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Which 'bloc' will win most Gold medals at Worlds & Olympics between 2011 - 2020?

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Maofan7, Jan 18, 2012.

Which 'bloc' will win the most Gold medals at Worlds & Olympics between 2011 & 2020?

Poll closed Feb 17, 2012.
  1. North America

    23 vote(s)
  2. Asia

    24 vote(s)
  3. Europe

    34 vote(s)
  4. Other

    1 vote(s)
  5. Don't Know

    2 vote(s)
  1. berthesghost

    berthesghost Well-Known Member

    Yes. And if you go to Spokane for an event, you can always take a bus for a day trip to Miami. It is the same country at after all! :lol:
    And did you show the smug cow a map? :lol:
    PeterG and (deleted member) like this.
  2. PeterG

    PeterG Well-Known Member

    You know, I really don't encounter smug-ness in any sites where I hang out... :shuffle:
  3. bardtoob

    bardtoob Former Choreographer for Anna Maria Tragikova

    I think Russia should be able to send skaters to both Euros and 4CC :D

    :COP: Russia has 40% of Europe's land mass, but 77% of the country is in Asia ...
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2012
  4. bek

    bek Guest

    Well if you are going to talk just in terms of land mass then Europe and Asia really shouldn't be a separate continent to begin with. There were physical borders that kept Europeans and Asians a part but not the same kind of borders that keep North American/Europe a part. :lol: Asia/Europe though developed very different culturally. Most of Russia's population lives on the European side too; is of European descent (etc). So culturally it is more Europe.
    Still I remember reading an article about how Russia has always had both the West and the East pulling at it; which makes it different from both groups. Historically there has been tension between those in Russia who wanted to be fully part of Europe and those leaders of Russia who wanted more of an independent course. Heck from the days of Peter the Great. This is a pretty good article that talk about it. http://rbth.ru/articles/2011/09/02/unlocking_russian_identity_european_or_asian_13341.html
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 22, 2012
  5. Maofan7

    Maofan7 Member

    The 77% that is in Asia (i.e. Asiatic Russia) is Siberia (in its historic sense as opposed to the modern day Federal Districts - see map)

    Siberia is one of the most sparsely populated areas on the planet (an average of just 3 people for every square kilometer) as much of its terrain and climate are very difficult to live in. In the north, the summer only lasts 1 month. Hence, most of what population is there mostly lives in the south along the Trans-Siberian Railway. This is why 78% of Russians live in European Russia and just 22% in Siberia. Russia's identity, its culture, its history, its capital, its largest cities, and over three-quarters of its population are European. That's why its skaters go to the European Championships and the country participates in European sporting and cultural events across the board right down to the European Football Championships and the Eurovision Song Contest. Yes, there may be an argument (which I am not convinced of as I feel it should be an either/or situation and a choice needs to be made as the 4CC was set up specifically as a championships for those countries who could not compete at the European Championships) for Russia sending teams to both the European Championships and the Four Continents. However, the only fair way of doing that would be for European Russia to send its skaters to the European Championships and for Siberia (i.e. Asiatic Russia) to send its skaters to the 4CC. Unfortunately, however, given that most of Russia's best skaters come from European Russia, Siberia would struggle to put together a team. Hence, I imagine that's one of the reasons why Russia has never sought to get a team into the 4CC. There is also the issue that it would dilute Russia's chances at both championships and the fact that in the pairs and Ice Dance, one of the pair may come from European Russia and the other from Siberia/Asiatic Russia. Nevertheless, Russia has chosen the European Championships for the reasons set out above and that's what they have decided to stick with. Israel faced a similar dilemma and ultimately decided to align itself with Europe. It decided that whilst it is not in Europe, the European Championships and other European sporting events (e.g. its football clubs and national team now participate in European competitions) were the most appropriate option for it for both political reasons and because it felt closer spiritually and culturally to Europe, as the ancestry of many of its people came from there. In fact, it aligns itself with many things European right down to entering the Eurovision Song Contest (which it won back in 1998). Moreover, like Russia, Turkey is in both Europe and Asia and sends its skaters to the European Championships. Its an associate member of the European Union and has applied for full membership, and like Russia, participates in European sporting events across the board, reaching the semi-finals of the 2008 European Football Championships. Hence, countries need to choose one or the other and it needs to be the one that provides the best fit given its overall background. As the 3 examples above illustrate, where a countries land mass happens to be is only one factor, and not necessarily a decisive factor at that.
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2012
    skateboy and (deleted member) like this.
  6. mia joy

    mia joy Well-Known Member

    Yes, but the debate was always about being entirely Russian and being more European (in the meaning of western-European). It was never about being European vs Asian.

    Maofan, great post. Russia's belonging to Europe has never been an issue for me, but Israel and Turkey are a different matter.
  7. berthesghost

    berthesghost Well-Known Member

    :confused: Israel seems to be a totally different beast, and other than the isu trying to make a place for former USSR skaters, I've never heard of anyone ever considering them "europe". Debates of them joining the EU certainly aren't up front and obvious like they are for Russia and Turkey.

    The issues with Russia and Turkey in this context seem very similar to me. Why the obvious difference for you?
  8. taf2002

    taf2002 zexy demon

    I'm confused too. Turkey is partly in Europe, just as Russia is, so why would they be an issue at Euros? It's not like they are trying to send skaters to 4CC too. They are identifying solely as European as far as skating is concerned.
  9. mia joy

    mia joy Well-Known Member

    No, I'm not saying I have a problem with these countries sending their athletes to Europeans. I meant in general, for me it's obvious to consider Russia a European country. Turkey... not so much. I don't know, its culture is much more different from the rest of Europe, besides its European part is only 3% of the entire country. There is a reason why Anatolia is also called Asia Minor.
  10. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

    European skating without Russia would be hurting big time.