Royalty Thread #16: the best of times, the worst of times

skategal said:
I think someone on Reddit may have hit it on the nose when they detailed:

Charles is dying. William will be King. George is under 18. If something happens to William there will be a need for a regent. The regent must be domiciled in the UK.

Catherine can’t be Regent until the UK Parliament changes legislation to allow it. The UK Parliament is a mess right now.

Assume William will make this change when he is King but in the meantime, if Harry couldn’t be Regent, it would fall to Andrew or at least he could claim it which would be the death of the Monarchy.

All that plus giving the kids a chance to know their grandfather before he passes makes sense to me.

All of this is speculation but I can see Charles not wanting to leave any loose ends before he passes.
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I have no doubt that Katherine and William will fight tooth and nail to make sure Harry is never regent with whatever legislation is necessary. If the regent cannot be Katherine I would actually think Edward would be the better choice.

He is younger than Anne and I suspect William and Kate trust him and Sophie far more than Harry and Meghan. The public too.

An easy law saying king/Queen can pick anyone of Counselor of state to be regent would be done.
 
becca said:
I have no doubt that Katherine and William will fight tooth and nail to make sure Harry is never regent with whatever legislation is necessary. If the regent cannot be Katherine I would actually think Edward would be the better choice.

He is younger than Anne and I suspect William and Kate trust him far more than Harry and Meghan.
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There is a line of succession for the Regent just as there is for the throne.

They have to change legislation in Parliament to change it. Not an easy task.

They can't just decide to skip Harry and/or Andrew in favour of Kate or Edward.
 
Barbara Manatee said:
I cannot see Charles encouraging Harry to establish residency just in case a regent is needed. He knows it'd be a disaster for the monarchy and the family. And it would only give William extra incentive to start the process to remove Harry and Andrew from the line of succession as soon as he becomes king.
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I can. The monarchs and heirs have drilled in them "The Crown above everything" from birth.

It would be an even bigger disaster to have the Regency in the hands of Andrew.

It is not easy to remove Harry and Andrew from the line of succession.

Charles won't do it and if William starts the process as King it could be years before it is completed.

What if William dies in the meantime too? Or is killed?

What a mess that would be.

George being younger than 18 and the longevity of the Monarchy is the big issue here, IMO.
 
skategal said:
There is a line of succession for the Regent just as there is for the throne.

They have to change legislation in Parliament to change it. Not an easy task.

They can't just decide to skip Harry and/or Andrew.
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Yes I know this but doesn’t mean it cannot be done. And as I said before when it comes to the welfare of their children I have no doubt this would be a drag down fight on their end.

However this is unlikely to happen. William is in his forties, And George is what 13 in less than a decade he won’t need a regent.

I actually think historically in many ways Regent based on line of succession is problematic.

One of the benefits of it being someone like Edward is Edward never seemed to care much that he was never going to be King. Because he was so far removed from his siblings and so was like whatever. A regent who doesn’t care that he is not the star is actually ideal.
 
Barbara Manatee said:
My guess is that Harry is very unhappy in the US having found nothing really to do with himself. He's realized that "freedom" isn't all it's cracked up to be and being treated like a prince was actually kind of awesome. And he is frustrated and baffled by the smoking crater that is his popularity. I think he imagines that if he goes back home and starts visiting hospitals and kissing puppies like a real royal, everyone will love him again.
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It would appear so. What I don't get is why Meghan would agree to this. Granted, public persona can be completely different from reality, but life in California seems to suit her. She has friends and interests and a lovely home and is basically free to do whatever she wants. In England, she won't be able to make a move without it being scrutinized to death, and I can't even imagine what it's going to be like for her kids. Maybe the media will be courteous given their ages, but they still have to deal with other kids. Even if it's an elite school, well that could be worse for a couple of mixed race kids with American accents and notorious parents who are likely to be in the news on a near daily basis, at least for awhile.
 
becca said:
Yes I know this but doesn’t mean it cannot be done. And as I said before when it comes to the welfare of their children I have no doubt this would be a drag down fight on their end.

However this is unlikely to happen. William is in his forties, And George is what 13 in less than a decade he won’t need a regent.

I actually think historically in many ways Regent based on line of succession is problematic.

One of the benefits of it being someone like Edward is Edward never seemed to care much that he was never going to be King. Because he was so far removed from his siblings and so was like whatever. A regent who doesn’t care that he is not the star is actually ideal.
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It can be done.

But Charles won’t do it. William will and it will take time to do it and they need a Regent in the meantime who won’t be Andrew.

So it will be Harry until it’s someone else.
 
skategal said:
It can be done.

But Charles won’t do it. William will and it will take time to do it and they need a Regent in the meantime who won’t be Andrew.

So it will be Harry until it’s someone else.
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Charles arranged it so that his siblings Edward and Anne could be Councilors of State. He did it not removing Andrew or Harry but by just adding those too.

I suspect a similar thing with Regent. Harry won’t be removed as an option but the laws will be changed so someone like Edward or Anne could be chosen and I actually think he would be the ideal choice. Anne would be too but given her age quite a lot to ask of her
 
Obviously I don't know the actual rules here, but some quick research suggests that there are no rules. There have been many regents in British history for many reasons, and there doesn't seem to be any pattern to how one is chosen. Given that recent years have seen QEII change the rules to put Charlotte in her rightful place of succession and Charles has stripped his brother of his royal titles and status, it seems to me that they can do whatever they want - and that they've thought it through carefully.

If by chance something tragic happens, then why not Queen Camilla or future Queen Mother Catherine as regent until George/Charlotte/Louis is ready to assume the throne?
 
Jenny said:
Obviously I don't know the actual rules here, but some quick research suggests that there are no rules. There have been many regents in British history for many reasons, and there doesn't seem to be any pattern to how one is chosen. Given that recent years have seen QEII change the rules to put Charlotte in her rightful place of succession and Charles has stripped his brother of his royal titles and status, it seems to me that they can do whatever they want - and that they've thought it through carefully.

If by chance something tragic happens, then why not Queen Camilla or future Queen Mother Catherine as regent until George/Charlotte/Louis is ready to assume the throne?
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There are laws in place about regents.

I don’t think William would want Camilla at all as regent yes Catherine could be a choice as well but she might prefer Edward handling it.

Edward does more duties than her now….

IMO regent shouldn’t be just about line of succession because it’s also about protection a child’s inheritance…

And preparing the child to be monarch. Someone who is out to promote himself and his family may not be best choice
 
skategal said:
I think someone on Reddit may have hit it on the nose when they detailed:

Charles is dying. William will be King. George is under 18. If something happens to William there will be a need for a regent. The regent must be domiciled in the UK.

Catherine can’t be Regent until the UK Parliament changes legislation to allow it. The UK Parliament is a mess right now.

Assume William will make this change when he is King but in the meantime, if Harry couldn’t be Regent, it would fall to Andrew or at least he could claim it which would be the death of the Monarchy.

All that plus giving the kids a chance to know their grandfather before he passes makes sense to me.

All of this is speculation but I can see Charles not wanting to leave any loose ends before he passes.
Click to expand...
This is not true. When Elizabeth became Queen the necessary legislation was enacted that would have made Philip regent. I'm positive the UK Parliament would do the same should William become King before George is 18. The UK Parliament is not in that much of a mess that they would delay passing the necessary legislation.

Neither Harry nor Andrew would be allowed to serve as Regent - that responsibility would fall to Edward or Anne, who are both Counsellors of State thanks to legislation passed by the UK Parliament when Charles became King.
 
Barbara Manatee said:
Maybe because she loves Harry?
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Here's hoping, for his sake as much as anything. Maybe she is thinking that he did a lot for her in leaving the firm and his homeland, so she's willing to do this for him.

Other theories flying about, beyond Harry wanting to be near his father and the kids to know their grandfather, is that they're broke, so maybe some sort of deal has been cut, but it does seem unlikely to me that Charles would want to bribe him. Might be more worried about his grandkids not getting (what he feels is) a proper education and becoming too American (especially now) though, so perhaps he's offered to do something for the kids, now and in the future. I could see suggesting the same to William - if the brothers can't reconcile, maybe they can at least be nice to each other's kids.

Not sure where the actual facts are coming from at this point, but it's also being suggested that this is temporary - to be near Charles in his final years, maybe to get the kids at least a partial posh British education. They've clung to the titles after all, so that status at least seems to matter to them.
 
@skategal There are certain media that you know comes straight from the Sussexes. Just as there are certain media that you know comes straight from Charles/the Palace. And from their account Charles was only informed of this decision on Sunday.

There have been drips that you can be sure comes straight from the Sussexes hinting for some time that Harry wants his kids to go to school in the UK. That he is struggling to find himself in the US.

I think what is clearly obvious is that the initial interest and money being thrown at the Sussexes has dried up as time passes and their royal connections wane. Because the harsh reality is that there was only ever interest in these two because they were royals the general public is not interested in jams, flower sprinkles or paid speeches he dusts off and repeats for any group that thinks having a prince speak in their basement venue adds some value somehow.

BBC reports they will be living in a private non-royal residence as private citizens. That there is still no half-in/half-out arrangement. But I suspect they imagine having physical roots in the UK might make that easier one day AND make it harder for the next monarch to makes changes to the LOS etc..

I guess this was all arranged with the Spencers if Charles only heard of it on Sunday?
 
I really like Harry and Meghan. If you want to mend things then living in a different country doesn’t help especially with his dad and the cancer etc. I really hope the tabloids leave them alone .. probably not though. I think both of them are more prepared for this though.
 
once_upon said:
There seems to be a lot of hate for this couple. Granted I'm not British or a person who lives in a monarch nation, but it seems to me, there is a need/desire to make someone a scapegoat.

Now that Camilla has become accepted and named Queen, Andrew the Disowned formerly known as Prince Andrew has been banned, Harry and Meghan - but Meghan specifically - are the most hated. They were hated before but they are now the sole target.

Does it really matter why he is coming "home"? I think all the reasons are reasonable to return.

Or it could be just to piss off some of you.
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Which, though I am sure is completely unintended by them, would amuse me greatly.
 
Karen-W said:
This is not true. When Elizabeth became Queen the necessary legislation was enacted that would have made Philip regent. I'm positive the UK Parliament would do the same should William become King before George is 18. The UK Parliament is not in that much of a mess that they would delay passing the necessary legislation.

Neither Harry nor Andrew would be allowed to serve as Regent - that responsibility would fall to Edward or Anne, who are both Counsellors of State thanks to legislation passed by the UK Parliament when Charles became King.
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From what I am reading Harry was only disqualified because he didn’t live in the UK and could be reinstated easily if living in the UK.
 
Whether or not Harry and Meghan are broke, he was one of the seven unsuccessful plaintiffs in that lawsuit against The Daily Mail who are jointly and severally liable for a cost bill believed to exceed £34 million. He is probably not the wealthiest member of that septet, but he was the most outspoken. I would think that The Daily Mail will try to collect from him first.
 
skategal said:
From what I am reading Harry was only disqualified because he didn’t live in the UK and could be reinstated easily if living in the UK.
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Harry hasn't been disqualified from being a Counsellor of State nor the Line of Succession. He was still considered domiciled in the UK the entire time they've been in the US.

But, again, there's no way that Harry will be allowed to serve as Regent should Charles and William pass away in the next 5 years.
 
marbri said:
@skategal There are certain media that you know comes straight from the Sussexes. Just as there are certain media that you know comes straight from Charles/the Palace. And from their account Charles was only informed of this decision on Sunday.

There have been drips that you can be sure comes straight from the Sussexes hinting for some time that Harry wants his kids to go to school in the UK. That he is struggling to find himself in the US.

I think what is clearly obvious is that the initial interest and money being thrown at the Sussexes has dried up as time passes and their royal connections wane. Because the harsh reality is that there was only ever interest in these two because they were royals the general public is not interested in jams, flower sprinkles or paid speeches he dusts off and repeats for any group that thinks having a prince speak in their basement venue adds some value somehow.

BBC reports they will be living in a private non-royal residence as private citizens. That there is still no half-in/half-out arrangement. But I suspect they imagine having physical roots in the UK might make that easier one day AND make it harder for the next monarch to makes changes to the LOS etc..

I guess this was all arranged with the Spencers if Charles only heard of it on Sunday?
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“Informed of the decision on Sunday” doesn’t mean Charles wasn’t aware that it was under consideration and didn’t request them to return to the UK.
 
millyskate said:
Oh dear. I find them utterly insufferable and now they will be all.over the British news and impossible to ignore.
From whining about not having tax payer funded security for a 2 week trip to moving here full time... They must have run out of money. Or Harry's visa was going to be put in question.
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💯

Richard Eden was laughed at a year ago when said Project Thaw was a real thing.

www.yahoo.com

Inside The Alleged Establishment 'Plot' To Bring Prince Harry And Meghan Markle Back To The Royal Family

Shocking details have emerged of an alleged establishment plot to bring Prince Harry and Meghan Markle back into the royal family.
www.yahoo.com www.yahoo.com
 
I really hope Harry is able to mend his relationship with his family. I couldn't care less about the throne. the only regents I've ever cared about are the regents exams I took as a student, and the regents my kids have taken. There are more important things in life than titles.
 
I actually thought it was simply to get the kids a better education. Harry believes that the education opportunities in the UK are better for his kids. In addition, it will allow him and his family to see more of Charles.........

Yes, Charles is dying but one could say that for Catherine (I certainly hope not of course). Is Charles death imminent? I thought the cancer was under control - he may have 10 - 20 more years........

I agree with everyone that Andrew would be a disaster in any role whatsoever. He is best kept well out of the public eye as much as possible.

William is very young and yes, he could be killed but the chances are hopefully quite low.......

Is it feasible to place an 18 year old George in as a king????? I guess legally he is an adult but gee, seems like a tough "first job".

I also assumed, which means nothing of course, that M and H would return to Calif for holidays and summer breaks?

I agree Anne or Edward would be the best choices as regent if necessary and I would Anne over Edward.
 
Titles do seem to be more important in the UK? A title comes with privileges and other such perks making it desirable to have one.
 
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