News & Experiences continued

Susan1

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MacMadame

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So Amanda Mull of The Atlantic claims the global supply chain problem are because the haves are rabid consumers and they need to cut it out or we won't be able to get food and medicine.

 

Dobre

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I thought it was OK to have both vaccines at the same time?
Yes.

This was my point. I could have gotten both shots had the Moderna booster been approved just a few days ago; but it's fine. I'm just glad it's been approved as I'm eight months out from my second dose & my sister is nine months out from hers. (Also, maybe I can get it prior to a weekend & spoil myself the following day).
 
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Dobre

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-Washington State is going to require proof of vaccination or a recent negative test to all large ticketed events. (Indoor events of 1,000. Outdoor events of 10,000).

Whither Washington goes, we have a good chance of following.🤞

Those numbers seem uselessly high to me; but it's a start, I guess. How are indoor & outdoor events being defined? Does this mean that events, like all of Washington's multiple state fairs, will be required to request vaccination or a negative test? Because it should. People go inside the many exhibit halls & stables & barns and hang out (without wearing their masks) & chat & avoid the heat and watch showmanship events, etc.

-King County, WA is going to require proof of vaccination for indoor dining, gyms, and indoor & outdoor events of 500 people.
 

allezfred

Lipinski Stole My Catchphrase
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Am waiting at arrivals in Dublin Airport for Mr allezfred and someone has bought a child who keeps coughing. :yikes:
 

Dobre

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I find that the prolific nose uncoverers are frequently also the cough you are trying to pin down in the room.
 

once_upon

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Am waiting at arrivals in Dublin Airport for Mr allezfred and someone has bought a child who keeps coughing. :yikes:
When I was flying home from @suep1963 lake house, there was another passenger in the airport coughing up a lung, with his mask off. Thankfully he was not at my gate or on my flight.
 

Prancer

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So Amanda Mull of The Atlantic claims the global supply chain problem are because the haves are rabid consumers and they need to cut it out or we won't be able to get food and medicine.

She's not the only one. I've read several pieces making that argument.
 

Judy

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She's not the only one. I've read several pieces making that argument.
There is an issue though? Someone told me she went into IKEA and it was almost bare. I also heard there are issues at the liquor store with shortages.

 

Prancer

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There is an issue though? Someone told me she went into IKEA and it was almost bare. I also heard there are issues at the liquor store with shortages.

Shortages, yes, I think everyone knows that. But the argument in question is that one of the causes of the shortages is people buying too much stuff. The excess of shopping is making the supply chain issues much worse.
 

Judy

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Shortages, yes, I think everyone knows that. But the argument in question is that one of the causes of the shortages is people buying too much stuff. The excess of shopping is making the supply chain issues much worse.
I think it is a bit more complicated? It was a developing problem before but ********* made it worse.

Impossible to keep people from shopping though or the success of Amazon.
 

Prancer

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I think it is a bit more complicated?
Yes, that's why the argument is that it is excess shopping is making the problem worse, not that it IS the problem.

And while you can't force people stop shopping, you can perhaps inform them and get them to step back on their own, which is the intent of the arguments. After all, the authors of the arguments have no authority and can only persuade.
 

MacMadame

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She's not the only one. I've read several pieces making that argument.
I would like to see some data even if it's just a poll.

I know for myself, I am definitely spending more. But it's not on useless stuff like a second thingie I already have -- the mindless consumerism of the article. I am replacing my wardrobe that wore out during the ********* when I wasn't going shopping and buying other things like equipment for training, which I was not doing in 2020 (or much of 2021). In fact, my bras are completely worn out and not fitting properly and I still haven't replaced them because that requires in-person shopping and I'm still not doing much of that.

I do think our consumerist society is not sustainable and I would like people to live a more sustainable life but I'm not sure people are going nuts buying crap just to feel good in large quantities. I could be wrong but, like I said, I want to see more than some people's opinions before I start judging other people for the things they are buying.
 

once_upon

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I dont know if it is any less or more consumerism since pan*demic. What I have been saying for at least the last 5-8 years that I don't remember so many storage facilities being built. All to store stuff.

Several people I know downsized by putting stuff in a storage unit and just forget what's there. Instead of checking the storage unit, go out and buy another one.
 

MacMadame

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jeffisjeff

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Both demand and supply have been haywire. Consumer behavior is most certainly part of the problem in many cases. That said, what many people don't get is that "demand" isn't just about consumers, but also businesses and other organizations who need to purchase and use stuff.

But, yes, the SC issues are very complicated. People seem to expect one clean explanation or one definitive piece of data (that is anecdotal, but I get asked about this A LOT). That is impossible because the specific issues causing the shortages vary so much by product, and are sometimes quite unique to a given product. However, at the same time, there are some overarching issues that are affecting lots of products, so we get a kind of correlation. Further, causation isn't such a clean concept here. We've got situations were X, Y and Z are all going on at the same time, causing disruptions. Sometimes, the SC would be OK if it were just X and Y or just Y and Z, but all three is just too much. And people expect X, Y and Z to all be connected somehow to c*vid, when often only X is, while Y and Z are other issues entirely.

I teach this stuff and have been emphasizing to my students the need to stay on top of current events (i.e., read the news - the real news, not twitter), and to do so with a critical and skeptical eye. I've been making them do presentations on news articles, including a breakdown of what makes sense and what doesn't in the "analysis." I try to emphasize that in a few short months (weeks in some cases) they are going to be professionals working in SC and people are going to ask them about this stuff (A LOT) so they need to be prepared to answer in a coherent manner. Further, those water cooler conversations in many organizations are no longer about last night's episode of must-see-tv, they are about what is going on at the ports, or why we are running out of coins, or what size turkeys everyone is going to want to buy this year...
 

Prancer

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I didn't really have anything in mind. Just more than some author's anecdotes or supposition. At least this one had some numbers to go with all those expert opinions. :D
The first piece I read (which I can't find now, of course, although I will keep looking) outlines a number of things that were creating a crisis now, but argues that one major part of the problem was that people started buying a lot online last year and, instead of switching to buying in stores this year (which was expected), continued buying online at much higher rates than in the past.

I came across these pieces while I was looking for articles on fast fashion in the US and the problems it is causing in Ghana. This has nothing to do with C0VID, BTW, just more about consumerism.

I do have some articles relevant to C0VID, however. I thought both of these were really interesting, but then, they deal directly with my work.

A Data Sleuth Challenged A Powerful ********* Scientist. Then He Came After Her.

This is a very long article, but one that is, IMO, important for people who want to understand scientific research and how incredibly sloppy and unreliable it can be.

Since this particular study has come up here, some might find this part interesting:

Now, however, the stakes of getting things wrong are unbelievably high. In June, a group of scientists wrote in JAMA Pediatrics — another prestigious journal — that children in face coverings were inhaling “unacceptable” levels of carbon dioxide. Jay Bhattacharya, a Stanford University professor of medicine, praised it on Fox News and called mask-wearing “child abuse.” Soon after, Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, whom Bhattacharya has advised, blocked schools from requiring masks in the classroom, claiming in an executive order that “forcing children to wear masks could inhibit breathing.”

That study was retracted by the journal after scientists complained about its methodological problems. (The authors have said they stand by their findings and that their critics were not qualified to judge them.)

One of the study's most outspoken detractors was James Heathers, a longtime data detective. He believes that many are taking advantage of the ********* to build their personal brands. “There are people in science who think basically any crisis is an opportunity, anything that becomes a topic du jour is something they should chase,” he said, adding that he wasn’t referring to anyone in particular. “A lot of ********* work is an extension of that same mentality” — that is, “maximally flashy and minimally insightful.”


If you aren't into scientific research (and really, who is?) you might not catch the dig there at the end. Stanford researchers are often accused of "maximally flashy and minimally insightful” research and of being shameless publicity hounds. Does that mean that Stanford research is possibly shady or that some people are biased to find shady results in Stanford studies? Both? Neither?

This one has a similar theme:

The Real Scandal About Ivermectin

It’s not that, under such conditions, a few bad studies were bound to slip through the net. Rather, there is no net.

This is not new or just the result of the *********. Scientists have been railing about how broken the peer review system is for years; to my knowledge, it goes back to the Wakefield study. The best thing that can be said about peer review is that it is better than nothing, but sometimes you can't even say that.

People will, of course, embrace studies that support their viewpoints. But right now, I don't think I would fully trust any study from anyone. I am sometimes amazed at people who think they know enough to do their own research, but then I remember that most people have no clue how completely unreliable so much of "scientific research" really is.

In a few years, we might understand C0VID. Until then.......
 

MacMadame

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including a breakdown of what makes sense and what doesn't in the "analysis."
Speaking of not making sense... in The Atlantic article, the author claims that people were flush with cash from not spending on entertainment and now they are spending like crazy. But @Prancer's article says that online sales when up in 2020 which does not support the idea that people were saving in 2020. It seems more like people were spending their extra cash online.

The first piece I read (which I can't find now, of course, although I will keep looking) outlines a number of things that were creating a crisis now, but argues that one major part of the problem was that people started buying a lot online last year and, instead of switching to buying in stores this year (which was expected), continued buying online at much higher rates than in the past.
The article you posted up above said something similar. Not explicitly that people stayed with online sales instead of going back to in-person buying but that online went up last year and it up even more this year year-over-year. So online sales went up but didn't go back down as things opened up.

People will, of course, embrace studies that support their viewpoints. But right now, I don't think I would fully trust any study from anyone.
One of the principles of the scientific method is that the research has to be repeatable. So I never trust it when the news reports on a single study. There are plenty of single studies that never get repeated, but get splashed all over the news because they are flashy and can generate a click-bait headline.
 

Buzz

Socialist Canada
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From tomorrow restaurants and gyms will be able to fully reopen. Ontario had 373 new cases yesterday with 6 deaths. Thanksgiving was two weeks ago and numbers seems to still be stable. Numbers for today have not been released yet. Went to the movies Friday with no restrictions and felt very uncomfortable the whole time so I guess it will take some getting used to.
 

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