Royalty Thread #11: Putting the "Fun" in Dysfunctional

[Coco]

Um...impact of a white person feeling they don't measure up to white beauty standards is totally different than how a non-white person would experience not living up to white beauty standards.

 

[MsZem]

The Brooch
I just looked this up. What the Fcuk!! What kind of moron wears something like that?

Princess Michael of Kent is... problematic.

 

[MLIS]

What the BRF can learn from Sweden's royal family:

What can the British royals learn from Sweden's royal family?

As the British royal family meets for crisis talks over the futures of Prince Harry and his wife Meghan, are there any lessons they could learn from their Swedish counterparts?

www.thelocal.se

I get the sense that Harry would love to be like Princess Madeleine and live a quiet(ish) life doing his own thing, working on social issues and occasionally popping over for the obligatory royal appearance. Meghan seems more comfortable being in the public eye than he does, though being a target of the British tabloids isn't fun for anyone.

I agree. I think if it was up to Harry this is exactly what he would do, or maybe return to serving in the military. I think it is Meghan who is interested in the celebrity lifestyle and money-making opportunities (that's not a criticism, lots of people want to be celebrities, just my read of the situation).

 

[MsZem]

Um...impact of a white person feeling they don't measure up to white beauty standards is totally different than how a non-white person would experience not living up to white beauty standards.

This is true and Prlady noted that the issue is intersectional.

Beauty standards - which are often achievable by only a small percentage of the population - can have very real implications across the board, with one obvious example being eating disorders. It's important to keep this in mind while also recognizing the additional impact on POC (e.g. "good hair").

 

[Judy]

Of course they are. Not by law but in practice, just as in the U.S. People of color, immigrants, the poor live in different neighborhoods and have less access to private/magnet/charter options than those who are white and wealthy.

i worked in a boarding/day school in Ottawa (the only one). I can tell you that a lot of the day parents were multicultural so don’t make that assumption. Charters I don’t know if that is big in Canada. Private is def expensive ... my family which was middle class would never have thought of it. Schools in Ottawa and Toronto ... I am assuming Toronto .. tend to integrate social housing amongst neighbourhoods so there is most def a mix. Some more than others. I really can’t speak to Toronto as I don’t live there. However, the public school system is very good in Canada because it is regulated.

 

[Judy]

Princess Michael of Kent is... problematic.

Well she is a piece of work. I’ve never heard of her though .

 

[MsZem]

Well she is a piece of work. I’ve never heard of her though .

Prince Michael is 48th in line to the throne, so that might explain it.

At birth he was 7th. Like Archie I'm sure Archie will turn out better, though.

 

[Judy]

Prince Michael is 48th in line to the throne, so that might explain it.

At birth he was 7th. Like Archie I'm sure Archie will turn out better, though.

I have no doubt lol. Reminds me of my crazy aunt ... not the racism part but she used to insult us . You cannot buy class.

 

[overedge]

There's been plenty of reports that Camilla was not in favor of Kate because her background wasn't upper-crust enough. What do you think she felt about Meghan? The offensive brooch thing makes it clear that Camilla isn't the only family member with that attitude.

And that's extra hilarious given that Camilla's family had a reputation among the upper classes mostly for drinking, adultery, and partying (per Tom Bower's recent book about Charles). And that allegedly at one point Camilla's first husband was going around boasting to his friends that the Prince of Wales was f***ing his wife. She's not really in a position to be calling other people's families "common".

 

[overedge]

Of course they are. Not by law but in practice, just as in the U.S. People of color, immigrants, the poor live in different neighborhoods and have less access to private/magnet/charter options than those who are white and wealthy.

And don't forget the schools in First Nations communities, which are horribly under-funded and poorly supplied.

 

[MsZem]

And that's extra hilarious given that Camilla's family had a reputation among the upper classes mostly for drinking, adultery, and partying (per Tom Bower's recent book about Charles). And that allegedly at one point Camilla's first husband was going around boasting to his friends that the Prince of Wales was f***ing his wife. She's not really in a position to be calling other people's families "common".

Andrew Parker Bowles was one of the inspirations for Rupert Campbell-Black in Jilly Cooper's books, which is, well, interesting.

 

[AxelAnnie]

Princess Michael of Kent is... problematic.

Oh that made me laugh....and I needed a laugh!
She is off the wall nutso!

 

[Judy]

I knew the nurse that worked in my school. She was born in New Zealand but married ... hmm not a diplomat but can’t quite remember. But she worked around the world and treated Diana’s mother and knew Diana and siblings. She said Diana’s mom liked to drink and cuss. loved it.

 

[mag]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988

It doesn’t surprise me that Trudeau would make a blanket statement ahead of any discussion or decision. I think this is his greatest weakness. He wants to be seen as the good guy and everyone’s friend. While I can agree that getting along with people is a good goal, sometimes those impulses come back to bite him.

ETA: This is also something Harry and Meghan are going to need to own. A reporter, at some point, is likely to ask them about take two million in Canadian taxpayer money for themselves when that money could be better spent helping the homeless, providing hot breakfasts, researching green tech, medical research, etc etc. I hope they give it some thought and have an answer. That won’t be media bullying. It will media holding them accountable.

 

[Judy]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988

It doesn’t surprise me that Trudeau would make a blanket statement ahead of any discussion or decision. I think this is his greatest weakness. He wants to be seen as the good guy and everyone’s friend. While I can agree that getting along with people is a good goal, sometimes those impulses come back to bite him.

Probably but to be fair this has happened quickly so he has to say something. That province - specifically Vancouver - can finance it easily. When I visited Vancouver twice when my sister lived there ... every 2nd car was a BMW. Vancouver is largely asian. the houses there in specific areas are unbelievable. B.C. is breathtaking though.

 

[PRlady]

Um...impact of a white person feeling they don't measure up to white beauty standards is totally different than how a non-white person would experience not living up to white beauty standards.

Which is why I said it's intersectional. Holding non-white people -- or white people who do not come from the Northern European standard of beauty background, which is very specific -- to one standard is more oppressive for non-white people, but it's still a weapon against all women.

 

[mag]

Probably but to be fair this has happened quickly so he has to say something. That province - specifically Vancouver - can finance it easily. When I visited Vancouver twice when my sister lived there ... every 2nd car was a BMW. Vancouver is largely asian. the houses there in specific areas are unbelievable. B.C. is breathtaking though.

That is quite the statement. Vancouver is unlikely to agree to pick up the tab, especially if H&M are living in Saanich. BMW’s can be leased, and for luxury cars are actually one of the more “affordable.” Yes, there is money here, but there is also a lot poverty and working poor.

 

[made_in_canada]

Probably but to be fair this has happened quickly so he has to say something. That province - specifically Vancouver - can finance it easily. When I visited Vancouver twice when my sister lived there ... every 2nd car was a BMW. Vancouver is largely asian. the houses there in specific areas are unbelievable. B.C. is breathtaking though.

So much to at in the above. Yes, Vancouver has places with wealth. It also has places with extreme poverty. And many places with people struggling mightily to live in a place that while beautiful is also crazy expensive. It’s also a city that is not even close to representative of the entire province.

 

[MacMadame]

It doesn’t surprise me that Trudeau would make a blanket statement ahead of any discussion or decision. I think this is his greatest weakness. He wants to be seen as the good guy and everyone’s friend. While I can agree that getting along with people is a good goal, sometimes those impulses come back to bite him.

I think this is a case of people taking one quote and running with it. The original article that that article is supposedly summarizing says this:

Mr Trudeau — still dealing with the fall-out from the downing of a Ukrainian aircraft by the Iranian military which killed 57 Canadians — has privately assured the Queen that Harry, Meghan and Archie’s safety will not be jeopardised while they reside there.

So he didn't say Canada would pay all the costs as the original article said. He didn't even say that Canada would pay part of the costs (as the article linked here said). He said something much vaguer.

 

[overedge]

@Judy I have lived in Vancouver most of my life. I can assure you that not every second car is a BMW. There is a significant Asian population, but there are also large numbers of people from other ethnicities/cultures - the Lower Mainland has one of the largest South Asian populations in Canada. And as others have said, there is also a great deal of poverty and working poor. Vancouver has the poorest urban neighbourhood in all of Canada (the Downtown Eastside).

Where Harry and Meghan were staying over the holidays is in rural Saanich on Vancouver Island, near the BC Ferry terminal in Sidney. This isn't part of Victoria - it's a separate regional government. Part of the population there has money and lives in mansions, near the waterfront, but it's mostly farms and isolated pockets of houses. I very much doubt that the regional government has the money to pay for security if Harry and Meghan decide to live there. And I doubt the provincial government would want to put up with the backlash from the rest of the province if it paid that cost.

 

[Polaris]

@MacMadame As someone who is Asian I can tell you that standards of beauty very much revolve around white standards of beauty. It's considered beautiful to have big eyes, double eyelids, a sharp nose, high cheekbones, and of course white skin. The plastic surgery industry in Asia to get those features is out of control.

This standard, especially the white skin one, has existed in Asian cultures before any Western influence.

Also, Western perceptions of Asian beauty are usually contradictory to Asian perceptions of Asian beauty, so I don't agree with your opening statement.

 

[skategal]

I think this is a case of people taking one quote and running with it. The original article that that article is supposedly summarizing says this:

Mr Trudeau — still dealing with the fall-out from the downing of a Ukrainian aircraft by the Iranian military which killed 57 Canadians — has privately assured the Queen that Harry, Meghan and Archie’s safety will not be jeopardised while they reside there.

So he didn't say Canada would pay all the costs as the original article said. He didn't even say that Canada would pay part of the costs (as the article linked here said). He said something much vaguer.

Yes plus how reliable is the Evening Standard? Clearly it’s relying on an inside source or leak.

The Official position of the Canadian government would be as Morneau has stated.

ETA If the government wants to keep their votes in Quebec they will tread carefully with this issue.

 

[Winnipeg]

Probably but to be fair this has happened quickly so he has to say something. That province - specifically Vancouver - can finance it easily. When I visited Vancouver twice when my sister lived there ... every 2nd car was a BMW. Vancouver is largely asian. the houses there in specific areas are unbelievable. B.C. is breathtaking though.

HUh?? Why would a province want to spend tax dollars on this?

 

[AxelAnnie]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/bill-morneau-security-costs-harry-meghan-1.5424988

It doesn’t surprise me that Trudeau would make a blanket statement ahead of any discussion or decision. I think this is his greatest weakness. He wants to be seen as the good guy and everyone’s friend. While I can agree that getting along with people is a good goal, sometimes those impulses come back to bite him.

ETA: This is also something Harry and Meghan are going to need to own. A reporter, at some point, is likely to ask them about take two million in Canadian taxpayer money for themselves when that money could be better spent helping the homeless, providing hot breakfasts, researching green tech, medical research, etc etc. I hope they give it some thought and have an answer. That won’t be media bullying. It will media holding them accountable.

I predict monster cluster fcuk.

 

[Judy]

@Judy I have lived in Vancouver most of my life. I can assure you that not every second car is a BMW. There is a significant Asian population, but there are also large numbers of people from other ethnicities/cultures - the Lower Mainland has one of the largest South Asian populations in Canada. And as others have said, there is also a great deal of poverty and working poor. Vancouver has the poorest urban neighbourhood in all of Canada (the Downtown Eastside).

Where Harry and Meghan were staying over the holidays is in rural Saanich on Vancouver Island, near the BC Ferry terminal in Sidney. This isn't part of Victoria - it's a separate regional government. Part of the population there has money and lives in mansions, near the waterfront, but it's mostly farms and isolated pockets of houses. I very much doubt that the regional government has the money to pay for security if Harry and Meghan decide to live there. And I doubt the provincial government would want to put up with the backlash from the rest of the province if it paid that cost.

I used Vancouver as an example. Yes I have driven through eastside Vancouver and it is awful. my friend also worked as a social worker there. My sister and her boyfriend (now married 20 years but moved back to Ottawa in 1999) and I visited in Burnaby twice starting in 1997). I can tell you that my personal experience was seeing endless BMW’s and I don’t even pay attention to cars. Anyways, of course taxpayers would fight it. We fight everything! IMO the Queen should reimburse Canada but I have no idea what’s involved. I can promise you though there is poverty in every province and city but Vancouver puts that into the east side. It is very, very sad.

 

[Lorac]

As the Queen says 'there are still complex issues to be sorted out'. The British taxpayer -i.e. me and everyone I have discussed this issue with - isn't going to want to pay for the security of a couple who has decided to step down from their current senior role in BRF whilst living in another country even if they are 6th and 7th in line for the throne at the moment. Depending on how they remain as part of the BRF their security on this side of the pond is open for discussion. However I can see why the Canadian taxpayer would be po'ed if they had to start to pay for their security. This could get interesting.

 

[overedge]

I used Vancouver as an example. Yes I have driven through eastside Vancouver and it is awful. my friend also worked as a social worker there. My sister and her boyfriend (now married 20 years but moved back to Ottawa in 1999) and I visited in Burnaby twice starting in 1997). I can tell you that my personal experience was seeing endless BMW’s and I don’t even pay attention to cars. Anyways, of course taxpayers would fight it. We fight everything! IMO the Queen should reimburse Canada but I have no idea what’s involved. I can promise you though there is poverty in every province and city but Vancouver puts that into the east side. It is very, very sad.

There is poverty all over the Lower Mainland. The Downtown Eastside is the poorest, the oldest poor neighbourhood - it's where the city of Vancouver was founded - and the most visible, but there are working poor and homeless people in every neighbourhood.

 

[Judy]

There is poverty all over the Lower Mainland. The Downtown Eastside is the poorest, the oldest poor neighbourhood - it's where the city of Vancouver was founded - and the most visible, but there are working poor and homeless people in every neighbourhood.

as in every city. But Vancouver is the most expensive city to live in and next is Toronto. That certainly is not meant to imply that every single person is rich. There is poverty in every city in the world.

 

[starrynight]

At the end of the day, the Duke and Duchess of Sussex were in a position of enormous wealth and privilege. People had to line up and curtsey, the golden carriages, the palaces, the staff, the parades, the private jets, the millions of dollars of annual income. Regardless of what anyone might think, once you are in that family, you are a part of the 0.05% - lording it over even the aristocracy and with your name in the history books.

The images of JayZ and Beyonce (self made millionaires) having to just stand and wait in line to talk to Meghan and Harry at a film premiere epitomises this privilege. No way on earth would that have ever happened in any other universe. If it was a world where talent was favoured over bloodline, JayZ and Beyonce wouldn't give two hoots about these people.

So it's hardly a 'Jenny from the Block' situation with Meghan and Harry. I'm not sure how relatable their lives are to the stories of regular working class people.

 

[Jenny]

I don't know why anyone is paying for their security other than Meghan and Harry themselves. All reports seem to put them worth millions on their own, and with big plans to earn their own money, so why would anyone else pay for it unless they are on official business on behalf of that government or country?

Does the Canadian or BC government pay for security for any other private citizens? Because it's quite clear that Harry and Meghan have no official status in Canada, so that puts them in the same boat as you and me. Sure they are famous and therefore higher risk, but I can't imagine that other celebrities expect the Canadian government to foot the bill for their security.