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Why is Czisny not fined like Flatt was for skating injured?

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by lpskater, Dec 12, 2011.

  1. lpskater

    lpskater New Member

    Just throwing this out there. I think there are arguments on both sides of the fence on this one. But, think it is worth the debate.
  2. Sylvia

    Sylvia Still recovering from Worlds...

  3. Carolla5501

    Carolla5501 Well-Known Member

    Why? Just to watch the fireworks on here :lol:

    However, USFS could not just send the next avaiable skater so I don't think they care!
  4. MR-FAN

    MR-FAN Kostner Softie

    And GPF is not worlds, you don't qualify spots for next year, neither would her withdrawal allow another US Lady to participate(1st alternate was Russian). Flatt skated injured at last year's GPF and didn't get a lot of flack over it
    flutzilla1 and (deleted member) like this.
  5. johndockley92

    johndockley92 New Member

    I think it's different because USFS could have sent a replacement for Rachel, while they couldn't have for Alissa
  6. kwanatic

    kwanatic Well-Known Member

    I figured this would come up. The "Czisny skating injured at the GPF" vs "Flatt skating injured at worlds" argument holds no water for several reasons. The main reason is that Alissa was not injured a full week prior to showing up for the GPF. She injured herself during a practice, in Quebec City...that's different. Had she decided to pull out, no one would have been sent to replace her.

    As for Rachael, she and her team knew a week before worlds (before she'd even left for Moscow) that she had a stress fracture and was injured. In that case, she could have relinquished her spot; instead, she kept it all hushed-up until all was said and done.

    Most importantly, this is the GPF--not Worlds. Granted all of them are individual events, but whether or not Alissa medaled or not had no bearing on how many spots the US team would receive. The GPF is an individual event. The only person who suffered from Alissa's dismal performance is Alissa...same as Rachael, who skated injured at last year's GPF, was the only one who suffered from her terrible performance last year. However, Rachael's bad placement at worlds last year had ramifications not only for herself, but the US ladies' team.

    The situations are very different...
  7. AYS

    AYS I'd rather have a pug for my president

    On top of what's already been stated, Alissa was examined by the official USFSA team doctors, who confirmed that she wouldn't run the risk of worsening the injury by attempting to compete on it.
    kwanette and (deleted member) like this.
  8. museksk8r

    museksk8r Holding an edge and looking dangerously sexy

    GPF placements don't affect the number of athlete slots a country has for next season's GPF like at Worlds. Besides, Flatt was injured before she arrived in Moscow while Czisny injured herself in Quebec City during a practice session.
  9. babayaga

    babayaga Well-Known Member

    By the way, how did the story with Rachael end? I mean, was anyone else punished besides her?
  10. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

    It's simple: Alissa reported the injury and was examined by team doctors, while Rachael kept it a secret. Rachael was fined for failing to report an injury, while Alissa followed the rules.
  11. MacMadame

    MacMadame Cat Lady-in-Training

  12. PDilemma

    PDilemma Well-Known Member

    Exactly. There is nothing to debate.
  13. Frau Muller

    Frau Muller #1 Dick Button Fan

    Yeah, I was thinking the same but realized that the rules & situaiton are different for Worlds.

    I have one very big kudo for Czisny: She finally showed her true feelings in KnC after a bad skate. This time we saw tears rather than flashing teeth/fake smile. She was 100% natural.
  14. FunnyBut

    FunnyBut Well-Known Member

    Not true. *I* also had to suffer through her terrible performance last year :drama:
  15. Loves_Shizuka

    Loves_Shizuka The Stolbova/Klimov and James/Cipres Uber

    Didn't Alissa injure herself during a practice between the SP and LP? Or am I mistaken?
  16. mag

    mag Well-Known Member

    Yes, I believe that was mentioned up thread. I hope you are not suggesting we should let the facts get in the way of a good :lynch:
  17. kwanatic

    kwanatic Well-Known Member

    :lol: I know, me too. :shuffle:

    I wonder what's going to happen to Rachael at nationals this year...

    It's clear the international judges have cast her off: she was last in one competition and like 8th or 9th in another, even after skating relatively well. Will the US judges award her a spot on the world team knowing that the international judges don't give a crap about her anymore? I'm thinking they won't. In addition to the tibia-gate thing from last year, I can't see them giving her a spot considering her results this year...

    I would have said Alissa was a shoo-in (and with some inflated scores she probably still is) but she looks very shaky and unsure...nowhere near where she was last season. Mirai had a better performance at her last event, but unless she can find a way to bring some life to her skating she might get passed over. Right now, I'm leaning more towards Ashley. She had decent results this year and, if she can get through the SP, she has a pretty good shot at the podium.

    It feels rather open again...no one seems like a lock for a spot as of now.
  18. RockTheTassel

    RockTheTassel Well-Known Member

    Exactly. I wouldn't be surprised to see any of the US ladies on or off the World team this year. It will certainly be an exciting competition in January.
  19. Loves_Shizuka

    Loves_Shizuka The Stolbova/Klimov and James/Cipres Uber

    Ha. Of course not. That would be naive of me.

    Though let's be honest, in addition to all the valid reasons already given in this thread, the fact she injured herself once the competition had started literally negates the need for any actual discussion. But I didn't say that
  20. AYS

    AYS I'd rather have a pug for my president

    No, it appears to have been at a GPF practice prior to the sp, if the article is accurate. It states she injured it at a practice on Thursday; the ladies sp wasn't until Friday.
  21. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Well it was the USFSA who fined Flatt and Czisny did not prevent another American skater from competing so I doubt they even cared at all in her case. Flatt probably shouldnt have been fined but I always viewed it was a hint from the USFSA to retire, one she didnt take but as this season has shown ought to have.
  22. Sylvia

    Sylvia Still recovering from Worlds...

    The injury on the flip could very well be why Czisny did 3Lo in her SP for the first time and didn't attempt a 3F in her FS.
  23. peibeck

    peibeck Simply looking

    I think you can gaurantee Alissa will get inflated PCS at Nationals. :p She's managed to do well with international judges with no transitions or choreography this season, so why won't she with the home-grown judges? :slinkaway

    Aside from which, despite the GPF she's had the highest scoring skates of any US lady this season. I still think she's a shoo in for one of the two worlds spots, unless she has a complete and utter melt down (a la 2010).
  24. Erin

    Erin Well-Known Member

    Yes, CBC reported that the injury was the reason that she was not attempting the flip in the FS. Makes sense that was why she took it out of the short as well, as I've always considered the loop to be less stable than the flip for her.
  25. haribobo

    haribobo Well-Known Member

    I'm not sure what would classify as an "utter meltdown" for Alissa but I think one fall in the short and 2-3 mistakes in the long would be enough to keep her off the team. I have more faith in the judging system and strength of the field than that.
  26. RD

    RD Well-Known Member

    I will admit I initially drew parallels to Flatt-gate last year but honestly, the two situations are VERY different. Reasons have already been explained so I won't go through them again. But then again, Flatt skated injured at this very event in 2010 and there wasn't much uproar then, so I think that's the situation this is much more comparable to.

    And as to what an "utter meltdown" for Czisny is...consider 2009 Worlds, 2010 Nationals, 2011 GPF, etc. :shuffle:
  27. VALuvsMKwan

    VALuvsMKwan Wandering Goy

    I am so VERY happy that she finally managed to please you, apparent sadist that you are.
    Kasey, PeterG, IceAlisa and 7 others like this.
  28. fsfan22

    fsfan22 Member

    She also did the 3Lo in the SP at Trophée Eric Bompard ... perhaps because she was having difficulties with it in practice, but likely because she's had wrong edge calls on it in the past.
  29. berthesghost

    berthesghost Well-Known Member

    Perhaps Im a masochist, because I'm actually curious to know what these possible arguments for fining cizny might be. The op seemed to think it was an even debate, but I'm stumped on how it's even a question. :lol:
  30. Louise

    Louise Banned Member

    Stating the obvious, Czisny's performance at GPF has no impact on the US ladies' program. She reported the injury, saw the team doc, and just went ahead with it. Basically like Flatt last year at GPF, and no one really cared that Flatt placed last.

    However there is a big difference between representing your country at Worlds, because an extra spot for the next year's team is a big deal. We have only two more worlds left before the Olys, and Flatt caused one of those worlds to only have two women compete. It was bad for US ladies skating. It was selfish. Skating is pretty much an individual sport, but when it comes to Worlds, it's not. It's for the country's skating program.

    I just don't see Flatt getting any breaks this year at Nats. She might go clean-ish and still place 8-10th. I think that's the only way for her to get the message now.