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Yu Na Kim is great skater but not even in same league as much greater Michelle Kwan

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by judgejudy27, May 10, 2011.

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  1. amaro

    amaro Active Member

    I read Yuna's performance at worlds wasn't as good as her performance at Olympics, but it wasn't too bad either. While she had a couple of botched jumps, she still had her solid artistic side throughout the programs. Her coming back to the rink and preparing for another competition through a major post-Olympics slump, not having been in any of the season's competitions and still being able to come so close to winning worlds title is amazing and in a sense a personal victory for her, whose past 13 months must have been like a roller coaster ride. I don't see any current skaters pulling that other than Yuna, and for that I understand why she showed tears on the podium, not over her being in the 2nd place, but for the realization that she overcame another tough obstacle in her young life and came back on the podium once again.

    She showed everything there is an athlete, not just as a skater, could show at the Olympics, and that performance made it clear what she is capable of if her competitive fire is on. What else does she need to prove as an athlete? I am glad she is now experimenting with her skating, taking a Korean folk song unfamiliar to general skating fans and judges as her program music for example. Like a movie director who just made a huge commercial success is given freedom to explore for his/her real interest for the next movie projects, deviating from usual princess music and trying something new is a luxury a skater who achieved her lifetime goal as an competitive athlete can indulge. I am really interested in seeing what she will bring to the next competitive season, if she decides not to retire, because I sense the new programs will be as refreshing as her LP this year.
    Last edited: May 16, 2011
  2. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    Originally Posted by aliceanne:

    LOL, even judgejudy27 herself agrees that it is pointless to “pit anyone against Kwan.” Here are the exact words by judgejudy27 from her Yamaguchi vs Yu Na thread:

    Originally Posted by judgejudy27:
  3. Spinner

    Spinner Where's my book?

    I have no idea what horrifying turns this thread may have taken, but this reply bears repeating.

  4. Sasha'sSpins

    Sasha'sSpins Well-Known Member

    Yep. Don't know how I missed this thread. I need to stay amused now that 'RachaelGate' seems to be dying down. :watch:
  5. EricRohmer

    EricRohmer New Member

    Last edited: May 16, 2011
    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  6. sson4won

    sson4won New Member

    Wow great interview! Thank you for uploading this!
    Her words make me tearing even though she talk with a big smile.
    Yeah Yuna be cool as you are and go for it as you do!:respec:
  7. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Well-Known Member

  8. lowtherlore

    lowtherlore New Member

    :lol: Groove it, baby!
  9. Proustable

    Proustable New Member

    Seriously. I wonder if this thread would exist if Ando had lost this year.
  10. Mafke

    Mafke Well-Known Member

    Getting here very late, but Kim is handicapped by a bean counting judging system while Kwan had the benefit of a more holistic system.

    6.0 had it's faults (let me count the ways....) but it did have a place for 'the whole can be more (ore less) than the sum of its parts'. CoP is stubbornly a bunch of parts and no more and no less and even the best skaters, like Kim, can't often construct good holistic programs where the elements make sense on their own rather than as a point building strategy. Kim's Bond girl program is the closest to an organic whole program that she's been able to do. Otherwise she's just out their piling up the beans for the judges to count...
  11. kwanette

    kwanette Fetalized since 1998

    2000 Nationals in Cleveland.
  12. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

    Angela Nikodinov was 4th after the SP. I don't remember her programs at those championaships, so I can't say if Michelle should have been 4th after the SP.

    About the 3Toe vs 3Flip : Sarah's jumping technique was not good and without any step going into her solo 3Flip. So, i don't think Michelle's 3Toe was easier than Sarah's 3Flip ! ;)

    PS : this thread is still alive ? lol
  13. jlai

    jlai Title-less

    Angela's short? Wasn't it that rather boring "Wide Eyes Shut" program? She could have placed higher had her program been a bit better
  14. IceJunkie

    IceJunkie Well-Known Member

    Damn, it feels like 2006 again with all the Kwan threads.
    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  15. OliviaPug

    OliviaPug Well-Known Member

    2006? The years between 1996 and 2003 were EXTREMELY heavy on the Kwan! Especially 2001-2002.

    I think both ladies are amazing skaters. Despite comparisons, I find them so very different.

    The thing that sets Kwan apart is the organic nature of her skating. Janet Lynn was another with this incredible quality. It is a memorable quality, not easy to quantify, which is why COP was never made for Kwan's strengths (though I believe she would have exceled at any judging system she was brought up under).

    Yu na has amazing jumping skills and the ability to put together a cohesive program from start to finish. She has also shown great nerve when skating under tremendous pressure.

    Both beautiful. Both truly great skaters.

    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  16. IceJunkie

    IceJunkie Well-Known Member

    I was just referring to all the craziness surrounding on the board during/before/after Michelle's Olympics fiasco. It felt like there was a new thread every day.
  17. sarakimm

    sarakimm Member

    I thought the same thing, especially when viewing her exhibition skate at Worlds. She looked like she could barely summon the energy to complete the performance. That is the difference I see between her and MK. MK realized that she had to skate for the love of it and not the medals, and her joy in skating always showed. I don't think Yuna loves it anymore.
  18. dawnie

    dawnie Well-Known Member

    I believe Yuna was on pain medication during the exhibition which might explain her lack of energy/ambivalence during the performance.
  19. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Angela was boring as heck in 2000 but she skated cleanly with very good elements so she probably should have been over Kwan in the SP. Hughes should have been 2nd over Cohen in the LP anyway though.

    I see the posters point that Kwan has an obvious edge at Nationals with her legacy that was already built up over so long, but she still had to capatilize on it by skating well time and time again, which to her credit she did. All events Yu Na Kim enter since 2007 even at the World level are hers to lose, as much or more than Kwan at Nationals, but unlike the reliable Kwan the extremely erratic and inconsistent Kim usually blows them anyway. Hence her winning only 1 of the last 5 Worlds when she was supposed to and easily had it in her grasp to win all 5, didnt even have to skate totally clean to have won all 5 in fact, just made fewer mistakes than she did all 4 times. By contrast Kwan didnt have to just skate cleanly but lights out to win in 1996, 2000, 2001, and even 2003, and produced it.
  20. Karina1974

    Karina1974 Well-Known Member

    :rolleyes: And you can't even spell correctly the last name of the most accomplished skater in the history of the sport. There is no J in her last name. It's properly spelled H-e-n-i-e,
  21. dawnie

    dawnie Well-Known Member

    Kim extremely erratic and inconsistent? Come on now, I would use those words to describe Kostner and even Czisny before this last season. If anything, Kim has been the most consistent female skater since the 2006-2007 season.

    Also, I agree that Worlds was Kim's to lose in 2009, 2010, and 2011. But in 2007, I'd say she was co-favorite with Asada and I think she needed to skate a clean (or close to clean) LP to win judging by Asada's inflated scores in the LP. And 2008? She was the favorite after the GPF, but then became a question mark before the event because of her injury. Also, she would have won if not for the almost entirely European judging panel. I think once the judging panel was decided, Kostner became the favorite by default. IIRC, there was only 1 judge that was NOT European on that panel and I thought Kim was under-marked in the LP and Kostner severely over-marked in both the SP and LP.
    Last edited: May 24, 2011
  22. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    I agree in 2007 she did not enter as the clear favorite, in fact Asada was probably the slight favorite. Still after Asada blew the short program it was clearly Kims to win or lose. And given that Ando held on to win even after Asadas great long program (still not clean though) Kim probably could have afforded a fall and won. Credit to Ando though for really skating like a World Champion in 2007 despite Asada and Kim's mistakes, unlike her winning performances this year (ugh). And you are right on 2008 but Kostner messed up almost every jump as usual anyway so it didnt matter, 2008 was easily alot of different skaters to win easily given what everyone else did, Kim included. I agree she should have won in 2008 though.
  23. pinky166

    pinky166 #teamtrainwreck #teamdiva

    Keep in mind that Yuna got no credit for her 3s-2t combo in her 07 FS at Worlds because it was her 4th combo as she fell on both triple lutzes, one which counted as a sequence, and had already completed 2 other combos before the two falls and the salchow combo happened. Her score wouldn't have been enough to beat Mao for 2nd, but the gap would have been less and she certainly would have finished ahead of Kimmie in the FS.
  24. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    But if she only fell once wouldnt she have gotten credit for that element. In that case she wins easily with just one fall. And even if not she gets GOE for any of her clean jumps, her PCS would go up with only one fall too, and the triple lutz value would be more if it wasnt a sequence, and even that altogether would be enough to add up the extra 9 points or so with just 1 fall but not the 2nd one.
  25. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    Let me add that in 2007 Worlds in Tokyo, Ando and Asada did 4 3Lz and 3Flutz in the FS respectively, in addition to getting full value for their cheated triple-triples.
    Last edited: May 25, 2011
  26. senorita

    senorita New Member

    sorry but :rofl::rofl::rofl:
    ant :kickass:
  27. amaro

    amaro Active Member

    Geez, this thread is still alive? I think FSU admins are going soft.
  28. amaro

    amaro Active Member

    She was high :) on painkiller she took that morning.
  29. Frau Muller

    Frau Muller #1 Dick Button Fan

    Yuna's long lines and jumps are much better than Michelle's ever were...and (gulp) she's an Olympic Gold Medalist. Michelle had (has) lovely edges and a certain emotional spirit.

    The "lines" are the big differentiator here. Michelle wasn't blessed with the long sleek lines, long legs-to-short-torso ballerina frame that Yuna possesses. I always found Michelle's short stumpy legs a bit distracting, especially when performing spread eagles (almost a bow-legged look). A great champ in her time, though. Skated with so much "heart" in her biggest competitions, such as 2003 Worlds in DC.
  30. bardtoob

    bardtoob Former Choreographer for Anna Maria Tragikova

    ^ I think Yu Na is actually a little gangly looking because she does not use her lines to her advantage at all. Her arabesque positions, if you can call them that, look unnatural in her spirals and spins. Furthermore, Yu Na has yet to produce at least one good layback spin while Kwan was able to do that circa 2000.
    Last edited: May 25, 2011
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