deterioration that's been visible imo all season and while I do believe she can pull off a well-skated FS here, it is worrying for the Olympics and for next season as well.
 

Coco

Rotating while Russian!
Messages
17,668
Based on TT consistency in the past, I think it's safe to say she does not have the 3z3l combo. She should switch back to 3z 3T. It's not worth the extra .77 points.
 

Spikefan

At the Hubbell Salon
Messages
2,484
I think it's basically the company line at this point to blame it on a mental block and act surprised since they rarely admit to injuries at Sambo unless they absolutely have to when it results in skaters withdrawing from competitions. I also saw Anna land a clean 3Lz3T during the warm-up but to me at least she has been looking visibly injured throughout most of the season and here her speed was lacking and her spins were slow and labored and she looked like she was struggling to change position during them. There's a deterioration that's been visible imo all season and while I do believe she can pull off a well-skated FS here, it is worrying for the Olympics and for next season as well.
I doubt she will make it out of Russia next season (other than initial GP assignments). As she came off the ice today I got the impression that she recognized this was her last short program at Europeans.
 

Scott512

Well-Known Member
Messages
812
I think it's basically the company line at this point to blame it on a mental block and act surprised since they rarely admit to injuries at Sambo unless they absolutely have to when it results in skaters withdrawing from competitions. I also saw Anna land a clean 3Lz3T during the warm-up but to me at least she has been looking visibly injured throughout most of the season and here her speed was lacking and her spins were slow and labored and she looked like she was struggling to change position during them. There's a deterioration that's been visible imo all season and while I do believe she can pull off a well-skated FS here, it is worrying for the Olympics and for next season as well.
I think the injuries are a factor she's had toe and that injuries this season. But skaters skated through women she's trying to do that now if that is truly the problem. Or KV could be putting so much pressure on her teammates it may be causing them to struggle.
 

Arch-

Active Member
Messages
60
Are you assuming a 4S and 4T? I don't think she could ever beat Chen or Hanyu, or Jin, Uno or Zhou. These 5 have good SPs with jumps above the 4S level.
Zhou's short was such a disaster at worlds that he didn't qualify for the free skate and Jin finished 22nd with under 200 points total,
2 of the 5 you listed listed finished 22nd or below at last worlds. Neither have 'good short programs'. I'm not sure if Jin is even competing in Beijing, but at last World's he scored under 200 total.

Zhou's short was so bad at Worlds he didn't make the free skate. And at this year's nationals his long was so disastrous he almost lost bronze to a quad-less Jason Brown, who has zero chance ever of a Oly or World's podium or beating Valieva even if she fell twice with her current long program.

But yes I'm thinking doing what she is currently doing, just in the short too. So a short like 4s, 3a, 4t+3t.

Then a potential silver or bronze with a 3 quad/two 3a long program. She's not been pushed so we do not know her max but a long layout like; 4s, 3a+3t, 3a, 3lz, 4t+eu+3s, 4s+2t, 3f.
Trusova beat Tuk at nationals. So I would say 1-1 for that. Trusova doesn’t have to skate clean- she has the base value.
Copy/paste comment #1,887. It's only like 10 comments up.
 

olympic

Well-Known Member
Messages
10,512
2 of the 5 you listed listed finished 22nd or below at last worlds. Neither have 'good short programs'. I'm not sure if Jin is even competing in Beijing, but at last World's he scored under 200 total.

Zhou's short was so bad at Worlds he didn't make the free skate. And at this year's nationals his long was so disastrous he almost lost bronze to a quad-less Jason Brown, who has zero chance ever of a Oly or World's podium or beating Valieva even if she fell twice with her current long program.

But yes I'm thinking doing what she is currently doing, just in the short too. So a short like 4s, 3a, 4t+3t.

Then a potential silver or bronze with a 3 quad/two 3a long program. She's not been pushed so we do not know her max but a long layout like; 4s, 3a+3t, 3a, 3lz, 4t+eu+3s, 4s+2t, 3f.

Copy/paste comment #1,887. It's only like 10 comments up.
Zhou’s and Jin’s SPs are definitely great and marked accordingly. I think though you are taking the best of Kamila and the worst of the men you cited. Assume that everyone is clean or put them on an even playing field
 

feraina

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,392
I think the injuries are a factor she's had toe and that injuries this season. But skaters skated through women she's trying to do that now if that is truly the problem. Or KV could be putting so much pressure on her teammates it may be causing them to struggle.

All her coaches looked very worried/anxious before she got on the ice for her SP. For whatever reasons, they didn’t seem particularly confident in her.
 

Scott512

Well-Known Member
Messages
812
All her coaches looked very worried/anxious before she got on the ice for her SP. For whatever reasons, they didn’t seem particularly confident in her.
I know I feel the same way there was some anxious looks but but Anna has won so much the last 3 years a couple of off skates and people are howling about her not being on the Olympic team. This is where she has to show her mental toughness due of pretty good to very good freescape and calm people down. But it's possible she played herself off the team event in the Olympics if she does go to the Olympics.

If the rules are still the same for the team event I would give kV both skates I would give the top dance team who are the world champions both skates and I would split the men and the pairs.

Of course if it comes down to the ladies in the team event and Russia is out of the gold medal race which is possible if the other 3 disciplines fail them then KV would only get one skate.

Anyway it will be interesting to see if Anna can show some better form in the free skate. She kind of needs to even though she's done so much winning the last 3 years.
 

AxelAnnie

Like a small boat on the ocean...
Messages
14,463
(Continued)

If Anna struggles again in the LP, I think the RSF may do something about it. A skate off is not out of the question, or they may just convince her to give up her Olympic berth, in exchange for something (Worlds?). I doubt that she will give it up though. The fed will have to make the decision. Actually she does not have that Olympic berth. Didn't they say they will decide after the Europeans?
IMO, a skate-off is absolutely ridiculous. What is the point? If they are going to display their programs, and have judges who has the most beautiful program, or costume, or whatever. But a skate-off that is looking at jumps really shows nothing, except what happens that day in that skate. To make a decision about OLYS because of one skate just seems silly. IMO it does nothing to evaluate who will do the best at OLYS.
 

love_skate2011

Banned Member
Messages
3,608
Shcherbakova is Clutch, say what you will but she comes back time after time, I think shes more gritty then Medvedeva coz she was always an underdog. Sorry the Liza conversation is over

Valieva really needed that fall, she needed the a hiccup before the Olympics.
I was really hoping she would make a mistake here than the next event.
 

Scott512

Well-Known Member
Messages
812
Shcherbakova is Clutch, say what you will but she comes back time after time, I think shes more gritty then Medvedeva coz she was always an underdog. Sorry the Liza conversation is over

Valieva really needed that fall, she needed the a hiccup before the Olympics.
I was really hoping she would make a mistake here than the next event.
Anna clutched up.

A few girls struggled today and that's too bad.
I will not say KV struggled but she did have a fall. Maybe it's what she needed and she's still won going away.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
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53,256
She's only human. But even skating like this in the Olympics it will be hard to catch her. Sasha would have to hit like 4 quads probably with KV falling at least once.
KV will still have about a 15 point cushion from the SP.
 

Arch-

Active Member
Messages
60
Shcherbakova is Clutch, say what you will but she comes back time after time, I think shes more gritty then Medvedeva coz she was always an underdog. Sorry the Liza conversation is over

Valieva really needed that fall, she needed the a hiccup before the Olympics.
I was really hoping she would make a mistake here than the next event.
Yeah Anya = Gamer

Looks like her left knee was wrapped pretty heavily. I didn't notice it being like that in the short. That 3lz3l still looks risky imo.

I'm eating crow regarding Trusova. I honestly in my heart thought the RUS team should be Misha, Anya, Tuk. Though it KILLS me bc I believe Tuk deserves a spot, I'm ready to admit I'm wrong. Trusova over Liza 100%. Sasha looked great at Rus nats and impressive enough at Euros.

Is there not a thought that she could score higher if she went to a clean strategically placed 3 quad program? As a Sr internationally at worlds & her two euros, she is a constant bronze. Her 3+3's GOE are high and maybe a program w/o those breaks/falls in the program would raise her components into the low 70s which I think would beat Anya for a silver. Thoughts?
 

love_skate2011

Banned Member
Messages
3,608
It works better for Scherbakova when shes the underdog, she finds a way to claw her way up.
I think a 3 quad will be very close to Kamila but 3 quads isn't happening her 4Lutz have been unstable or nowhere to be landed this season.

two 4F one in combo is possible. She seems to struggle a bit with her 3LZ-3Lo
at least she still lands them mostly, Trusova seems to have lost her 3lz-3lo in competitions ?
 

Fadeevfanboy

Well-Known Member
Messages
300
Yeah Anya = Gamer

Looks like her left knee was wrapped pretty heavily. I didn't notice it being like that in the short. That 3lz3l still looks risky imo.

I'm eating crow regarding Trusova. I honestly in my heart thought the RUS team should be Misha, Anya, Tuk. Though it KILLS me bc I believe Tuk deserves a spot, I'm ready to admit I'm wrong. Trusova over Liza 100%. Sasha looked great at Rus nats and impressive enough at Euros.

Is there not a thought that she could score higher if she went to a clean strategically placed 3 quad program? As a Sr internationally at worlds & her two euros, she is a constant bronze. Her 3+3's GOE are high and maybe a program w/o those breaks/falls in the program would raise her components into the low 70s which I think would beat Anya for a silver. Thoughts?
I don't think Trusova wants silver. She wants gold. And she knows her only hope of beating Valieva who is a better all around skater is doing more quads. She is just hoping one of these days she lands them all, and the overall effect of them will raise all her scores.
 

Fadeevfanboy

Well-Known Member
Messages
300
I thought after the short program the door was opened for Tuk. to be in consideration, but after today I think it was slammed shut again. Especialy as Anna is the one who probably had to falter, and instead she did her best LP in years and nearly won the LP.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
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53,256
I don't think Trusova wants silver. She wants gold. And she knows her only hope of beating Valieva who is a better all around skater is doing more quads. She is just hoping one of these days she lands them all, and the overall effect of them will raise all her scores.
I admire her spirit. She is a fierce competitor. All the best to her.
 

Vash01

Fan of Yuzuru, T&M, P&C
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53,256
I thought after the short program the door was opened for Tuk. to be in consideration, but after today I think it was slammed shut again. Especialy as Anna is the one who probably had to falter, and instead she did her best LP in years and nearly won the LP.
Her LP in last year's nationals was truly heroic. She had been sick. Her coaches wanted her to withdraw from the LP. She insisted on competing, landed two quads, and skated an LP that made her coaches tear up. That was her best LP ever, but given what she has been through this year, today's performance was just as heroic. She was in danger of losing her Olympic spot. She is a clutch player. She gets it done when she must.
 

Scott512

Well-Known Member
Messages
812
Yeah Anya = Gamer

Looks like her left knee was wrapped pretty heavily. I didn't notice it being like that in the short. That 3lz3l still looks risky imo.

I'm eating crow regarding Trusova. I honestly in my heart thought the RUS team should be Misha, Anya, Tuk. Though it KILLS me bc I believe Tuk deserves a spot, I'm ready to admit I'm wrong. Trusova over Liza 100%. Sasha looked great at Rus nats and impressive enough at Euros.

Is there not a thought that she could score higher if she went to a clean strategically placed 3 quad program? As a Sr internationally at worlds & her two euros, she is a constant bronze. Her 3+3's GOE are high and maybe a program w/o those breaks/falls in the program would raise her components into the low 70s which I think would beat Anya for a silver. Thoughts?
Anna is very clutch and much tougher than she looks but so was Evgenia and for those three adult years with EG she was super clutch and completely unbeatable before her foot injury.

Of course Liza should be on the Olympic team figure skating needs to figure out a better system to get the better athletes in the top competitions. The need to use a system a little more like Golf and Tennis so the top competitors get rewarded or at least in the Grand Prix season if a country dominates one discipline like Russia does a and Single Ladies then you get an extra spot at Worlds or the Olympics or Europeans or for cc or whatever. If they use the formula for the Grand Prix season that I suggested then many small countries with lesser talent would still be able to come to the big competitions and grow their Sport in their country. There are things to blame the Russian figure skating Federation for but Liza not being on the Olympic team is not one of them show. It's it's the system the international figure skating union uses that is the issue and the reason Liza is not on the Russian Olympic team.

What is Liza's world ranking like five or six?
Can you imagine the number five or six tennis player or the number five or six golfer not going to the Summer Olympics? Or the number five or six skier or bobsledder not going to the Winter Olympics?

I mean would everything be thrown out of whack at a Europeans the Olympics or worlds is Russia got one extra spot for the ladies because they've got five of the six grand prix final spots and would have had all six if Sasha did not break her foot? Of course not. The sport has no modern leadership or modern ideas other than the coaches and quads and triple axels.

In conclusion no one is holding the growth of figure skating back more than the ISU.
 

alice73

Active Member
Messages
57
Usually just lurk and don’t comment much, but couldn’t help it this time. Several of Anna’s jumps were under rotated in the free. It’s obvious on the replay. When I watched it, I couldn’t believe it. Her TES yesterday was a joke (and in the short too). I say this with full respect for Anna’s strength and grit. She’s an amazing competitor but it doesn’t change the fact that several of her jumps shouldn’t have counted as triples. It’s cheating, and most likely next year when she’s discarded in favor of the next 15 year old, the judges won’t be as nice. And I feel bad for other skaters, not coached by Tutberidze, when their jumps are scrutinized against them.
 

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