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The Dance Hall part 3: Ice Dance Fans 2016-2017

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Dobre, Nov 23, 2016.

  1. text_skate

    text_skate Well-Known Member

    Thank you very much . I didn't know – never followed 4CC until lately
    barbarafan and kwanfan1818 like this.
  2. martyross

    martyross Well-Known Member

    there are subs, nonetheless, being a very nice video I made a summary:
    Ondrej Hotarek recalls how they first met, says Anna doesn't remember it as that was a difficult time for her so she was quite reserved. And he wasn't fluent in Italian yet. For these reasons he didn't know how to approach her.
    He says that she has the last word on all ( :
    She says his love is something that supports her a lot when she competes.
    Anna says that it's frequent to sense a romantic intimacy watching teams dancing. a kind of intimacy really exists, but it's completely work-related.
    They don't feel jealous of their skating partners.
    She says their Worlds victory has a big meaning to her, as it came at the end of a difficult and stressful season. It was a personal victory for her and Luca.
    They say that when she and Ondrej try something on the ice, things don't work, she once got hit on the head by mistake and cried while still skating.
    They are going to have children, bur so far there's no agreement on how many.
  3. cocotaffy

    cocotaffy Politicking for P/C to skate on whale sounds

    justtojoke, maya1985 and kittysk8ts like this.
  4. nuge

    nuge Well-Known Member

    Who needs the Navka headband with this:eek:
    girlscouse62 and cocotaffy like this.
  5. kittysk8ts

    kittysk8ts Well-Known Member

    Just read that Smart/Diaz will represent Spain @ Worlds. :)
    chapis likes this.
  6. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    Really? I wonder how they made that decision. Was this a surprise?
    kittysk8ts likes this.
  7. Sylvia

    Sylvia Still recovering from Worlds...

    Last edited: Mar 1, 2017
    chapis and kittysk8ts like this.
  8. DreamsofBliss

    DreamsofBliss Active Member

    Well it's a surprise that they backtracked on their original criteria, however, they've been discussing it since the Bavarian Open.
    AnaBM likes this.
  9. princeton123

    princeton123 Well-Known Member

    If that's true, that's really unfair.
    legjumper, Dobre and blancanieves like this.
  10. Dobre

    Dobre Well-Known Member

    Supposedly the criteria was the highest SD TES score, and H&K had that, as well as winning the only head-to-head between the two teams. The teams' highest ISU SB scores are within less than a point in S&D's favor. I like S&D's SD and will be happy to see it at Worlds, but I like the feel H&K have on the ice even more. If they had lost out, per the criteria or head-to-head, that would be one thing. But to change the criteria after the fact? I'm very sad for Hurtado & Khaliavin.
    AnaBM, clairecloutier and legjumper like this.
  11. Jun Y

    Jun Y Well-Known Member

    Choreographically, my favorite free dance of this season is Gilles and Poirier's, bar none.
  12. dinakt

    dinakt Well-Known Member

    Yes, me too.
    As a result, this is the year I went from simply appreciating them to being emotionally invested in how they do.
    The Accordion and Jun Y like this.
  13. chapis

    chapis Well-Known Member

    The Parsons will be competing at seniors the next season. Besides reputation, what will be their limitations to make the olympic team? I did not follow them so close this season, but I am impressed with theirs edges and how close to each other they are skating, their programs are great and I think they are not prone to big mistakes. I think that theirs spins and twizzles are weak, their lifts are not great but enough well and they have not falls like H/B.
    FD https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9XirgMk23zk&t=192s
    SD https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kA1LuO0QAS4
  14. Dobre

    Dobre Well-Known Member

    The Shibs, Chock & Bates, and Hubbell & Donahue.

    With the possible addition of Hawayek & Baker and McNamara & Carpenter.
    barbarafan likes this.
  15. chapis

    chapis Well-Known Member

    Well, that is my question, why are H/B superior to the Parsons?, definitely not at SS, and H/B have problems with lifts even leading to falls.
    What are the Parsons doing inferior to all the other teams?
    Example: they have better programs than H/D, they have better connection to each other (IMO) and SS than C/B (At least Rachel above Madison), their spins are inferior to C/B.

    I am really curious to know exactly what are their weakness respect to the other teams.
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2017
  16. chameleonster

    chameleonster Well-Known Member

    I doubt we'll see them on the Olympic team, those top three spots are probably already locked up, making the Olympics in your senior debut season would be difficult enough in a less competitive field. Even making the 4CC team will be extremely competitive, between the Parsons, M/C, H/B, and P/B. The fight for pewter and subsequently the 2018 4CC gold will be fierce. Each team has it's own strengths and weaknesses, so it'll be interesting to see.
    clairecloutier and Dobre like this.
  17. Dobre

    Dobre Well-Known Member

    Hence the "possible."

    Look, you can pick apart the weaknesses of each team; but IMO it's folly. It's folly to underestimate either of these two junior teams. They're too strong & they've competed too long against such steep competition both nationally & internationally. It's also folly to underestimate the challenge of climbing into the senior scene. They're going to have to fight for spots & compete in some very tough locations. We're going to have to wait. Wait to see the programs. To see how each team deals with the challenges of next year. I'd like to see all three teams--H&B, M&C, and the Parsons--go to 4CCs and battle it out like there's no tomorrow. I'd like to see them battle it out for the four years after that, with C&P and L&B joining the fight. And I'm sure P&B have no intention of being left out of it.

    If you are looking for the Parsons' weaknesses, they have had a few sets of unsynchronized twizzles this season (at the JGP in Japan & at Nationals). They've struggled for a long time with their performance quality, and I would say have just found a style this season. Their weakest performance over the past couple seasons was their FD at the JGPF last year. Perhaps you might like to watch it & see what you think.
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2017
    chapis likes this.
  18. levineismine

    levineismine Well-Known Member

    Since we are talking Juniors and Parsons, Jr Worlds are coming up this week. What are people looking forward to?
    I think the Parsons are favorite for gold but Loboda/Drozd could very well challenge them. McNamara/Carpenter had a disappointing season so far but that probably only motivates them to do well in Taipei. I'll be curious to see how close is the gap with Carreira/Ponomarenko- can they be a surprise bronze? - (he impressed me a lot live at the JGPF), and where do Lajoie/Lagha end up (also really impressed by them at Bavarian Open).
    JulieC, barbarafan and clairecloutier like this.
  19. princeton123

    princeton123 Well-Known Member

    Michael Parsons is crazy talented. Their blues pattern this year is one of my favorite ice dance elements in either the junior or senior ranks. It's hypnotizing to watch.
    semogal, levineismine and chapis like this.
  20. chameleonster

    chameleonster Well-Known Member

    H/B's most recent performance was kind of a train wreck, but they don't usually fall on their lifts. All teams have their bad days. Connection is somewhat subjective, and as for programs, well, we don't know what anyone will be skating to next season. This is the first season that I thought the Parsons have really found a style that really works for them.

    Of the four teams I see battling it out for the 4CC team, I would rate their strengths and weaknesses like this:

    Pogrebinsky/Benoit: Despite being relatively unknown when making their senior debut(only national bronzes and a JGP bronze, as well as a fourth place finish at JW) they still had a very smooth transition to seniors. They have good speed and power, which combined with their physical size makes it easy for them to really fill a rink and make a big visual impact. But they still have a good height difference that combined with her flexibility allows for some really stunning lifts, and her flexibility also is shown off in their spins. They seem to be steady competitors and really get into their performances. On the downside, they lack polish and can get a little flaily when they're throwing themselves into a program. Additionally, while their programs were fine for a debut season, i hope that their success has allowed them to get outside choreography. And of the four teams they have been together the shortest amount of time(only their third season together!).

    Hawayek/Baker: They're the most polished and elegant of the four, and have good speed and lightness across the ice. They're getting better at working around and even utilizing their small height difference to their advantage. They have already found a style(although they should try to avoid falling into a rut) and have very good flow. They also have a lot of experience and maturity at the senior level. On the downside, their small size means that they need to be just that much faster and more powerful than the other teams to make as much immediate impact, and that's something they still need to work on. They're going to struggle with having as impressive lifts as some other teams, so they need to find other ways around that(and preferably not fall on them).

    Parsons: They've been together awhile which helps their connection as a team, and seem to finally be finding a style as a team. They skate close together and have good edges and extension and flow. They have sometimes struggled with performance in the past but they have great vehicles this year. Being a sibling team does have its limitations but they've so far gotten around any ick factor. They're not as polished as H/B, but more so than P/B or M/C, and are more powerful than H/B(if less so than P/B or M/C). They also have a very small height difference, which would be even more noticeable if she had better posture.

    McNamara/Carpenter: They're very reminiscent of D/W in a lot of ways, they've been together since childhood(the longest partnership of the four), not the largest team(although larger than H/B and a better height difference than Parsons), a ton of speed and power and Drama. But they also have the wildness and messiness of early D/W, and are the least polished of the four. They've been a bit underwhelming this season but showed up to Nationals looking much more like themselves(except for the unfortunate fall). They could also stand to work on their posture.

    It's hard to say which teams will come out ahead because they're all very different. Making the transition to seniors is very difficult, but M/C and Parsons have a lot of talent. Its definitely going to be an interesting battle to watch.
  21. chapis

    chapis Well-Known Member

    Yes, that is what I noticed already too, they really need to work at their spins and twizzles. And indeed this is the first season that I enjoy their programs. Lifts can to get better too. And you are right, it will be fooly understimate to the Parsons and M/C, they will have some months to give a good impression to the judges and federation (they should to start early with the B competitions) and just imagine if they have a great performance at nationals and H/D having a fall like at this year nationals.

    About the junior worlds, I agree that P/P, M/C and L/D are the favorites. Rewatching to L/D I think they should have gone to senior this season, she has problems with posture and lines but not so severe like Stepanova.
    After see what the russian teams presented this season, the russian federation should give them priority above I/Z and K/S.
  22. levineismine

    levineismine Well-Known Member

    chameleonster likes this.
  23. Ka3sha

    Ka3sha Well-Known Member

    Agree that P/P, M/C and L/D are the favorites and I hope that Rachel and Michael will take the gold: I like their dances the most among these 3 teams and it looks like that had progressed a lot since last JWC (and I can't say the same about M/C and L/D).
    But I don't see Parsons making the Olympic team next year

    I saw Loboda/Drozd at Junior Nationals just a month ago and, to say the truth, I wasn't impressed with them (well, with Alla). He is already great but she is not on his level right now: her skating is significantly "heavier", she is also much slower and looked completely out of shape.
    I find two other young dance teams, Skoptsova/Aleshin and Polishyuk/Vakhnov, much more promising if we are speaking about long-term goals. S/A has the best unison among all other teams (and probably even some russian senior teams also pale in comparison) and P/V's Free Dance is just :swoon:
    Marta24 likes this.
  24. Marta24

    Marta24 Well-Known Member

    I also like Skoptsova/Aleshin a lot. They really impressed me with their skates at Nats and hope they keep improving. They only have one junior season left and have to move up with the start of the next Olympic cycle. It`s unfortunate that they don`t have much height difference between them, since that will make lifts harder for them, but other teams managed to get around that problem, too.
    Ka3sha likes this.
  25. chameleonster

    chameleonster Well-Known Member

    To be fair to Loboda, I believe she had been sick before Nationals and missed training time, which would account for her looking out of shape. He's the stronger partner, but she's usually in better shape than she was there.

    Junior worlds will definitely be interesting. It almost feels like there are two separate competitions going on, the Practically Senior top three, and everyone else. Parsons definitely look like the leaders, but L/D can definitely give them a run for their money. L/D are faster and more powerful, but are somewhat wild which makes them more prone to errors. M/C are the real wildcards of the event. They have all the skills needed to defend their title, but have been messy and inconsistent, and a late surge might not be enough if L/D and Parsons skate well. Of the other juniors, Carreira/Ponomarenko are the strongest and the ones most likely to benefit from mistakes from the top three, which is impressive for such a young team(both in terms of individual age and length of partnership). Abachkina/Thauron and Shpilevaya/Smirnov will battle it out for the top five, and it should be close. A/T are faster, more powerful, and skate bigger, which helped them defeat S/S at GPF. S/S also have a tendency to get excited and lose levels on the step sequences. But they have good skills and are very charismatic, and have a national title now. Its going to be a great competition.
  26. Ka3sha

    Ka3sha Well-Known Member

    After Nats they had two more competitions (Russian Cup Final and Moscow Championship, iirc) and they didn't look good there as well :(
  27. chapis

    chapis Well-Known Member

    I don´t think that her skating look heavier and she does not look slower than Skoptsova, but definitely she is a little out of shape, do you have a link to their last competition?. I am not impressed with S/A but P/V are really great.
    lauravvv likes this.
  28. Dobre

    Dobre Well-Known Member

    I hope so. The last two Junior Worlds dance events have been a pretty wild ride.

    Well, we have our bases covered with reactions to the junior Russian teams. I love Loboda & Drozd. I am not impressed with Polishchuk & Vakhnov yet; but I really like Skoptcova & Aleshin's blues this season. I think they have done a good job cutting out the busy stuff & clarifying their movement this year. I'm interested to see how S&A do at their first Junior Worlds.

    It's interesting that Loboda & Drozd have been so strong internationally this season & struggled in about three events inside Russia. I have every intention of rooting for them at senior nationals next season. (I apologize in advance to Alla & Pavel for whatever challenging karma this may thrust in their way). It's their fault for being oh-so-not-soft-&-flowy.

    I have hopes that McNamara & Carpenter and Loboda & Drozd can help drive some more drama & quirkiness into the senior ranks.
    lauravvv and chapis like this.
  29. Ka3sha

    Ka3sha Well-Known Member

    I wasn't impressed with S/A either but my opinion about them changed a lot after seeing them live, I didn't expect it at all but they looked very mature and, as I said earlier, skated with great unison.

    L/D's FD from Russian Cup Final (they lost TES to P/V)
    chapis likes this.
  30. chapis

    chapis Well-Known Member

    :(. What happened? they looked great at JGPF.