Anti-Semitism, anti-Zionism and anti-Christian incidents, reports, etc.

Vagabond

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Academic quits C of E body over chief rabbi's Labour antisemitism comments
Gus John, a respected author and academic, said: “As a matter of principle, I cannot continue to work with the Anglican church … after the archbishop of Canterbury’s disgraceful endorsement of the chief rabbi’s unjust condemnation of Jeremy Corbyn and the entire Labour party.”

Justin Welby backed the chief rabbi’s unprecedented intervention, which in effect called on British Jews not to vote Labour in next week’s election, because the way the party leadership had dealt with allegations of antisemitism was “incompatible with the British values of which we are so proud – of dignity and respect for all people”.
:wall:

John recently resigned from the Church of England's committee for minority ethnic Anglican concerns, saying:
“those who occupy houses clad with stained glass should perhaps be a trifle more careful when they join others in throwing stones”
:shuffle:
 
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BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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56,142
I was not online much yesterday and only heard about this shooting, thinking it was just crime related. :eek:

Jersey City Shooting: Suspect Published Anti-Semitic Posts, Official Says (NY Times)


A suspect involved in a prolonged firefight in Jersey City, N.J., that left six people dead, including one police officer, had published anti-Semitic and anti-police posts online and investigators believe the attack was motivated by those sentiments, a law enforcement official familiar with the case said on Wednesday.

Investigators also found a manifesto-style note inside the shooters’ van, the law enforcement official and another official familiar with the case said.

The document, which was described as brief and “rambling,” suggested no clear motive for the shooting. Investigators also found a live pipe bomb inside the vehicle, the law enforcement official said.

The Jersey City mayor, Steven Fulop, also said Wednesday that surveillance footage indicated the two shooters had targeted a kosher supermarket where most of the carnage unfolded.
 

Debbie S

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NYT is now reporting that the suspects are part of the Black Hebrew Israelites group. They are classified as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. I heard more about them in the 80s and early 90s....a few articles I found on Google said their membership (and that of the Nation of Islam) has increased in recent years. In terms of the political scale, they are on the left, not the right.

 

BlueRidge

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NYT is now reporting that the suspects are part of the Black Hebrew Israelites group. They are classified as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center. I heard more about them in the 80s and early 90s....a few articles I found on Google said their membership (and that of the Nation of Islam) has increased in recent years. In terms of the political scale, they are on the left, not the right.

Only if you think people who are virulently misogynist and homophobic are on the left.

Anti-semitism is hate, I think the tallying of left and right does not help fight it but in this case the idea that this group is on the left is laughable. And it makes me damn angry because I've confronted these hatemongers in person for their expressions of utter hate for lesbians and gays.

We discussed these hideous people at the time of the confrontation with the Covington Ohio students. They are hatemongers and are not in anyway associated with any political grouping.
 

Debbie S

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12,171
We discussed these hideous people at the time of the confrontation with the Covington Ohio students. They are hatemongers and are not in anyway associated with any political grouping.
OK, fine, that's fair. My point is that they aren't neo-Nazis/alt-righters. I wouldn't classify the Nation of Islam as right-wing, either. I remember in college, there were some black students who expressed views aligned with NOI and the Black Hebrews (not misogyny or homophobia but the idea that they were the true Jews) and they were all on the left end of the spectrum.

I agree that anti-Semitism comes from all points on the political spectrum. But I've seen comments here that we should only be concerned about the right, and that's not the case.
 

PRlady

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34,974
They are neither left nor right but a cult, one that hates Jews and a lot of other groups. They hang out near the Gallery Place Metro here in DC and yell nasty things about at least ten different groups, including actual Jews and Christians.

There IS a lot of growing antisemitism towards the ultra-Orthodox, lots of assaults in Brooklyn. They’re obviously visibly Jewish in a way that Debbie and I are not, and that’s getting more dangerous. :(
 

PRlady

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Sorry for double post but people should pay attention to Trump’s executive order making Jewish students a protected group under Title VI of civil rights law. It’s complicated and controversial.
 

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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56,142
OK, fine, that's fair. My point is that they aren't neo-Nazis/alt-righters. I wouldn't classify the Nation of Islam as right-wing, either. I remember in college, there were some black students who expressed views aligned with NOI and the Black Hebrews (not misogyny or homophobia but the idea that they were the true Jews) and they were all on the left end of the spectrum.

I agree that anti-Semitism comes from all points on the political spectrum. But I've seen comments here that we should only be concerned about the right, and that's not the case.
Thank you. Yes I agree they are not rightwing either and I certainly do agree anti-semitism is on both left and right, and possibly in this case (we do need to learn more about this person's associations) neither. Ditto political violence.

Whether NOI is left or not (and ideologically it is not) the problem has been that some on the left work with them (such as the leader of the Women's March group). For the Black Hebrew Israelites this is not the case. They are totally outside any grouping and have offensive views on pretty much everything.
 

BlueRidge

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Sorry for double post but people should pay attention to Trump’s executive order making Jewish students a protected group under Title VI of civil rights law. It’s complicated and controversial.
Posted about in the Dangers of Trump thread.
 

Vagabond

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15,918
I confess that I do not enter this thread often and do not read every post here, but I hope that I can vent here about a personal experience I had last night.

I went to a holiday party that was held in a restaurant lounge yesterday evening. Afterwards, eight of us wandered over to a nearby gelato shop. We were from at least four different countries, four men, four women. Three of us (two men and a woman) are Jewish. As I was talking with someone, I discovered that everyone else was for some reason the discussion had turned to circumcision. After it was established that the two of us Jewish guys were in fact Jewish and had been circumcised, one of the other men made a remark that he did not see any reason for circumcising men. He did not immediately realize how insulting that remark was to me, my parents, and to all Jews, but eventually did apologize and later told a friend of mine that he felt "really bad" about what he had said.

That remark cast a pall on the entire evening for me, and this morning, I still feel angry and hurt.

I can only imagine what it's like for people who have to deal with that sort of thoughtless remark on a constant basis.

Thank you @Spun Silver for opening this thread.
[/RANT]
 

Vagabond

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15,918
'Contemptible': outrage as Rudy Giuliani attacks George Soros as 'hardly a Jew'

Jewish groups intensified criticism on Tuesday of Rudy Giuliani, the former New York mayor turned president’s lawyer and freelancing Ukrainian envoy, after he attacked Jewish financier, philanthropist and Holocaust survivor George Soros for being “hardly a Jew” and failing to attend synagogue.

Giuliani also asserted he was “more of a Jew than Soros” and repeated a claim that the former US ambassador to Ukraine, Marie Yovanovitch, who testified in Donald Trump’s impeachment inquiry, was controlled by the financier.
Giuliani never goes so low that he cannot go even lower.
 

TAHbKA

Cats and garlic lover
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After it was established that the two of us Jewish guys were in fact Jewish and had been circumcised, one of the other men made a remark that he did not see any reason for circumcising men. He did not immediately realize how insulting that remark was to me, my parents, and to all Jews
Gee, all Jews.
I don't see any reason for circumcising men. I am not insulted. Duh
 

AxelAnnie

Graceful men lift lovely girls in white!
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Gee, all Jews.
I don't see any reason for circumcising men. I am not insulted. Duh
Well, let's try G-d said. Or how about it is tradition, ann.d a deeply rooted part of the covenant and being an Jew.

BTW - not All Jews - just the me
 

Japanfan

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Well, let's try G-d said. Or how about it is tradition, ann.d a deeply rooted part of the covenant and being an Jew.

BTW - not All Jews - just the me
Anyone remember Shirley Jackson's provocative short story 'The Lottery'?

It asks the question as to whether tradition should be observed simply because it is tradition, or whether tradition should be questioned.

IMO, it should be questioned, always. Though personally I have no strongly feelings about circumcision, which millions of men have survived just fine, over a long period of time. If men who have been circumcised find it to be an issue, then they are free to oppose the circumcision of their sons.
 
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caseyedwards

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Terrible. Reminds me of the security men that now line the main route to one local town’s synagogue. Just men in suits with earpieces. Never saw that before
 

BlueRidge

AYS's snark-sponge
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I'm really rattled by this. The New Jersey attack, and then several instances were reported in NY City before the stabbing attack.

According to this article the perpetrator of the stabbing attack

The man accused of stabbing multiple people celebrating Hanukkah at a rabbi’s home in New York has “a long history of mental illness and hospitalizations,” according to a family statement issued by his lawyer.

“He has no known history of anti-Semitism and was raised in a home which embraced and respected all religions and races. He is not a member of any hate groups,” attorney Michael Sussman said in the statement emailed Sunday evening to the Mid Hudson News.
This wasn't a random attack, it followed the others. There is hostility towards Jewish people, particular Orthodox and Hasidic in these communities, even if the attacks are by random disturbed individuals. We know that there are hate groups in some of these black communities like the Black Hebrew Israelites, antisemitic messages are circulating. This is very dangerous, clearly.

Hanukkah stabbing suspect has ‘history of mental illness’ and no ties to hate groups, family says (Washington Post)
 

Debbie S

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Hanukkah stabbing suspect searched ‘why did Hitler hate the Jews,’ prosecutors say

The discoveries detailed by an FBI agent would bring Grafton to court Monday on federal hate-crime charges, a day after he was charged with attempted murder for the stabbing that wounded five people at a rabbi’s home in New York. The 38-year-old defendant answered routine questions, telling a judge he was “coherent,” before shuffling away slowly, feet shackled, to be held without bail.
No mention yet of ties to the Black Hebrews.
 

skategal

Bunny mama
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6,692
So I just saw this on Twitter and unfortunately it's not a one-off: https://twitter.com/WW2HistoryGal/status/1222014740869844992?s=20

On the day that Trump is releasing his bogus "peace" plan -- designed to appeal to evangelicals and Israeli settlers -- and again trumpeting his love for the Jews :rolleyes: it's useful to remember that although he has no theology about all this, a lot of his supporters do.
Evangelicals believe that the only one who can bring peace to the Middle East is the anti-Christ. :shuffle:
 

allezfred

#EpidemiologistsNotEconomists
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I guess this belongs in this thread: https://twitter.com/lisanandy/status/1228228363568865281?s=21

Who is this British Labour lady? And where is that accent from? And the fact that women in that thread are slagging her for signing the trans-self-identity thing really upsets me although I see the problems with it.
One of the four candidates to replace Jeremy Corbyn as Labour leader. It’s a Manchester accent.

Coming from a neighbouring country that has had self id since 2015 without any issues or controversy, the “debate” in the U.K. about what rights transgender people
should have is :scream:
 

VGThuy

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32,152
One of the four candidates to replace Jeremy Corbyn as Labour leader. It’s a Manchester accent.

Coming from a neighbouring country that has had self id since 2015 without any issues or controversy, the “debate” in the U.K. about what rights transgender people
should have is :scream:
After JK Rowling's tweets about it, I've read a few articles about how the UK is actually behind the U.S. regarding trans issues (at least when it comes to an increasing number of individual states adopting non-discrimination legislation to include gender expression/identity, allowing amendments to birth certificates, IDs that allow trans folks to identify the their gender, AND also changing their name change/gender change procedures to not force surgery), but I don't know if I should believe those pieces. What do you think?
 

antmanb

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After JK Rowling's tweets about it, I've read a few articles about how the UK is actually behind the U.S. regarding trans issues (at least when it comes to an increasing number of individual states adopting non-discrimination legislation to include gender expression/identity, allowing amendments to birth certificates, IDs that allow trans folks to identify the their gender, AND also changing their name change/gender change procedures to not force surgery), but I don't know if I should believe those pieces. What do you think?
I don't know the position in the US so I can't really comment on whether we're behind or ahead of the US on any of the things you mention, but looking at each of the things in the list I can comment on the UK position.

In respect of non-discrimination legislation I'm fairly sure that there was a lot of case law in the 1990s that successfully argued that discrimination based on someone's trans status was discrimination on the grounds of sex (under legislation passed in the mid 1970s) it resulted in amendment to the sex discrimination legislation at the very end of the 90s (I remember because in my 2nd year of uni I took "gender and law" in my final semester and we looked at the proposed changes). All of the discrimination legislation and resulting case law was brought up to date in the Equality Act 2010 which specifically includes gender reassignment as a protected category, as well as discrimination on the grounds of gender and sexual orientation (and this includes perceived gender and sexual orientation).

In terms of allowing amendments to birth certificates, the Gender Recognition Act 2004 put into place the law that allowed transgender people to obtain a new birth certificate in their "new" gender. This was in response to the UK losing its case in the European Court of Human Rights. Basically a transgender person must go before a panel and argue the case . They usually have to have been living in their "new" gender for two years and it isn't a requirement to have undergone gender reassignment surgery. I think there has been some debate about problematic language in the 2004 legislation and a discussion about whether 2 years is too long so there is some debate about updating this law soon.

The ID issue is not as important in the UK as we don't have ID cards, we have passports (which can be changed with a new birth certificate issued under the Gender Recognition Act), and drivers licenses don't show gender on them so as long as you change your name legally (which has always been possible) and that you look like the picture in your drivers licence (which you can update whenever you like) you're generally covered.
 

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