2020 OG Gymnastics Thread: The Takedown In Tokyo

Theatregirl1122

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If there's one thing figure skating does not have enough of it's funky chicken choreography

You know, this I totally agree with.

I didn't get to see Melnikova asking Simone if she was okay on the original broadcast. That was very sweet. I wish NBC had taken the trouble to mention it (and the girls congratulating each other in general). They've refrained from their "evil Russia" gymnastics coverage this year, but it still would have been nice to have that highlighted a bit.

But the athletes have always had a lot more class and sportsmanship than NBC.
 

overedge

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I mean, it's not like they learned it after Gracie Gold. Although this is bigger.

That was the same precedent I was thinking of :(

It's also a very risky strategy to build event coverage around one or a few people. There's any number of reasons why an athlete might not even make it to a competition (e.g. unexpected injury). If that happens to the person who's been chosen as the star of the coverage, then most if not all of the promotion and hype around the coverage has been wasted.

In my ideal world, the coverage would celebrate all of the athletes and the hard work that all of them did to qualify for the competition. The athletes who don't get endorsements, whose parents are working multiple jobs to pay for their training, etc. etc. are IMO just as compelling stories as the athletes who are the superstars.
 
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Theatregirl1122

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25,206
Honestly, Linstinova's funky chicken would make brillant choreography for an OES (or an OEG?). Russia just isn't obscure enough. I think I will pretend that she is from Turkmenistan when I watch it and I think that will ascend it to the highest level. That and maybe a much weirder leo.
 

dramagrrl

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Imagine Kerri Strug not jumping the second vault but saying - no - I am injured and don't want to risk a life-time of problems with a second vault? I would have loved her for it and it would absolutely have been the right thing to do. I still despise Bela for urging her on.
The sad thing about the Strug situation that most casual fans don't know is that if anyone on Team U.S.A. had actually been doing the math, Kerri didn't need to do her second vault at all. Even with Moceanu's two vault falls, U.S.A. had already mathematically clinched the gold medal. Making Kerri vault on her injured leg, risking sustained injury, was totally unnecessary and just created a fabricated TV drama moment when it wasn't actually heroic or even needed.
 

ballettmaus

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Losing orientation mid-air sounds freaking scary!

There's also the thing in skating where skaters "lose" a jump that they'd already learned. Usually it's temporary, but weird. Maybe these are all similar kinds of psychological hiccups.
I remember reading something years ago about how jumps are muscle memory for skaters (and I'm assuming for gymnasts as well) and when you start thinking about the elements, you disrupt the muscle memory process and that's when you make mistakes. Maybe that has something to do with that.
 

Rob

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The past success of the US team came with great physical and mental costs to the athletes. Nothing wrong with a silver medal obtained through (what I hope are) far kinder and more rewarding training.
yes, lots of positives. No one was glaring at Simone or ignoring her or telling her to suck it up and do it. No one got injured. No one looked miserable or was crying. A little shell shocked at first but then smiling, dancing, cheering, laughing. Rival teams were high fiving each other during the competition and congratulating and showing concern after the end. Sportsmanship on display. If they weren’t so young and calorie restricted, id think they were all going out for pizza and beer after.

another positive is that Russia floor routines of Listunova and Melnikova - first half looks like they want to join the Bolshoi ballet and the second half looks like they want to compete in NCAAs, lol.

On the negative note, I miss gymnastics where they had to stick the Landing and where is wasn’t so difficult up on the apparatus that they can still win gold with 2 falls or get silver with a fall and a failed vault. I guess that started with Paul Hamm. I’d like it to be beautiful and precise and not so super human.
 

Matryeshka

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I honestly didn’t watch much of 1984. A part of me still can’t wrap my head around an Olympics including gymnastics without the Soviets.
:drama: That's one of my mom's chestnut stories about me that she likes to drag out at--I was four and my mom had bought me a USA bathing suit. While Mary Lou was doing her thing, I (allegedly) ran to my room, put my swimsuit over my head and announced I was going to get a go-medal and did a running dive at my mom's antique rocking horse, which I just crashed into. For a month after that, they couldn't stop my from climbing on every surface, and if said surface was filled, I just threw the stuff off and blamed the cat. I wanted to wear my swimsuit to kindercare (pre-K/nursery school) and pitched an epic fit when my mom forced me into real clothes. As soon as I got home, I put it on and insisted my mom call me Mary Lou. My mother put me in gymnastics. I was, unfortunately, AWFUL. Then I decided I wanted to be a squirrel.

As for the gymnastics tonight, if you didn't know anything about anyone and were just watching, you'd have though the US gymnasts were really good. They got a silver for Khorkina's sake. It's not like they were falling over the place. They had a great night and held up really well under the circumstances. Sometimes you do well and you're just outperformed and there's nothing you can do and nothing to be ashamed about.

I also love the camaraderie--loved the US team going up and hugging and congratulating the Russians. That was a great sight to see, very Olympian.
 

her grace

standing with Mariah
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Um I've never known what it meant to be "Minnesota nice." The people I've met from Minnesota weren't particularly nice. They weren't bad people but they weren't super nice either.
Minnesota nice means they’ll help you out in the winter when you’re stranded on the side of the road with car trouble—not that they’re outwardly friendly.

but Grace seems to have a sunny disposition, too. :)
 

Karina1974

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I post on the City Data forum, and a lot of their members tend to lean to the right. They had a field day with Osaka when she was talking about her mental issues. I'm almost afraid to go over there to see if they are commenting on this.
Annnndddd... I was so right about this. Some idiot was actually comparing Simone to Strug in 1996. Right.... huge difference between and 1-1/2 and a 2-1/2!! And Strug's difficulty overall was nowhere close.
 

Allskate

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The sad thing about the Strug situation that most casual fans don't know is that if anyone on Team U.S.A. had actually been doing the math, Kerri didn't need to do her second vault at all. Even with Moceanu's two vault falls, U.S.A. had already mathematically clinched the gold medal. Making Kerri vault on her injured leg, risking sustained injury, was totally unnecessary and just created a fabricated TV drama moment when it wasn't actually heroic or even needed.

The narrative the media was promoting was that Strug was the hero who saved the day. Facts and numbers would not have fit in with that narrative. Strug seemed fine with it, but it always bothered me the way they were going out of their way to promote and glorify the vault on an injured leg.

I think what not enough people are thinking about with Simone is not just how low her other scores could have been if she had continued, but what kind of very dangerous injury she would be risking if she was that discombobulated. I do give Nastia credit for pointing that out.
 

ErikWilliam

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On the negative note, I miss gymnastics where they had to stick the Landing and where is wasn’t so difficult up on the apparatus that they can still win gold with 2 falls or get silver with a fall and a failed vault. I guess that started with Paul Hamm. I’d like it to be beautiful and precise and not so super human.
This bothers me too. Leading up to the Games this past year, we'd see Simone bounce out/fall out and the commentators are "She's AMAZING!!!!" time after time. To me, as a skate fan, it would be like Trusova's World LP and all the commentators are saying is "WOW!! NO one in the world does what she does!" and totally ignores all her messy landings. IOW, yes, I'd like to see "stuck" dismounts too.
 

Theatregirl1122

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25,206
The sad thing about the Strug situation that most casual fans don't know is that if anyone on Team U.S.A. had actually been doing the math, Kerri didn't need to do her second vault at all. Even with Moceanu's two vault falls, U.S.A. had already mathematically clinched the gold medal. Making Kerri vault on her injured leg, risking sustained injury, was totally unnecessary and just created a fabricated TV drama moment when it wasn't actually heroic or even needed.

Do people assume that no one on team USA was doing the math? I had always assumed that Bella knew full well they didn't need that vault and he made her do it anyways for the drama and the cameras.

One of my friends texted me. She was like, "I keep seeing fools being like 'Kerri Strug is rolling over in her grave' and I'm like 'Kerri Strug is 43.'" :rolleyes: Apparently when you retire from gymnastics, you just die now.
 

VGThuy

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:drama: That's one of my mom's chestnut stories about me that she likes to drag out at--I was four and my mom had bought me a USA bathing suit. While Mary Lou was doing her thing, I (allegedly) ran to my room, put my swimsuit over my head and announced I was going to get a go-medal and did a running dive at my mom's antique rocking horse, which I just crashed into. For a month after that, they couldn't stop my from climbing on every surface, and if said surface was filled, I just threw the stuff off and blamed the cat. I wanted to wear my swimsuit to kindercare (pre-K/nursery school) and pitched an epic fit when my mom forced me into real clothes. As soon as I got home, I put it on and insisted my mom call me Mary Lou. My mother put me in gymnastics. I was, unfortunately, AWFUL. Then I decided I wanted to be a squirrel.

As for the gymnastics tonight, if you didn't know anything about anyone and were just watching, you'd have though the US gymnasts were really good. They got a silver for Khorkina's sake. It's not like they were falling over the place. They had a great night and held up really well under the circumstances. Sometimes you do well and you're just outperformed and there's nothing you can do and nothing to be ashamed about.

I also love the camaraderie--loved the US team going up and hugging and congratulating the Russians. That was a great sight to see, very Olympian.
One thing I will always give Mary Lou credit for was that she really inspired whole generations of girls to go into gymnastics. The 1996 team and after were really borne out of the American-centric gymnastics craze Mary Lou (and Bela) created in 1984.
 

skatfan

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This bothers me too. Leading up to the Games this past year, we'd see Simone bounce out/fall out and the commentators are "She's AMAZING!!!!" time after time. To me, as a skate fan, it would be like Trusova's World LP and all the commentators are saying is "WOW!! NO one in the world does what she does!" and totally ignores all her messy landings. IOW, yes, I'd like to see "stuck" dismounts too.
We have a whole program of the stick landings in the US - the NCAA. They also seem to have a lot of fun and interesting choreography!
 

overedge

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The sad thing about the Strug situation that most casual fans don't know is that if anyone on Team U.S.A. had actually been doing the math, Kerri didn't need to do her second vault at all. Even with Moceanu's two vault falls, U.S.A. had already mathematically clinched the gold medal. Making Kerri vault on her injured leg, risking sustained injury, was totally unnecessary and just created a fabricated TV drama moment when it wasn't actually heroic or even needed.

All day on Twitter, couch potato sports fans - almost all of them men - have been posting that picture of Strug being helped off the vault platform, with comments like "this is what a brave athlete looks like, not a quitter" etc. etc. And others have been responding, er, um, one of the coaches holding her up is an abuser, and the person helping her down the stairs is Larry freakin' Nassar :eek:
 

Taso

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I appreciate very much Boginskaya's genuine empathy for Simone. I've been thinking all day that in the past athletes have said there have been injuries and withdrawn when something more psychological - but ultimately putting one at greater risk of major injury like Boginskaya said - has gone on. I like the honesty. Screw the people who can't handle reality and hide behind their social media flatforms and tv shows and judge others
 

AxelAnnie

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Annnndddd... I was so right about this. Some idiot was actually comparing Simone to Strug in 1996. Right.... huge difference between and 1-1/2 and a 2-1/2!! And Strug's difficulty overall was nowhere close.
It was a different time and very different circumstances.
 

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