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Profile: Michelle Kwan

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Maofan7, Dec 29, 2012.

Would Michelle Kwan have likely won the 2002 Olympics if Frank Carroll remained coach

Poll closed Jan 29, 2013.
  1. Yes

    58 vote(s)
  2. No

    11 vote(s)
  3. Don't Know

    24 vote(s)
  1. skateboy

    skateboy Well-Known Member

    I almost voted "yes," but went with "I don't know." My personal feeling is that, as Jenny Kirk noted, Michelle put so much pressure on herself to be an Olympic Champion that it was most likely counter-productive (especially in 2002, I would think, where she may have felt she had something to prove). It's hard to know if Frank's input would have helped her confidence or not.

    Brian Boitano talked a lot about how he and Linda Leaver spent so much time mentally preparing for the Olympics, psychologically going through a "winning" scenario. He called it the "bubble" that they created and it obviously worked for him. Of course, not every champion prepares with such tactics, but does anyone know if Michelle ever worked that way? She had such a winning record at Nats and Worlds, maybe she didn't feel she needed something like that.
  2. Maofan7

    Maofan7 Member

    Although Karen Kwan's figure skating career was eclipsed by that of Michelle, Karen was a very good skater in her own right. Here are a few videos which bring that out:-

    U.S. Nationals 1995 (7th): Short Program

    U.S. Nationals 1996 (5th): Short Program, Free Skate

    U.S. Nationals 1997 (7th): Short Program, Free Skate

    Her best result internationally was a 3rd placed finish in the Nebelhorn Trophy in 1996
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2013
  3. query5

    query5 New Member

    whether she would /wouldn't i don't know--my reasons as to more no

    in 1998- under frank carroll-1) landed 7 jumps to tara 5-not going into that
    2) jumped higher than tara
    3) had higher artistry marks than tara in free program-
    4) michelle was better artisticly
    5)michelle made no major mistakes-she skated clean/interpreted program well,
    the only thing tara had over michelle was she skated a little faster -i can go into reason why her being so young as that helped her look prepubscent.
    so if the judges didn't give it to michelle over tara than-what makes people think she would have won in 2002 under frank -since frank criticzed her publicly along time, and publicly stated he was still upset over the 1980 mess with annett/linda. think of how frank gushed and help mirai, did he do that form michelle, i can't hardly think of time he did.
    the ogm for me is made up ahead of time by who the federation wants and who they think can sell better and who fits the usfsa image better.
    they screwed up with michelle kwan, and still are.
  4. UMBS Go Blue


    RunnersHigh and (deleted member) like this.
  5. falling_dance

    falling_dance Coaching Patrick

    Isn't this also the nine-year anniversary of her 2004 US Nats free skate?
  6. kwanatic

    kwanatic Well-Known Member

    ALL HAIL!! :encore: :cheer2: :encore:
  7. skatesindreams

    skatesindreams Well-Known Member


    How the years have flown.
    It seems like only yesterday!
  8. UMBS Go Blue


    EYS! :cheer2: :40beers:
  9. cbd1235

    cbd1235 Well-Known Member

    I will forever wish I could have been in that building 8 years ago
  10. UGG

    UGG Well-Known Member


    OMG OMG.

    I literally just almost fell on the floor. That seems like yesterday.
  11. RunnersHigh

    RunnersHigh Well-Known Member


    Funny and very sad because I'll post the similar replies in 9 or 15 years later. :wuzrobbed
  12. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

    Well, I feel old now.
  13. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

    LOL, and I remember the first time I watched her, at 1994 Junior Worlds, I was impressed...Yes, I feel old too !
  14. Maofan7

    Maofan7 Member

  15. Sparks

    Sparks Well-Known Member

    Thanks for this! I hadn't seen this before, and I thought I'd seen everything featuring the Kween. :)
    Maofan7 and (deleted member) like this.
  16. skatesindreams

    skatesindreams Well-Known Member

  17. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    It was really interesting to see Kwan talk about the Russian school of figure skating. A lot of her interviews don't really go into that much depth of the actual training and philosophies behind the sport, so it was nice to see that here.

    I was looking up Kwan youtube clips, and I found a very recent one of her and her sister, Karen, partaking in a dance class.


    Nice to see her in some sort of performance again.
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2013
  18. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    I always found the talk of Kwans so called decline before the Olympic season funny. In the 3 Worlds that quad before the 2001-2002 she went silver, gold, and gold, and she lost a grand total of 4 events in all those 3 years, coming 2nd at the other 4. She won back to back World titles, the only time in her career she would do so, and her 2000 and 2001 World winning LPs were her best skates ever when factoring in technical prowess. Her worst skates did not come close to matching her 97 Nationals or even 97 GPF skates in struggles. Her decline didnt begin until the Olympic season and AFTER she fired Frank and Lori. So if she doesnt win every single program, or some critics who are just looking for things to complain about or ways to introduce rivals nitpicked parts of her skating, that should be something to be paranoid about and just cause for major changes. Hello this isnt the 1920s and the Henie and Salchow no such thing as competitive skating era anymore.
  19. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    ^ And let's face, either of Slutskaya's or Kwan's 2002 World performances would have been good enough to win gold in SLC. Between the two, it just depends on who is on the judging panel and what they preferred because they were more or less similar in content to one another with Irina's performance showing off her strengths and Kwan's performance showing off her strengths.


    ^ Although I don't think the choreography matched up to say her 2001 Song of the Black Swan performance, I do think had she hit the 3/3 here, this could have been considered one of her best performances.
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2013
  20. shady82

    shady82 Active Member

    I was just watching her 2001 QR performance. Before she skated, the heel of her boot came off and she had to get it reglued on, with the boot being 1/8" higher than before. Considering how awkward that must be for jumping, she still skated brilliantly and landed 7 triples! It's situations like these that make her career so unbelievable.
  21. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    I'd never seen that Russian tv interview either ... interesting. MKF often has threads re rarely seen/ obscure MK photos. I wonder whether this particular interview was ever posted on MKF by the amazing Heather?

    BTW, MK was very gracious to pose with these two fans in Georgetown at Ben & Jerry's: :cool:

  22. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    My all-time favorite Kwan dress was the first Dream of Desdemona. It's my favorite short program costume of all time. The second one she wore was beautiful but the first was absolutely perfect.:swoon:

    For exhibition I loved her blue Dante's Prayer costume. There was something so elegant and classy about it. :swoon: Witt had a similar costume but the color, fit and cut were so much more flattering on the more petite Kwan.

    For long programs, the simple designs/lines for Red Violin and Lyra Angelica were divine.

    Funnily enough, I never liked Vera Wang's creations for Kwan, yet I loved the costumes she created for Kerrigan. Her Kerrigan designs were standouts, but her Kwan designs weren't anything to write home about.

    Post 1996, I only hated four of Kwan's costumes. The creamiscle 2001 worlds short , the original Lyra Angelica, the frumpy red Spartacus and the gold Bolero. The last two designs were extremely unflattering on her body type. I disliked her 98 Rach costume, too, but I didn't hate it.

    And I don't care what Frank says, I liked the Pocahontas costume. :D
  23. iarispiralllyof

    iarispiralllyof Active Member

    I thought MK under Vera was the most elegantly dressed skater of all time. Omg...the 2002 purple Rachmaninoff dress was sumptuous

    First of all that shade of purple is stunning, the bottom of the dress was made of more flowy material which looked good in motion, while the front had thousands of swarovski crystals sewn in a leaflike pattern down the front. soooooo elegant. i wonder why she never re-wears these costumes, she paid so much for them!

    the dresses she's been wearing at yuna's skating shows have been HORRIBLE. that purple cut out lady tarzan one was the epitome of hideous...the other ones she's been wearing are very basic glittery juniorish dresses. i wonder if it's cos she doesn't fit into those tiny tiny vera wang dresses anymore
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2013
  24. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    I too loved MK's Desdemona original sp dress, which beautifully suited the theme of the music. I think Vera Wang loves dressing Michelle and has done a fine job over the years (altho' there was a white skating dress once that seemed ill-fitting). In any case, Vera did an especially wonderful job creating MK's wedding dress:


    And, the below might be the red dress by Vera that MK reportedly wore during her wedding reception (altho' we never saw pics of her in it at the wedding reception). Might MK have shopped her closet (similar to another famous Michelle) for this Washington D.C. gala? Hmmm:

  25. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    The material and design is reminiscent of the Bolero costume. She looks stunning in red but that dress is ugly.
  26. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    I thought once Michelle started wearing Wang, she stopped standing out, costume wise. I can't think of one memorable costume Wang created for her, except Bolero and that was memorable for all the wrong reasons. I'll never forget the second Lyra costume, Desdemona, Salome, both Taj Majals, Dante's Prayer and Red Violin, though. She looked like a goddess in all those costumes. :swoon: Those were iconic costumes, imo. Who designed the second Lyra costume? Was that Mare Talbot? Is she still designing costumes? It may have been the most simple costume of all time but also the most lovely and just perfect for that program. :swoon:
  27. falling_dance

    falling_dance Coaching Patrick

    Marc Bouwer designed it. I agree that it was quite lovely.
  28. fenway2

    fenway2 Well-Known Member

    Some female skaters start wearing those longer dresses once they hit or approach 30, unless they're blessed with a naturally miniscule frame like Yamaguchi. I thought the white dress Kwan wore in Kim's show was lovely.


    I forgot to list Romanza as another terrific, standout pre-Wang costume. :swoon: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-GSMThMVYd...I/padw68fpqpA/s1600/michelle+kwan+romanza.jpg
  29. VIETgrlTerifa

    VIETgrlTerifa Well-Known Member

    Of her Vera Wang dresses, I thought her 2002 Rachmaninoff and Nationals Tosca dresses were incredible. I think her Aranjuez and The Feeling Begins (2003 Nationals and Worlds) were quite interesting as well. The first one was reminiscent of the way Pedro Almodovar costumed the matadors in the film Talk to Her while the latter had a very interesting back, one of the more interesting looks I've seen on a skating costume.

    Sometimes skating costumes can either look practice generic (think of plain sleeveless dresses with straps and sparkles) or really busy generic (think of those European ones where it looks like a cat had to claw its way out of a laundry basket with layers upon layers that ruin one's line). Some of Kwan's Wang designs weren't the most interesting, but I think for the most part, it looked different from what other people were wearing and utilized really interesting cuts you don't see often in skating.

    OT, but I still think Shizuka Arakawa's 2006 Olympic LP dress is one of the best looks ever. She just looked regal and like a champion. From a fashion standpoint, I loved Fumie's 2005 LP pants ensemble and 2006 Olympic LP dress.
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2013