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Yu Na Kim is great skater but not even in same league as much greater Michelle Kwan

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by judgejudy27, May 10, 2011.

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  1. kittyjake5

    kittyjake5 Well-Known Member

    Red Sox losing in the 10th inning.
  2. RumbleFish

    RumbleFish New Member

    I just have two questions to the thread starter.
    1. Are Zhangs still your favorite pair team? :D
    2. Which league does Mao Asada belong to after her lackluster showing in Moscow?
    Last edited: May 11, 2011
  3. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    If you are talking to me I have a soft spot for the Zhangs of late only since I feel like they are getting dumped by everyone, and everything is going against them. Plus I feel they have worked their asses of to try and improve their artistry, even if they arent the naturals some others are. I havent really been a big fan of their skating in the past, and I still am not as much as some of the others. However I would like to see them have won a World title before going out, but that is pretty much impossible now after seeing the World Pairs event this year.
  4. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    Hmmmm tough one. Did Lady Gaga rip off Madonna with Born this Way? Discuss.
  5. a56

    a56 New Member

    This seems to happen all the time to Olympic Champions. She has achieved the ultimate goal, so what does she do next, other than go for multiples of the titles she already has? She's at a crossroads in her life and her career. People who don't have the Olympic gold have a true sense of motivation in going to the next Olympics.

    I'd personally advise her to call it a career and move on. Three years from now at the Sochi Olympics, it's the next generation of skaters that will be on top of the podium. I doubt that any of the world champions of the last 5 years will be the 2014 Olympic Champion. No sense in training if she is not 100% into it, and if she's not willing to do multiple competitions in the lead up to worlds/Olympics. She seems to have so much fun performing exhibition programs, so she should now focus on that. Perhaps go to college, travel as she's mentioned, and be a coach or technical specialist or skating official if she wants to stay connected to the sport.
  6. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    Hmmmm so why doesn't she just go and sit in the corner and die? Life isn't worth living is it?
    Cheylana and (deleted member) like this.
  7. brightphoton

    brightphoton New Member

    You're a cheerful one.

    There are chapters in life. For normal people, it's grade school, college, career, doing something meaningful that you enjoy, making an impact on the world, maybe some offspring, THEN sitting in a corner and dying. For Yuna, her competitive figure skating chapter is over. She can now pursue something else.
  8. hanca

    hanca Well-Known Member

    Well, not everyone can have English as their native language. :rolleyes: Unfortunately I don't. But I am taking on board your concerns about my basic reading comprehension and hopefully in another 14 months you will be pleased with my progress!
  9. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

  10. antmanb

    antmanb Well-Known Member

    I always said I wanted to be a doctor. To make conclusions today about my profession based on that statement would lead you to be incorrect.
  11. ks777

    ks777 Well-Known Member

    Don't worry, English isn't my first language either. The OP insulted me before(yes I don't have good basic reading comprehension skills) and called me names because I didn't agree with him(I still believe it's him).
  12. hanca

    hanca Well-Known Member

    Thank you, ks777. I am not sure since when it is acceptable on an international forum to comment on other people's language skills, because anyone must be able to realise that we are not all from English speaking countries, but judgejudy27 appears to have such low self-esteem and therefore she has a need to prove to other people how stupid they are (and how clever he/she is). Whatever!
  13. Jaana

    Jaana Well-Known Member

    It´s rather impossible to compare skaters from different eras... Anyway, Kim is an Olympic and World champion, Kwan failed in the Olympics, twice. Of course Kwan has gotten 5 World gold medals, but other skaters have better achievements, e.g.:

    - Henie 3 Olympic gold medals PLUS 10 World gold medal
    - Witt 2 Olympic gold medals PLUS 4 World gold medals
    - Peggy Fleming, Olympic gold medalist and three-time World champion
    - Kristi Yamaguchi, Olympic gold medalist and a two-time World champion
  14. skfan

    skfan Member

    did you just start this thread to hear people bash michelle and yeonah because you don't like either of them? ;)
  15. Copper

    Copper New Member

    I think you're absolutely right. Some people are just waiting for (or creating) any opportunity to bash their targets. When this thread dies, I'm sure a new one will arise to serve the same purpose.
  16. Sylvia

    Sylvia Still recovering from Worlds...

    I'm pretty sure Aussie Willy was being sarcastic. ;) See this post earlier in this thread:
  17. Jenny81

    Jenny81 Active Member

    You're right. :lol:
  18. kittyjake5

    kittyjake5 Well-Known Member

    I hope the Red Sox win tonight. (I know my post has nothing do to with this thread but since it is such a silly thread, I thought I would say it anyway) of course JMO. :D
    Last edited: May 11, 2011
  19. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    Of course, compare Kwan's failed performance in 1998 to that of Fleming's, Witt's, and Yamaguchi's. And, that's even controlling for what were the technical standards were for each skater. I'm sure Kwan would have loved to perform under her standards the way Witt and Yamaguchi and Fleming (in the LP) did under theirs and walk away with gold (who knows maybe not). Hell, Kwan's bad skate in SLC still consisted of 5 triples, including two Triple Lutzes. Not saying she didn't fail to win gold, but I think one should also look at context.

    Anyway, this thread in general is just ridiculous and just asking for endless debate and fighting (one that I am aware I just participated in).
  20. bardtoob

    bardtoob Former Choreographer for Anna Maria Tragikova

    This tread is so bad it's bad.
  21. BigB08822

    BigB08822 Well-Known Member

    Not that I don't agree but didn't we have a disagreement in another thread about who faced the most competition and you said it was Asada? Yet here you say Yu Na Kim has faced weaker competition than Kwan. That makes no sense because Asada and Yu Na have been competing side by side their entire careers. Maybe I am mistaken, will have to go find the thread.

    ETA: Found it. You chose Asada and Kim and said "I definitely wouldn't pick Kwan."

  22. giselle23

    giselle23 Well-Known Member

    Didn't Michelle as young girl say she wanted to win three Olympic gold medals? Or am I imagining that? Michelle loved competing. I think she would have continued at least until 2002 if she had won.
  23. giselle23

    giselle23 Well-Known Member

    Everyone except Plushy! :)
  24. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Asada began her senior career competing and dominating Slutskaya, Cohen, Arakawa in the 2006 Olympic season and probably would have won the Olympics and Worlds that year had she been age eligible (I dont give her credit for that as we will never know, but she proved herself vs those on the grand prix). Then in 2007 and 2008 was the one to beat overall facing Kim, Kostner, Ando, and Meissner all at their best. Kim had success in 2007 and 2008, but not as much as Asada, but then dominated for a couple years when Asada began to struggle, Kostner was past her prime, Slutskaya and Cohen were long gone. Her main rival the last two years has mostly been Miki Ando :lol: and even Ando is nowhere near the skater she was at her jumping peak in the mid 2000s when she was doing excellent triple-triples which she cant even rotate anymore.

    So I dont think Kim had the same competition as Asada at all, if we talk in the context of when they were successful.

    I think as far as overall competition goes Asada > Kwan > Kim. Of course in achievements Kwan > Kim > Asada. As far as overall talent Asada > Kwan > Kim (Asada is a huge undeachiever IMO due to bad coaching coaches choices, overemphasis on the triple axel, and other factors), and overall quality of skater considering the consistency element as well Kwan > Kim > Asada.
  25. Zokko!

    Zokko! Comansnala?

    WTF??? :blah: Extremely overrated, both ... lots of ubers, both ... Kim seems at least more natural talented, and, of course, an Olympic Gold medal ... :saint:
  26. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    Well I find it interesting that people are so willing to write her off (including yourself) based on one competition this year where she still had a remarkable achievement in winning a silver medal. Isn't that good enough?

    People are comparing her to last year because this year it wasn't the same. But at this current point of time she still is one of the best female skaters in the world, because the grounding and what is behind her still stands up, even though it may not be to our expectations (which I think is what people are judging her on).
  27. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Winning a silver in the terrible womens field this year is not a remarkable achievement for someone like Kim, especialy losing to a skater she would beat in her sleep if she were even 60% trained. It is a disaesterous showing really. Her Vancouver performances would have won the title this year by over 30 points over the slop that the rest of the women put out (for sure a bigger margin than what she won by in Vancouver) so losing only reflects the HUGE decline she has in her skating in only a single year. She can have a future in competitive amateur skating but obviously not approaching it like she did this year. She has to get back to taking it seriously again, yet she has already indicated she is skipping the GP next season so....

    Keep in mind there is no way the womens field will stay as awful as it was this year, which was a historically poor year. What is 2nd this year will probably be 6th or worse by Sochi.
  28. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    I actually didn't think the women's event at worlds was as bad as people make it out to be. The top skaters probably had one or two errors (like they usually do) but overall I think there were some really good performances.

    But to say that Kim's performance was "atrocious" and "disasterous" is over the top, lacks perspective and is not an accurate reflection of what truly went on on the ice. If she had totally splatted on every element then that would be disasterous. A couple of errors do not a disaster make. Because they were only small fraction of the performance overall.
  29. BmcC102

    BmcC102 Active Member

    Not to take anything away from Yu-na, but for me, Michelle really is the best female skater ever. (And this is coming from a Tara Lipinski, Sasha Cohen fan). Watching her skate last year to Winter Song just really sealed the deal for me. :)
  30. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Is there a single set of performances from anyone at Worlds this year that would have even placed on the podium at the last Olympics or at the 2009 Worlds? Obvious answer is no so enough said about the quality of the event. Miki Ando skated much better to win the bronze at the 09 Worlds than the gold in Moscow, and the 2010 Olympics was of a higher standard than the 2009 Worlds. And the gold performances from Moscow would not have any World title in the last 20 years which is even more telling. And Kim herself from Vancouver would have won this years Worlds by over 30 points. I doubt there is hardly anyone who would even debate that.
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