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Update on Rachael Flatt

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by maureenfarone, Jan 26, 2013.

  1. icellist

    icellist Active Member

    After Mirai won bronze at 4CC in 2011, a Alissa-Mirai combination at worlds would have had a good chance at getting back the 3rd spot. [I thought Rachael was judged too lenient at nationals that year too].
  2. jamesy

    jamesy shut in

    When can we start blaming Flatt for the government shutdown? :mitchell:
    mag, LilJen, Moto Guzzi and 9 others like this.
  3. RD

    RD Well-Known Member

    I'm not... :slinkaway

    This crap has been going on ever since she came on the scene. Long before "tibiagate". She is just not popular on FSU (she never was) - simple as that.
  4. Yazmeen

    Yazmeen Well-Known Member

    Rachael had the unfortunate problem of not being a long-limbed sylph like Alissa or at least a petite and elegant angel like Michelle or Kristi. She was a fireplug body type and more athletic than elegant; hell, I've known skaters who insisted she was "fat" when she was nothing of the kind. She just wasn't the aesthetically pleasing skater that other females in her generation were. So, she wasn't as deserving of praise or her accomplishments. And now, like Evan Lysacek, she's an over the hill skater who was lucky more than skilled, won medals and kudos that she didn't deserve, and she should just go away and not inflict herself on the skating world anymore. Like Evan, she is not popular here, so hearing about her now when her skills are not what they used to be is just a waste of time and ice according to some, which is really very sad. I wish her well, I hope she enjoys her season and whenever she goes out, goes out on her own terms, not those of fans who never cared for her in the first place.
    Moto Guzzi and (deleted member) like this.
  5. rhumba

    rhumba New Member

    I wonder what were the criteria that USFS used to pick skaters to Nice? It's almost like the gift/vacation for non contenders?? And we are talking about Olympic year and USFS are funding athletes for this event just for fun??....I can't see what will it do for US sending Flatt there. How did they pick her? Was it base on previous International or National result? Did she compete in any of those last year?? I thought the skaters had to perform well enough to earn the assignment?? I can see former Olympic or World gold medalists ( Evan or Yuna or Miki) could get free ride for assignments, but not sure about Flatt. I see no consistency in picking athletes by USFS....always a guessing game....
  6. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I <3 Kozuka

    Hiding her injury was against USFS rules. She was hardly the first to do it, but she talked about it and was caught. It was a stupid thing to do, but the lesson is for skaters to hide injuries even more and not talk about it. I don't think she should have gone. I think she is old enough and smart enough not to have gone, but she was training under an influential coach with a track record of not caring about his skaters' injuries, and plenty of adults have buckled to demanding bosses in tough situations.
    alilou and (deleted member) like this.
  7. olympic

    olympic Well-Known Member

    Yes, but who knows which Mirai would've shown up at '11 Worlds. It could just as easily have been splat city
  8. Coco

    Coco Well-Known Member

    Mirai had the worst long program of her life at 2010 worlds, and still beat Rachael by 8 points overall.

    Did Rachael ever beat Mirai internationally, when they were skating in the same competition?
  9. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

    2008 Junior Worlds, 2008 Skate America, 2009 CoC - the first two by comfortable margins. They didn't skate in that many international events together as seniors.

    I always thought that it was hypocritical how the USFSA went after Rachael when two years earlier Evan Lysacek was celebrated for winning Worlds despite having a stress fracture (which was not disclosed publicly in advance of the event). His risk paid off, hers didn't - but they did pretty much the same thing. If you send a message that it's OMG so brave to compete with injury, don't be surprised when it affects other people's choices and decisions.

    I imagine Rachael understands what her prospects are for this season, and is skating because that's what she wants and loves. I hope things will go well for her.
  10. Garden Kitty

    Garden Kitty Tranquillo

    Good for Rachael. I'm not sure what shape she'll be in after not competing for so long and having a heavy school schedule, but she's always seemed to be a hard worker with a good attitude and a good role model for younger skaters.
  11. RD

    RD Well-Known Member

    Well, Czisny certainly learned from all this and kept her situation hush-hush...I don't think what Flatt did (or USFS' response to what she did, anyway) helped anyone in the long run. In some ways it's even a step back...folks are going to be afraid to speak up.

    If you can get away with it, all the better it seems?
  12. FunnyBut

    FunnyBut Well-Known Member

    Given her record, the USFS couldn't possibly have discerned whether Czisny was really injured, or just relapsing into her typical wildly inconsistent Olesya-self. I think Czisny herself suspected something was wrong, but she didn't know specifically about the torn labrum until she had an MRI after the disasterous competitions.
  13. LilJen

    LilJen Reaching out with my hand sensitively

    Czisny, unless you believe that she herself is lying, DID NOT KNOW that she was injured.

    Good luck to Rachael!
    AxelAnnie and (deleted member) like this.
  14. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

    You can't really blame Ashley for help losing the 3rd spot at Worlds 2008. She was the youngest member of the team at 16 and shouldn't have had the pressure of keeping the 3 spots. No matter how they all skated that team wasn't keeping the 3rd spot. Meissner was on the way down and Liang was going to be lucky to finish in the top ten.
  15. NadineWhite

    NadineWhite Well-Known Member

    If I dread clicking on this thread every now & then to see what new comments have been added, I can only imagine how Rachael must feel.

    But in case she is reading, I would like to tell her "what one says about others says everything about him/her".

    It's one of the principles of self-reflection: what people say about you is never about you. What people say about you is always about them and how they perceive their world.

    Case in point, I know of someone wherein one of her mantras is never to tolerate being around people that judge beauty vocally. For instance she was with an acquantace that said "i don't think she's pretty" (referring to some female they had encountered) and my friend turned to her and said "Wow, I never before noticed how ugly you were before".
  16. OliviaPug

    OliviaPug Well-Known Member

    And so that's reason why she should not be competing this season? (That proverbial ship has sailed ... a long time ago ...)

    There is absolutely no good reason I can see why Rachael shouldn't be competing this season. Money? No. Taking spots away from other "more deserving" skaters? No. Pride? No. (That's Rachael's business, not anyone else's.) Pissing off haterz? Well, I think I finally found another good reason for Rachael to compete! :lol:

    (I have not been a fan of Rachael, but these lines of argument against her competing are just ridiculous and insupportable, IMHO.)
  17. OliviaPug

    OliviaPug Well-Known Member

    W-O-R-D! :lol:

  18. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I <3 Kozuka

    Anyone who is qualified and meets the deadline can compete to qualify for Nationals.

    Flatt had to be appointed by USFS to go to Coupe de Nice. Anyone who pays their dues to USFS has the right to question why she's being appointed to a Senior B, since USFS is investing their $$$ in her. Perhaps the answer is in some kind of policy or precedent that hasn't been identified here. She did compete in Skate America last year and is 64 on the SB list. She met the 4C's/Olympics TES minimums and the Worlds TES FS minimum in Kent.
    AxelAnnie and (deleted member) like this.
  19. centerpt1

    centerpt1 Well-Known Member

    I love Rachael's passion for skating. Hope she does well and surprises many.
  20. valyrian

    valyrian New Member

    So tell me, who would you want to replace her? Everyone at the top 13 at senior nationals has at least one international event, as does everyone at the top 5 at junior nationals. Who's she stealing from?

    God, the vitriol in this thread is embarrassing. It's a frigging senior B and she's a former Olympian and IIRC she scored somewhere in the high fifties for her SP at a summer competition. It's not like they're appointing her to the Olympic team. I hope she wins nationals. (I don't really, but maybe then everyone would shut up.)
    Moto Guzzi and (deleted member) like this.
  21. OliviaPug

    OliviaPug Well-Known Member

    I never said people can't question Rachael's being appointed to a Senior B. But I still stand by what I said -- that there is no GOOD reason why Rachael shouldn't be competing this season.

    PeterG and (deleted member) like this.
  22. Sylvia

    Sylvia Prepping for club comp. season!

    As well as another Senior lady besides Flatt who withdrew from Nationals due to injury (V. Lam) and the 2013 U.S. National Novice Ladies champ.

    I'm impressed with USFS' international competition budget in this Olympic season! :)
  23. jlai

    jlai Title-less

    Given the fact that you need a qualifying score to go to the Olympics, I can totally see why USFS would want any possible Olympic spot contender to compete for a qualifying score. And given the depth of the ladies field that does mean a lot of $$$$$$

    Even Czisny, if she's healthy and skating reasonably well, deserves a chance to go get a qualifying score.

    I hope all that $$$ is not at the expense of future envelope funding though...
  24. Tesla

    Tesla Whippet Good

    Eh, it's not that bad. You should check out the Fumie Suguri thread in the trash can.
  25. Coco

    Coco Well-Known Member

    It was inevitable, sending the inexperienced Liang and Wagner, imo. Also, US judges were still stuck in 6.0 land and - I'm guessing - probably weren't giving the most helpful feedback to senior skaters at this point in time.

    No one ever mentions this, but the US had only preserved three spots for ladies by 0.08 in 2007. And that was only because Rochette had a nervous, shaky SP and popped her Lutz in the LP. (I don't know if her PCS were 'normal' for her, but Hughes' PCS were 3 points higher than Rochette's!!!!)
  26. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

    There are only 30 women in the USFSA International Selection Pool. I think all have been offered competitions. If you know of someone who hasn't been offered a competition, please list their name.
  27. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

    Let's look at the historical record, shall we? And I'm just talking about the Ladies the USFSA has sent to this particular competition.

    We'll start with 2008, using this page and the links provided there.

    2008: Abigail Legg, Amy Nunn
    2009: Chelsea Morrow, Tatyana Khazakova
    2010: Karen Zhou, Christina-Maria Sperduto
    2011: None
    2012: None
    2013: Kiri Baga, Rachael Flatt

    So I would say, yes, giving non-contenders a vacation on the Côte d'Azur is pretty much the USFSA's intent in making its selections for this particular competition.

  28. B.Cooper

    B.Cooper Active Member

    To be fair....I am sure that this is not a vacation for Flatt. She is a full time college student, and IIRC, Baga is also taking classes in Boston this semester.
    There are those who will nitpick anything Flatt is involved with, and there are those who appreciate what she has brought to the sport, not only as an athlete, but as someone who contributes outside of the sport.

    Let's move on.....
  29. Sylvia

    Sylvia Prepping for club comp. season!

    To clarify - these 3 years cover the period when the U.S. Collegiate National top medalists were given partial funding by USFS' Collegiate program to attend this competition as a reward. They were not selected by USFS' international committee like Baga and Flatt were this year. The men and pairs selected by USFS to compete in Nice in recent years also were based on a majority vote by the international committee -- Max Aaron, Keegan Messing and Scimeca/Knierim last year, and Leng/LeDuc and Calalang/Sidhu this year.

    I already answered this earlier in the thread: http://www.fsuniverse.net/forum/sho...achael-Flatt&p=4007962&viewfull=1#post4007962
    Excerpt: "Only Alissa Czisny of the ISP ladies who have previously competed as a senior internationally has not been assigned an international to date and I assume she may not be competition-ready yet."
  30. kwanfan1818

    kwanfan1818 I <3 Kozuka

    Has USFS ever bypassed skaters in the International Selection Pool who weren't ill or injured?