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Yuna shines in qualifying for worlds

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sugar, Jan 6, 2013.

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  1. TripleWallie

    TripleWallie Member

  2. Sugar

    Sugar Well-Known Member

    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  3. modern_muslimah

    modern_muslimah Thinking of witty user title and coming up blank

    I find her SP more interesting than her LP. This time around she seemed fulled invested emotionally in the SP whereas her LP still seems flat. You can tell she was thinking through it. However, I think the performance aspect in Seoul was better than it was in Dortmund. Her jumps are still breathtaking. She hasn't missed a beat technically speaking (with the exceptions of her spins...they could use a little work, especially the layback). I'm glad she's back. I think she will push the other top ladies in terms of technical content and I think they will push her as well, especially when it comes things like choreography and performance.
  4. os168

    os168 Active Member

    Uh... with all due respect, are you familiar with the musical at all? Or in particularly which music cuts they are from and the meaning behind the music? 'On my own' is just that.. It is Eponine's internal dialogue by herself singing to herself on the stage all alone. It is not 'On my own plus a few millions watching me at home plus a bunch FSUers gawking at me behind their computer screens which I must wink at them like a Bond girl and smile to show them I care about them ALL the time and that I am having a good time performing like a prom queen'? :confused:

    I have always had a theory that "Someone like you" feels like Wilson's good bye love song to Yuna while paying tribute to their working history/friendship over the years on the assumption Yuna will retire soon, and that would be the end of their competitive days. It is full of forlorn feelings that is intimate, familiar, complex and as intense as lovers goodbyes. His choreography for that program feels like a collage of many of his 'best of' moves to celebrate and paying tribute to their collaborative days. Many moves subsequently came to be known as Wilson-esque signatures that became the de facto choreography vocabulary of the COP era. In that respect, it may feel generic by today's standards due to its familiarity, but they are also what established Wilson's brand. Their contribution towards each other's success cannot be understated. Yuna's sporting and artistic success validates Wilson's COP work, and also vice versa.

    Bear in mind, 'generic' moves doesn't always start as 'generic' until someone first establish them. Others follow them. Or them being replicated due to established success. There's a fine line between something described as generic when it is an 'imitation' vs something that is 'classic' when it is being performed by the original team that founded them. Otherwise it is like going to a Prada shop and complain why everything black and boring. Or go to a James Cameron movie and complain there's too much special effects and why the love stories always so cheesy?

    I'd argue the middle section 'on my own' does contains certain archetype Wilson/Yuna choreography, but actually it fit the messages of the music well. 'On my Own' is Eponine's internal dialogue about feelings and contemplation about love, hope, loss, regrets, lingers of sweet bitterness; to learn the meaning/value of true love and acceptance of selflessness. The choreography therefore should be without pretension or fuss and at its most intimate natural state; heartfelt and honest. Choreographically, to harness that visceral fortitude Wilson became familiar with Yuna over their years together, he naturally select their classic moves which embodies these biographical qualities that fit the story the best, something he tends to do with his skaters. Perhaps this is why that part reminded programs like "Someone like you" which shares similar biographical qualities. This is not to say the work could not be more original or creative, but it does explain why such an approach has been adapted rather than blame it entirely on complacency.

    Yuna's SP and LP tends to directly contrasts every season like Fire and Ice since her El Tango and Lark Ascending days. Just like your appreciation for 'Kiss of the Vampire' program because of its originality, dark sensuality, and risk taking that explored something new and unfamiliar and not yet seen in ladies figure skating. It is also understandable why you'd appreciate the LP less because of its opposite approach. The SP tackles what deemed low art (B-rated Vintage Horror) and reconstructed into a new format to compete with the likes of high art (many classical works written for dance, opera and ballet for example) of which the figure skating worlds tends to celebrate and being more receptive to. It requires far more dramatic, boldness and commitment to stage expressions (just like B movies) to challenge and winning over people's perception and unfamiliarity to make the program work. Balance of subtlety, brashness, nuances, attack, raw emotions, extremism to convey transcension of emotions from human, rebirth to the supernatural while still having enough empathy yet detachment to the plight of the character during the 2 mins 50 sec.

    In contrast, Les Miserable took a more traditional approach to musical deconstruction and being more faithful acknowledging the source material. The program is structured almost like an 'Homage to Les Miserable' in in the 4 parts music edit. It fit with a more 'classic' Wilson choreography that acknowledges the tradition of music theater describing the 4 part music. It does so through the costume design, the intros opening and closing music edits like curtain rise and curtain close etc.. It offers a more conservative and faithful approach than the Vampire SP. This is not avant garde art, but paying homage to a much loved classic work.

    As a die hard Les Mis fan (I have seen the musical more than 6/7 times at London west end over a decade at both the Palace Theater and the Queen's Theatre - Yes that really is the name of the theater where the musical currently plays :HA!:) I really like how they deconstructed the music. It avoided being too abstract or too literal while still keeps the musical fresh yet somewhat familiar. It is a delicate balance and a huge undertaking to trim down a 3 hour 52 songs musical into a 4 minute extravaganza designed for skating while still encompass the epic themes of Les Mis without being too literal. There might have been many intimate portrayal of characters and themes from Les Miserable in the past, but surely none as ambitious or grand as this one?

    Given the poor ice conditions and the -4 sub zero temperature environment reported from yesterday, I consider today's performance well executed, superbly controlled and technically brilliant. I was enormously impressed, moved and even stunned at this new personal milestone for Yuna Kim consider she rarely does clean LPs. Artistically she is already head and shoulder above other ladies. With better environment condition and occasion at WC, Yuna can be even more inspired and to bring us an full on emotional epic I know she is capable of. She is already at the top of her game, but at her best, like all greats, she is capable of showcase something beyond the sport - like the height of human potentials, which poignantly is also what Les Miserable about among many other wonderful things.

    (blimey.. this post is a bit long. I guess that is what being inspired can do to someone :slinkaway) ac
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2013
  5. centerstage01

    centerstage01 Well-Known Member

    Uh...with no respect at all, yes I am familiar with the musical. I also know the cuts but I didn't realize YuNa's whole LP was supposed to be a mini-retelling of Les Miz. If so, I'm insulted that we don't get a mini revolution complete with mini death on the ice. And if Eponine's internal dialogue is supposed to be kept internal then that whole song in the musical was a waste of time. All those actresses on stage should've just hid off-stage and sang...wouldn't want to project to an audience, would we?
  6. os168

    os168 Active Member

    What are you talking about? Have you actually seen the stage musical or just listen to the music and watch the movie?

    On my own is only sang by a secondary lead on stage. What other actresses? Insulted? That's a bit extreme. Want a mini death and revolution? Why not throw in a prison sentence and steal a loaf a bread as well? Sound like you are more about nitpicking than anything else. If you read my post, you'd know this is not a mini-retelling of Les Mis at all... sigh!
  7. Coco

    Coco Well-Known Member

    Not knowing what to do with your arms can be a conditioning thing, too. I noticed that in her sp, her first four elements are all the elements with flight. I can't recall the last time she did that. In the past few years, she's always done her jump combo and solo triple as her first and second elements, but usually she mixed up the rest of the program. This time, it's all in the front. So I'm guessing there are some conditioning issues. If she were a tennis player, the key phrase would be "match tested."
  8. overedge

    overedge Janny uber

    I agree that it is a well balanced program, but I think you are reading way too much into the choreographic intention, particularly when a major part of COP-era choreography is to get in as many point-scoring elements as possible.
  9. jenny12

    jenny12 Well-Known Member

    Awesome Yu-Na! So glad she's back!
  10. NadineWhite

    NadineWhite Well-Known Member


    :kickass::smokin::respec::encore:OMG, AWESOME, AWESOME, YOU'RE LOOKING AT A FUTURE 2-TIME OLYMPIC GOLD MEDALIST, AND RIGHTFULLY SO!:encore::respec::smokin::kickass:

    As I've said before, I haven't seen this type of calibre of performer since Oksana Baiul, and as far as Ladies Olympic Gold Medalist go throughout history, I'd put Yuna #2 (behind Sonja of course). She has it A-L-L; jumps, beauty, body, artistry, speed, and on & on & on ad infinitum. She's the epitome of what the standard should be, let alone an Olympic Gold Medalist; she combines both technical precision with exquisite presentation. Something that looks so easy put on paper, but a whole other ballgame when it comes to laying it down. Because usually you have either or, but not *both*, that is so rare to have both, truly.

    Ah, enough words, let me just say I feel so blessed to be alive to see this. After so many decades of watching figure skating, to finally get one that comes the closest to Sonja, and Oksana.

    I'll be cheering her on to win another World Gold, but more importantly to win another Olympic Gold Medal, which she should easily do when she skates like she just did. She alone is the only one that controls her own destiny. Because when she skates clean she should easily win, and rightfully so, whereas all the other women in the world do not, they have to rely on Yuna making a mistake to even come close. Period.

    :hat1:GOOOOOOOOOOOO YUNA!!!!!!!!!!!:hat1:
    l'etoile and (deleted member) like this.
  11. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    Ummm I am not sure the program was meant to be anything than just selection of music from the musical that she was skating to.
  12. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    I agree that while she skated it well, the program was all about her wanting to be pretty and popular. It really doesn't have much to do with the original theme of Les Miserables.
  13. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

    Just because you chose music from a well known musical does not mean that you have to interpret the music according to the plot of the musical. I'd rather see someone take the music and give it a fresh interpretation than see someone die on the ice for the 1000th time while skating to Carmen.
  14. TripleWallie

    TripleWallie Member

    Wanting to be pretty and popular? LOL! If any program of hers is about being pretty and popular it would be Gershwin Concerto in F or her James Bond SP. She's hardly seducing the crowd here in this program with her sad or pained expressions, or up reaching arm movements. I really don't get how you got that impression from this program. Yuna is pretty and popular, but she doesn't need to be literally dressed in rags and with ugly makeup in order to express the original theme of Les Miserables.
  15. centerstage01

    centerstage01 Well-Known Member

    *sigh* Let me try this a little more slowly for you.

    In my original post, all I inferred was that YuNa needed to project more to the audience for the entire LP as I felt she was so busy concentrating on the technical but that with more practice, this might not be as much of a problem at Worlds. YOU decided I had no idea what the songs were or what they were even about and that if she was more of an introvert it was because that's what the song was about and she should do a literal interpretation of "On My Own" when I hinted nothing of the sort. At which point I figured you assumed I thought YuNa was doing some smaller retelling of Les Miserables what with taking some obscure portion of my first post and wildly misinterpreting what I said and then getting your underwear in a twist and trying to tell me I don't know anything about the musical at all.

    Oh, and the "other actresses" part: you are aware that Les Miserables has been staged hundreds of times in lots of other locations besides London, right? And that many, many actresses have played the part of Eponine on stage, yes? Now go back and re-read what I said.
  16. Sasha'sSpins

    Sasha'sSpins Well-Known Member

    I've said this before-Yuna is not playing around! She means to win the Olympics again! If a U.S. skater can't win it (not very likely) then I'll be totally happy if Yuna repeats-and ties Katarina Witt for two-time Olympic Champion. Sonja will still be the Olympic Goddess with her three titles though. :)
    l'etoile and (deleted member) like this.
  17. Cheylana

    Cheylana Well-Known Member

    Wow, Yuna looks fantastic. She makes the triple lutz-triple toe look so easy! :eek:
    Best of luck to her and all the other ladies at Worlds.
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2013
  18. cbd1235

    cbd1235 Well-Known Member

    Wow Yuna looks damn good! I'll say that she moved me emotionally, but the emotional impact is not at her full potential yet. I'm a sucker for clean performances though ;)

    Can't wait to see her live in London!
  19. shine

    shine Well-Known Member

    Uh, I'm sorry. But a person is entitled to feel whichever way they do about a program even if they have NEVER listened to the particular music once. Besides, it's not like Les Mis is some arcane piece of work that is only understood by a few or requires some acquired taste of music. The music is pop enough and pretty easy to listen to and the lyrics explains itself so I'm not sure why you had to write a dissertation about it. I find it especially funny that posters feel the need to overanalyse a program which really wasn't meant to be analysed in such details because there really isn't that much stuff in there. Just sit back and enjoy her jumps :p
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2013
  20. bardtoob

    bardtoob Former Choreographer for Anna Maria Tragikova

    She skated well. The content had high difficulty and quality execution. She was fast, fluid, and had a fair number of transitions. I think the choreography could be better in line with the music, although that could easily be overlooked since she was clearly emotionally committed to the performance.

    This was, by far, the best performance I have seen this season, and makes me think she can easily be on the podium leaning towards 1st or 2nd.

    I have not been a fan in the past, but I saw "it" today.
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  21. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

    deleted because duplicate
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2013
  22. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

    That is not the way David Wilson works.

    I saw "it" today too Bardtoob.

    I am really at a loss as to the criticism. This is a gift for the season and yet there is so much criticism, ill-founded imo. This performance is head above heels over any skate done by the ladies this season, most of which were marred with falls and popped jumps. For the poster who said this program was juniorish, OMG.
  23. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Well-Known Member

    Had been to MokDong Ice Rink for the days.

    Actually, the Ice Rink, having sub rink and mainly been used for the hockey, was the coldest rink I'd ever been in domestic and foreign. I'm very healthy, taking regular exercise and winter-hardiness but I shivered with cold and didn't feel any different inside and outside the rink. Sitting 6 hours doing nothing... It's a hard decision to take and clap frozen hands out of my pockets... :cold:

    Skaters waiting their turn to warm up and play also spent hard time, wore a duck-down parka and/or dressed in a layers. Trainers were busy to rub skaters' legs to maintain their body heat.

    Day 1.

    During the warmup, Yuna cleaned 2As and 3Fs with pinpoint accuracy but failed the last 3Lz3T try. Compared with other jumps, Yuna's Lutz needs speed and long entry path before the toe-pick but skaters, young and over-strained by the 5,000 crowds, media and KSU people concerned, practiced so hard and Yuna couldn't find the path through.

    At the 1st try, she landed 3Lz just before the fence, found there're no room to try 3T and stopped on her hands leaning against the fence. Crowds're surprised at the moment but relieved when Yuna showed surprise and smiled archly.
    At the 2nd try, did 3Lz3T cleanly! Her rotation speed were stunning and height were extraordinary!
    At the 3rd try, she tried 3Lz3T in haste cuz there're just less than 10 more secs to the end. She did it but fell after the 3T. Crowds're surprised again but laughed loudly after Yuna stuck her tongue out and squirmed with shyness.

    At the competition, Yuna fell just before stroking the 3Lz3T. I don't know exactly why she fell but my seats're near the place and I saw something odd on the ice, wanted to check again after her performance but missed the chance cuz there're so many flowers and dolls after her performance. Anyway, Yuna said she fell because she got twisted by her own legs.

    She popped 3Lz and didn't try the 2nd triple but did all the choreo and steps before the 3F. So that How could I imagine she would try 3F3T. But she did that! It was the first time in competition since the Worlds 2009 in LA. I knew it's the plan B and she's been doing the combination like 3L. But doing that extemporaneously is well..... I thought 3F2T but what I saw was 3F3T. Crowds including me got crazy after the combination.

    As you all may knows, Yuna's strength is she knows what she has to do after the mistakes. Yeah! She did focus and do her best in every component remained and scored 64.97 points to rank first after the short program.

    Day 2.

    During the warmup, Yuna again showed how well she had been prepared but there's a fly in the ointment she fell after 3Lz3T. The later, she hit the combination proudly.

    At the competition, it was as perfect as her Olympic FS. Wanna nitpick at the performance? Yeah suit yourself but it was the 3rd time I, man at age 40, cried at the ice rink - Adam Rippon's FS at 4CC, Yuna Kim's SP at NRW and FS at Korean national (((RunnersHigh))))

    Anyway, right after the 2A and during the CCoSp, the last component of her Free Skating, crowds kept doing clap and applaud and many already stood up and gave a standing ovation.

    Right after the performance, I expected 144 (NRW's 129 + 10 in TES + 5 in PCS ) but traditionally, Korean National Figure Skating Championships has been notorious to fan for its poor scores to skaters so that I expected about 138 but.. it was 145! :kickass:


    • It was the first time for KSU to sell the tickets for the National.
    • According to the KSU, all 4,800 ticktes were sold out within minutes.
    • National Figure Skating Championships were broadcasted for the first time and Free Skating was carried *LIVE* from public TV network. - Ranked #1 in ratings with 7.4%.
    • A judge received a blow to the head with dolls - Some of them were as big and heavy as I am... She stared at crowds. ;)
    • There're waiting line for the fan who couldn't get the ticket in front of the ticket booth. They hold banner reading "Skating fan for the tix." Fans or skaters' family with extra ticket donated or sold the tix at the original price. One who got a ticket handed the banner to the other next. And most of them could enter the rink. (It was such a good idea!!! And made scalpers around disappointed and leaved in peace cuz they couldn't buy or sell any.)
    • Jin-seo Kim gave fans, waiting Yuna outside the rink, cups of coffee. :lol:
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2013
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  24. mineko

    mineko Member

    ^ Thanks for the great report. :)
  25. 4rkidz

    4rkidz plotting, planning and travelling

    thanks for the link, well I am very impressed by Yuna, a great program and I loved the music - she really hasn't missed a beat with her level of skating upon her return, will make for a very tough ladies field at worlds :)
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  26. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    She probably chose the program to jump on the Les Miserables bandwagon. I don't see anything in her performance that relates with the original. Anyone who seriously enjoyed Hugo's novel or watched the musical would agree with this. Please take a step back and listen to all the posters who don't really appreciate the program.
  27. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

    I too thought that while the jumps were amazing, strong, textbook, she was completely un-engaged emotionally. And frankly, looked awkward at times, particularly during the final footwork at 4:11 on the youtube video, whatever she was doing looked unattractive.
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  28. l'etoile

    l'etoile New Member

    Great job, Yuna!

    Well people are "entitled" to their opinions and if team Yuna sees something to be done, they'll do that just right. What an amazing performance! If she can do this at Worlds again, wow. This season, many of favorite programs are from the ladies. Mao's Swan Lake, Ashley's Red Violin and LP, and now both of Yuna's programs! Imagine, how wonderful and blessing it would be if these ladies all deliver their true abilities at worlds:swoon:
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  29. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    Well that would be me that said that and whilst you may have seen it one way, I saw it a different way. The program technically was brilliant - fantastic jumps. But choreographically was not the same standard. There was some working with the phrasing of the music but it lacked refinement in the moves or connection to the music. And I was not getting much emotion being put out there. There was not much variety in the types of moves or gestures presented by the skater. From my judging eye, it did appear juniorish. However she has only performed it twice in competition. Programs do take time to develop and have to be worked in. Skaters sometimes have to learn to connect to the music and find their way through it. At worlds it may be on a totally different level.
  30. Keftiu

    Keftiu New Member

    She is still the best in this figure skating world!
    Now, I live in the US but I watched Yuna's LP, Les miserables, with live broadcast. Yes, I could not help watching her and the most fabulous program in this season, although there is a 14-hour time difference between Seoul and my place. Yes, yes, yes! It was worth staying all night because her performance was mesmerizing! :swoon: To tell the truth, when I saw Yuna's Olympic LP, I thought there would be no performance that could surpass that. But Yuna came back with her stunning program, Homage to Korea, and I could not but to admit that there would be no limit in her brilliant and elegant artistry. Now, I am falling in love with this, Les Miserable, and to me, prospects for her next season have already started. I really really really envy the people seeing her amazing and touching performance with their own eyes.
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