Nancy Pelosi Announces Impeachment Inquiry

caseyedwards

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I keep wishing that with more of this current corruption coming out now, people will realize that trump really did "collude" with Russia and Barr covered it up.

And how everybody is flipping out about Graham saying he wouldn't look at the evidence - either (1) he doesn't have to because he's known perfectly well what trump did all along, or (2) of course he is going to read it all, but he has to "play" dumb so he can plead ignorance. How many people in the last three years have said something to the effect of "I didn't read it" or "I don't know anything about it"?
The problem with collusion which is proven by trump tower meeting with veselnitskaia is that it was entirely over legalized! When mueller moved the goalposts to conspiracy and other violations of “US Code” people wanting to focus on collusion were going down a bad path! It’s almost like all those analysts saying “not collusion but conspiracy” destroyed the whole thing and didn’t help it
 

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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53,676
This is one of those things that would be funny but...

Lindsay Graham is now speculating that Gordon Sondland (who donated $1M to Trumps inauguration) is in cahoots with Democrats
(quoted in the Guardian)
 

caseyedwards

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13,041
Lots of people who gave money and time to trump are now anti trump. Usually that’s the way it works if you worked for trump
Scaramucci
Omorosa
Cohn
Tillerson
Mattis
Caputo
So many I have forgot a bunch of names
 

canbelto

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2,250
Oh god.

 

Vagabond

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The Trump Impeachment Inquiry: Latest Updates
Jennifer Williams, a national security aide to Vice President Mike Pence, appeared on Capitol Hill as planned on Thursday for a closed-door deposition in the House impeachment inquiry. Ms. Williams, a longtime State Department employee with expertise in Europe and Russia who is detailed to Mr. Pence’s national security staff, was among the officials listening to the July 25 call between President Trump and President Volodymyr Zelensky of Ukraine.

Impeachment investigators will press Ms. Williams about what she thought about the July 25 call, as well as details about how much Mr. Pence knew about it and the extent of his understanding about the president’s attempts to pressure Ukraine to commit to investigations of his political rivals.
I wonder what will happen if her testimony turns out to be damning for Pence.

:watch:
 

Sparks

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Breaking via WaPo: John Bolton is willing to defy the White House and testify in the House impeachment inquiry about his alarm at the Ukraine pressure campaign if a federal court clears the way, according to people familiar with his views.
 

mag

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11,047
Oh god.

I know that fact checking every tweet is difficult, but it seems to me, there should be some basic fact checking for elected officials or accounts with over a certain number of followers. The tweets should not be deleted, but an overlay stating that the tweet is a lie should be put on. This tweet is an out and out lie. There is no other way to describe it.
 

Simone411

Well, Bleffing Cofefe! Clippy's flipping over P/C!
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15,977
Just saw this on my MSN homepage.

President Trump Ordered To Pay 2 Million Dollars to Group Of Nonprofits AS Part Of Civil Lawsuit

The foundation has already agreed to cease operations and must pay the $2 million to a consortium of nonprofit organizations.

The $2 million must be paid by President Trump himself for breaching his fiduciary duty to properly oversee the foundation that bears his name.

"I direct Mr. Trump to pay the $2,000,000, which would have gone to the Foundation if it were still in existence, on a pro rata basis to the Approved Recipients," the judge wrote.
I look for another tweet from Tribble about it being "Fake News".
 

Prancer

Needs More Sleep
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I know that fact checking every tweet is difficult, but it seems to me, there should be some basic fact checking for elected officials or accounts with over a certain number of followers. The tweets should not be deleted, but an overlay stating that the tweet is a lie should be put on. This tweet is an out and out lie. There is no other way to describe it.
What part of it is a lie?

And who gets to decide for us all what is a lie and what is truth? Twitter?
 

mag

Well-Known Member
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11,047
What part of it is a lie?

And who gets to decide for us all what is a lie and what is truth? Twitter?
The part where he says he gets no lawyer and no due process. He absolutely gets both and his lawyer is allowed to cross examine witnesses. It is all spelled out in the resolution passed by the house.

There are some things that are facts.
 

Sparks

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It's basic Trumpism. If you can't argue with facts and evidence, criticize the process...with bullshit.
 

caseyedwards

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The part where he says he gets no lawyer and no due process. He absolutely gets both and his lawyer is allowed to cross examine witnesses. It is all spelled out in the resolution passed by the house.

There are some things that are facts.
The resolution says this


Only the chair and ranking minority member, or a Perma-
nent Select Committee employee if yielded to by the chair or ranking minority member, may question witnesses during such periods of questioning.

No rights for trump

 

mag

Well-Known Member
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11,047
The resolution says this


Only the chair and ranking minority member, or a Perma-
nent Select Committee employee if yielded to by the chair or ranking minority member, may question witnesses during such periods of questioning.

No rights for trump

Did you read the resolution? The ranking Republican is allowed to submit requests to call witnesses. Unfortunately it need to be approved by the Chair, but that is only because the Republicans have proven themselves to be less than literate when it comes to the law. The democrats can’t have them calling the Whistleblower for example. If Schiff ends up declining to call important witnesses we can discuss that when it happens. As of now, they can certainly call people.
 

Sparks

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House impeachment hearings serve like a Grand Jury.
Trump can have lawyers and all his representatives in the Senate trial.
Why is this so hard for people to understand?
 

Reuven

Official FSU Alte Kacher
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15,471
Oh god.

These hearings are not a trial, and as for the claim Turdflinger makes that he "gets no lawyer," here's a bit of news for him-he does, under conditions that he co-operates with the committees:

"The Judiciary procedures that [Rules Committee Chair] McGovern submitted allow Trump and his counsel to attend all panel proceedings and ask questions. They can also request additional evidence or witness testimony, but the “committee shall determine whether the suggested evidence is necessary or desirable.”

While those due process rights generally align with ones afforded in the previous two presidential impeachments, they provide a big caveat.

Judiciary Chairman Jerrold Nadler has “the discretion” to deny the president and his counsel the ability to call or question witnesses or otherwise “impose appropriate remedies” if the administration refuses to make witnesses available for testimony or fails to produce documents to any House investigating committee. [bold mine]

That provision applies to Trump’s stonewalling of any ongoing probes in the Intelligence, Oversight, Foreign Affairs, Judiciary, Financial Services and Ways and Means committees."
Well done, Dems! Brilliant!

 

Prancer

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House impeachment hearings serve like a Grand Jury.
Trump can have lawyers and all his representatives in the Senate trial.
Why is this so hard for people to understand?
I don't think it's hard to understand at all.

But what Trump said was "It was just explained to me that for next weeks Fake Hearing (trial) in the House," which has nothing at all to do with the Senate trial. He is referring specifically to the hearings in the House.

And he said "I get NO LAWYER."

The ranking Republican is not his lawyer, regardless of who is called or not.

Hiw lawyer is allowed to attend and ask questions, maybe, but that's not quite the same as having full representation.

So if you put a sticker on this one with facts overlaying the tweet, IMO what you are going to get is a more nuanced version of what he said.

Trump tells a lot of lies, if by lies you mean untruths, but he is also not very smart and does not grasp details.

He isn't being denied due process because this IS the due process, but again--he's not very smart and does not grasp details.
 

caseyedwards

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13,041
House impeachment hearings serve like a Grand Jury.
Trump can have lawyers and all his representatives in the Senate trial.
Why is this so hard for people to understand?
It’s hard to understand because unlike grand jury impeachment vote is public and people have the right to know everything at the house stage because their representatives are voting to put the president on trial. The people in the house unlike a grand juror face consequences and therefore there should be full defense at this stage too
 

caseyedwards

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13,041
Here is evidence in impeachment inquiry stage david Kendall was allowed to question Starr by republican chairman Hyde

THE IMPEACHMENT HEARINGS Clinton Lawyer David Kendall Questions Starr More Transcripts From the Hearings By Federal News Service Thursday, November 19, 1998 REP. HYDE: The committee will come to order. (Sounds gavel.) The chair now recognizes the president's counsel, Mr. Kendall, to examine the witness for 30 minutes, should he choose to do so. Mr. Kendall?


so based on precendent all trumps lawyers should be asking questions next week
 

Simone411

Well, Bleffing Cofefe! Clippy's flipping over P/C!
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15,977
What???? But, but, Trump is a GENIUS! He said so himself and his press secretary confirmed! :drama:
Well, Bleffing Covfefe! He hugely and bigley smockingly is! when it comes to "Sleepy Joe Bidan"! Why his spellinglingling is exemploroatarily exemplorororoly spotted on!
 

ballettmaus

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12,700
WaPo is reporting that Republicans are now moving on to the "Trump had nothing to do with Ukraine" defense. https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/house-gop-looks-to-protect-trump-by-raising-doubts-about-motives-of-his-deputies/2019/11/07/aaa14efa-0173-11ea-8bab-0fc209e065a8_story.html

House Republicans’ latest plan to shield President Trump from impeachment is to focus on at least three deputies — U.S. Ambassador to the European Union Gordon Sondland, Trump’s lawyer Rudolph W. Giuliani, and possibly acting White House chief of staff Mick Mulvaney — who they say could have acted on their own to influence Ukraine policy.
 

mag

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11,047
It will be interesting to see how Trump takes this. If a few dems can spin this on twitter as Trump being too stupid to have masterminded this, he might be tempted to tell the world he did it.
 

ballettmaus

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12,700
It will be interesting to see how Trump takes this. If a few dems can spin this on twitter as Trump being too stupid to have masterminded this, he might be tempted to tell the world he did it.
Graham is already doing that. :shuffle:
 

mag

Well-Known Member
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11,047
Graham is already doing that. :shuffle:
Except Graham is saying the whole administration is incompetent. To get Trump, they need to say that he is too stupid and so it must have been Mulvaney or someone else as the mastermind. That would totally pi$$ Trump off.
 

Susan1

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5,547
Except Graham is saying the whole administration is incompetent. To get Trump, they need to say that he is too stupid and so it must have been Mulvaney or someone else as the mastermind. That would totally pi$$ Trump off.
Funny - either admit to being a moron or a criminal. Decisions, decisions. :)
 
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