Olympic Qualifications

allezfred

Lipinski Stole My Catchphrase
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I do not think it was anything nefarious. I think it was a lack of basic reading comprehension.

Like Tony I had multiple people message me about the spot allocations. I explained it to them over and over, but the one thing they kept saying was “Jackie said...”

A few weeks back I had to submit a report to our national Olympic committee on the Beijing quota places for the ISU sports which was why I was so sure about the calculation method. I had read it back to front and upside down and did simulations based on 2019 Worlds. If I hadn’t done that, I might very well have been one of the people who believed the most trusted source in skating.
 

Karen-W

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I do not think it was anything nefarious. I think it was a lack of basic reading comprehension.

Like Tony I had multiple people message me about the spot allocations. I explained it to them over and over, but the one thing they kept saying was “Jackie said...”

A few weeks back I had to submit a report to our national Olympic committee on the Beijing quota places for the ISU sports which was why I was so sure about the calculation method. I had read it back to front and upside down and did simulations based on 2019 Worlds. If I hadn’t done that, I might very well have been one of the people who believed the most trusted source in skating.
Lack of basic reading comprehension or not bothering to read the document at all, lol.

I admit, until tony and I were PMing early in the week about it, I thought the document was really difficult to read, so I can see why you read it back to front and upside down to get a firm handle on it.
 

Braulio

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If I were a skater, no, I wouldn't want to wait that long and have a very long weekend to mess with my head. Because it's clear different skaters are being told different things by different people, including those in authority, and they're talking and getting hugely stressed out.

Of course, they can wait, because they have no choice but to wait.

Tell that to Donovan Carrillo and his coach Gregorio Nunez who I have been in contact all weekend and STILL doesn't know what to think or believe even though Donovan already gave an interview to the press and said he was out of the Olympics because being shy of 1 spot (per the wrong interpretation and public announcement of this wrong info)

Can you believe that even our National Sports Comitee released a press communication saying that??? based on what Donovan said in his interview and the 'so called information they got from the world championships' Mexican Ice Skating Federation is not caring about it and is not confirming/denying this. In a way I have been informing and getting arguments with some facebook and twitter accounts that cover skating in Mexico trying to make them understand and though they call me 'You are wrong because Donovan already made it public he was not qualified' I INSIST this is not true.

And what about Donovan invited to skate in the Gala but... 'well you are not qualified to the Olympics' yeah...

Even after all this is cleared I am sad that the process wasn't clear in avance to everybody and that some statement over twitter and the quiet posture from the ISU didn't let skaters like Donovan celebrate after the Free Skate was over and had to pass this entire weekend thinking something, then having hope, all this stressfull situation.

And that in the case ISU publishes this monday the official list, because they can make it later, so MORE days added to this anxious waiting that didn't have to happen
 
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thvu

Usova's Apprentice
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And that in the case ISU publishes this monday the official list, because they can make it later, so MORE days added to this anxious waiting that didn't have to happen
Hopefully Jackie Wong will have some humility about how much stress and consternation his poor reporting has caused. People are literally trusting him and his unwillingness to independently think over ISU documentation. These poor skaters. I'm so glad people like you @Braulio and @tony are pushing back and trying to make sure people understand what the document actually says, and why Jackie Wong is wrong.

#wongiswrong
 

tony

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Hopefully Jackie Wong will have some humility about how much stress and consternation his poor reporting has caused. People are literally trusting him and his unwillingness to independently think over ISU documentation. These poor skaters. I'm so glad people like you @Braulio and @tony are pushing back and trying to make sure people understand what the document actually says, and why Jackie Wong is wrong.

#wongiswrong
Well the annoying part now is that these people repeating his interpretation get to hold off at least another day when the ISU 100% told at least two athletes that it would all be resolved 'Monday'. It's evening in Europe now, doubtful it happens today.

It's literally a communication with a table listing some IOC codes and numbers.
 

Coco

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I really object to that hashtag. Making puns of Asian last names is not ok. Also, he was reporting what he was told.

Why not #ditchmitch? Or is that already taken, lol.
 

tony

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I really object to that hashtag. Making puns of Asian last names is not ok. Also, he was reporting what he was told.

Why not #ditchmitch? Or is that already taken, lol.
Well the info obviously didn’t come from Mitch seeing how, according to Hersh, Moyer didn’t know much of anything.
 

MacMadame

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Well the annoying part now is that these people repeating his interpretation get to hold off at least another day when the ISU 100% told at least two athletes that it would all be resolved 'Monday'. It's evening in Europe now, doubtful it happens today.

It's literally a communication with a table listing some IOC codes and numbers.
Okay, that I object to. I thought waiting until Monday was reasonable because on Saturday evening, by the time the FD results were finalized (as it tends to happen a few hours after the event), it would be late and Sunday is a day of rest with probably no one in the office. But no reason not to do it first thing Monday.

Until the ISU is also confused about their own rules and is spending their time trying to figure it out. :eek:
 

Braulio

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I really object to that hashtag. Making puns of Asian last names is not ok. Also, he was reporting what he was told.

Why not #ditchmitch? Or is that already taken, lol.

And once again I say: DO YOU SEE THAT hashtag being a Trending Topic on twitter???? I can give you my twitter profile and see I have NEVER (nor Tony) used it over there. Please stop this, we already have this stress enough to be caring about useless points and arguing about a 'hashtag' never used or made it public outside an only paid access thread.

The real issue is that a wrong interpretation was made public and since he is kind of a reference to the skating community it created all this conflict, that has to be the focus that really made Twitter and had real repercutions
 

thvu

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I really object to that hashtag. Making puns of Asian last names is not ok. Also, he was reporting what he was told.

Why not #ditchmitch? Or is that already taken, lol.
I mean, I don’t object to it. And I’m someone to whom the uptick in anti-Asian hate crimes is scary af. As a Vietnamese & Chinese American, I didn’t take offense to the original and subsequent uses of the hashtag on this forum.

I also don’t believe that invoking his name is problematic, since as a reporter, his name brings value and credence to what he says, hence all the confusion.

I clearly don’t take offense to Jackie Wong because he’s Asian. I take offense to him because, as someone who has chosen to be a public figure, he’s displaying undue arrogance and dismissiveness to people bringing real concerns accompanied with text-based arguments.
 

allezfred

Lipinski Stole My Catchphrase
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The quota places likely have to be approved also by the IOC so that might be why it is taking a little while for the ISU to announce.
 

Sylvia

Off season is club competition season!
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I was told yesterday that the skaters and their federations may have to wait for ~2 weeks. :(

From the G. QUALIFICATION TIMELINE on page 7:
"Inform By 11 April 2021 First list of NOCs having earned quotas from the ISU World Figure Skating Championships"
 

mjb52

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Tatiana Flade has also made a video explaining qualifying procedures, and she has it the same way everyone else does aside from Wong.

Ah, great, thanks. The US is generally so influential I guess I'm just a bit nervous it might push for whatever appears to be its version of how they saw the rule, since that seems to be the issue - a disparity between how the USFS sees it and everyone else? But that's probably a bit neurotic of me.
 

tony

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Ah, great, thanks. The US is so influential I guess I'm just a bit nervous it might push for whatever appears to be its version of how they saw the rule, since that seems to be the issue - a disparity between how the USFS sees it and everyone else? But that's probably a bit neurotic of me.
I think, based on the deduction of the Tweets of Wong and then Hersh, that the US really didn't know much at all. If Hersh was getting quotes from Moyer not understanding the process, then Jackie couldn't have really gone to anyone that high up in USFS unless they really are that disorganized and don't even discuss amongst themselves.

There's zero chance that anything gets changed to benefit the USFS. Because even in Jackie's version, the skaters still have to earn those third ladies and mens spots.
 

Karen-W

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Ah, great, thanks. The US is generally so influential I guess I'm just a bit nervous it might push for whatever appears to be its version of how they saw the rule, since that seems to be the issue - a disparity between how the USFS sees it and everyone else? But that's probably a bit neurotic of me.
But others have commented that Skate Canada's officials also seemed to misunderstand the rule as well in their tweets over the weekend. So, I think this is really just a situation of some feds not really bothering to read the document carefully or think that it would apply to them when it was passed in 2018 (though the USFS should have since part of why it was passed was because of our pairs teams' finishes at 2017 Worlds).
 

millyskate

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Ah, great, thanks. The US is generally so influential I guess I'm just a bit nervous it might push for whatever appears to be its version of how they saw the rule, since that seems to be the issue - a disparity between how the USFS sees it and everyone else? But that's probably a bit neurotic of me.
I'm always afraid of this too. Journalists and feds actually have real power to create confusion where there was no need, to the detriment of those with no lobby power.

I'm flabbergasted that feds didn't do their homework. Kevin Aymoz was also quoted as saying he was happy he'd got a second spot for France, and Scottish newspapers reported that Fear and Gibson had earnt a second dance spot.
The newspapers might have misquoted Kevin but it's still very frustrating.
 

Coco

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Just because X thinks it's so doesn't seem like a good reason to postpone announcing the qualifications.

Maybe they are waiting for in competition drug tests to come back?


If they are honestly still debating the rule, perhaps there was legit confusion over which draft was being voted on.

But honestly, it doesn't change things for the countries that can validate their 2nd or 3rd spot at Nebelhorn. They still have to finish ahead of the 6th place qualifier. I mean... unless they were thinking validating their spots meant something else.

It's the smaller federations who are impacted the most by this decision, if the announcement of qualifiers is delayed because the ISU is trying to make a decision.
 
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tony

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Just because X thinks it's so doesn't seem like a good reason to postpone announcing the qualifications.

Maybe they are waiting for in competition drug tests to come back?


If they are honestly still debating the rule, perhaps there was legit confusion over which draft was being voted on.

But honestly, it doesn't change things for the countries that can validate their 2nd or 3rd spot at Nebelhorn. They still have to finish ahead of the 6th place qualifier. I mean... unless they were thinking validating their spots meant something else.

It's the smaller federations who are impacted the most by this decision, if the announcement of qualifiers is delayed because the ISU is trying to make a decision.
It has to be announced by April 11 per IOC. My issue now becomes that Sarah, NBC researcher (maybe not anymore?), throwing the ISU under the bus for all of this mess based on his latest Tweet. I was told by Bidar on Thursday night that the ISU confirmed he had qualified- I don't know who within the ISU, but he told me it's official per ISU people actually in Stockholm. He also mentioned it would be cleared Monday. Whether that was actually going to happen or not, I don't know. But if they have been through the trenches trying to get it figured out, that contradicts all the 'this is how it is going to be' Tweets to start the week and the confusion.

Nothing I have seen points to the ISU not knowing what they were doing nor that they are struggling right now to interpret the rule they laid out. Member federations that didn't do their homework? Yes. But that's not the ISU.

And there's a big difference between giving 5 temporary spots to countries who didn't have skaters qualify for the LP and/or added an additional entry here versus handing those spots to the skaters who actually were in the free skate.
 

Braulio

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Tatjana Flade also made an english version posted in youtube (a cople of hours ago) of her german explanation of the rule she published this morning (Europe time) and how the rule is clear, how it should be interpreted and not throw into confusion from the begining if read correctly. She gives examples about Men's situation with Canada having only 1 spot assigned at Worlds and 1 more posible that will be win/assigned until and if the canadian skater sent to Nebelhorn finish in the top 7. I stand by my word about who originated this and did not anything to stop spreading confusion until exposed on twitter by skaters & fans
 
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ioana

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She gives examples about Men's situation with Canada having only 1 spot assigned at Worlds and 1 more posible that will be win/assigned until and if the canadian skater sent to Nebelhorn finish in the top 7.

Apologies if this was already covered before, but is that top 7 period or top 7 from the countries trying to confirm/qualify a spot? I.e. if Japan sends a man to Nebelhorn, wouldn't his placements be excluded for the purposes of Olympic qualifying, but still count for individual ranking and points?

Thank you to everyone who explained the qualifying process upthread. It was much easier to catch up this way, instead of going through the live debate :)!
 

allezfred

Lipinski Stole My Catchphrase
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Apologies if this was already covered before, but is that top 7 period or top 7 from the countries trying to confirm/qualify a spot? I.e. if Japan sends a man to Nebelhorn, wouldn't his placements be excluded for the purposes of Olympic qualifying, but still count for individual ranking and points?
It would be the Top 7 countries trying to qualify.

At the last Olympic qualifying in 2017 Alexander Johnson (USA) was second, but as the USA did not need to qualify a spot Ukraine got the final one.

 

Braulio

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