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No surprise if Lysacek skips nationals

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sugar, Nov 21, 2012.

  1. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

    I think Johnny and Evan need to call it a career. Age and being away from the sport for too long is contributing to these injuries. Add the fact that neither has a quad and the level of jumps has risen since they last skated i think the writing is on the wall.
  2. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    I agree. I cant see Johnny even coming close to making a U.S World or Olympic team again, let alone being a factor internationally. Evan could possibly get on a major U.S team depending on a number of factors, but is it worth going through all this just to maybe get to a final World or Olympic and come in the top 10 if you are lucky.
  3. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    When you look at skaters like these (and may be others), it makes me appreciate what Plushenko accomplished at the 2010 Olympics, after being away from competitive skating for three and a half years, and narrowly missing the OGM.
  4. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    Very true. Safe to say we wont see anyone making a comeback at that age (27 or 28) just for the Olympic year and doing even close to that well again. Evan and Johnny certainly arent going to, if they even carry out their comebacks any further that is. What is more hilarious is people deriving of opinions on Plushenko's abilities based on not winning there, as if any other top skater of his era could return after over 3 years off in their late 20s and do anywhere near as well, and now we are seeing firm evidence other top skaters of his era clearly cant.
  5. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    ITA. I really miss the professional competitions. I don't care about the cheesefests they have on TV these days. In the 1980s and 1990s the skaters had a chance to develop their skating in other directions, and even compete. Although many of those competitions were mostly fixed, the skaters still had to perform at a certain level. Some skaters like Robin Cousins and Scott Hamilton brought a lot to the art of skating as pros. Paul Wylie really came into his own as an artist after his 1992 Olympic silver medal. Yamaguchi and Boitano motivated themselves to continue doing the difficult jumps even as pros, while they developed their artistry. It's a shame that skaters like Evan and Johnny don't have that option, and they have to consider coming back to eligible skating, while the sport has passed them by.
  6. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    The cheesefests are terrible. They are appropriately named, that is all they are is the big cheese. They desperately need to bring the pro circuit back somehow. The skaters deserve it and so do the fans.
  7. Lacey

    Lacey Well-Known Member

    I agree, RIP.
  8. judiz

    judiz Well-Known Member

    Totally agree, hopefully someone will restart Champions on Ice which I thought was so much better than SOI. BUT, I have to admit I enjoyed watching the Cheesefests just because it gave me the chance to see most of my favorite skaters in the same show.
  9. love_skate2011

    love_skate2011 Well-Known Member

    well Plushenko is an exception to every rule
  10. museksk8r

    museksk8r Holding an edge and looking dangerously sexy

    Too bad the World Pro Championships, World Team Trophy, Masters of Figure Skating, US Open, and Canadian Open are no longer around.
    Vash01 and (deleted member) like this.
  11. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    I too liked COI much better than SOI. However, I hate cheesefests, regardless of who is in it. They have degraded figure skating as a sport and as an art. No wonder Michelle did not want to have anything to do with them. I would rather RIP the cheesefests and resurrect the pro competitions, but who is going to do that?

    P.S. The world team trophy was essentially a cheesefest, under a respectable name. The results were so ridiculous that it was hard to take it seriously. The Landover pro competitions produced some great skating and great opportunities for skaters to have a career after the Olympics. That's the one I miss the most.
  12. falling_dance

    falling_dance Coaching Patrick

    Are you referring to this competition?
  13. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    No. World team challenge was actually quite good. It produced some really good performances. I was referring to the World team trophy which took place only a couple of times, IIRC, sometime after 2003.
  14. carriecmu0503

    carriecmu0503 Active Member

    The WTT first took place in 2009. It was scheduled to take place in 2011, but the tsunami caused it to be delayed to 2012. This event is scheduled to again take place in 2013, I believe. This event is meant to occur every other year. Additionally, it was this event that inspired the creation of a team event at the Olympics.
  15. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    It seems I completely misunderstood the world team trophy. I confused it with another competition starting with 'world'. Now I remember that they had the WTT after the Tsunami in Japan, and that was quite recent. I will have to look at my old tapes to see what exactly that particular competition was.
  16. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

    Was it US against the world?
  17. ZuZu

    ZuZu Guest

    Well, I wish him all the best, health-wise and so, but truly, the poor guy is by far the last skater I want to "come back"!!! :yikes: :scream: :shuffle:
    flutzilla1 and (deleted member) like this.
  18. museksk8r

    museksk8r Holding an edge and looking dangerously sexy

    Yes, that's the one! I didn't mean to say World Team Trophy as that is an eligible competition. So many of these events sound alike. :p

    Speaking of team pro competitions, I was never too fond of the concept behind Ice Wars. The idea of USA vs. the World always seemed foolish to me because the "World" team consisted of multiple nations while the US was just one nation. It was almost as if to say that the USA is separate from the rest of the world or that the USA is just a narcissistic nation that is incapable of being team players with other nations. I did like seeing skaters come back to compete who we haven't seen in a long time though, like Jill Trenary.
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2012
  19. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    Definitely not this one.
  20. Cherub721

    Cherub721 YEAH!

    I always thought it was supposed to be saying that the US was so good that the best US skaters could compete with all the best skaters in the entire world.

    Vash, is this the competition you meant: http://www.goldenskate.com/figure-s...world-team-figure-skating-championships/#2003

    I would love a serious pro circuit. Wasn't Hamilton supposed to be doing something with the ISU? (Thank God that didn't happen). Getting back on topic, I think if Lysacek could compete on a legit pro circuit that aired on prime time TV, he would not be trying to come back. Sometimes I wonder if Boitano and Hamilton have so many fans because of their Olympic accomplishments or because of how they skated in endless pro/pro am events over 10-20 years. I don't even think most casual viewers know or care about the differences between those events and eligible skating, so Lysacek winning a cheesefest would probably get him just as much respect as winning a Grand Prix.

    I am surprised Averbukh hasn't put something together in Russia, considering their large pool of recently retired pros with big titles who are in good shape. I'm not talking a reality show but a one-off competition that includes foreign skaters and has pairs and ice dance titles.
    Vash01 and (deleted member) like this.
  21. aftershocks

    aftershocks Well-Known Member

    I wish someone with bucks and influence would get behind a professional tour for the veterans who still desire to compete, including Evan, Johnny, Lambiel, Plushenko, Buttle and others like Lindemann, Van der Perren, Honda, et al.
  22. judiz

    judiz Well-Known Member

    I totally agree!
  23. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    Going back to my original post (calling it a cheesefest): I meant the first one in that list- World team challenge (2003). This one was meaningless.

    Most of the others on that list had a different name. Most of them had produced some good performances, except for the pairs competition in one (when the Wirtzes beat K&D). The older the competition the better the performances, as a rule of thumb. They seemed to take them more seriously, and less of a 'show'- JMO.

    One problem with these competitions was that they had the same 3 or 4 skaters repeating their programs. They needed a much larger field to be appealing.

    In any case, I agree with you that if there were some respectable pro competitions/circuits, skaters like Lysacek would not try to come back because they would have an avenue to develop their art.

    Does Japan have something like a pro circuit/competitions? They would be limited to singles, however.

    I did not care for Ice Wars; it seemed too cheesy, but when I compare it with what they are showing now, I would even accept Ice wars type competitions, but with more skaters, not just 3 or 4. If there are sponsors for cheesefests, why is it difficult to find sponsors for serious skating? I have nearly stopped watching show skating and silly competitions.
  24. paskatefan

    paskatefan Well-Known Member

    ITA with everything you've both said here!
  25. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

    I would love to see Evan compete again, but he shouldn't if it's going to cause a lot of injuries. He already has the OGM - enjoy it, don't kill yourself. If he comes back and places 6th, so what. I think a lot of fans enjoyed Katarina's return to competition where she placed 8th in Olys. It was a great performance. There seems to be a rumor (probably started by Lipinski) that you will "tarnish" your gold by continuing to compete. I don't think so. A gold is a gold, no matter what happens afterwards. Is Kat any less of a 2-time gold medalist? No. But I definitely would not want to see Evan get injured.
  26. Dufusyte

    Dufusyte New Member

    Olympians come back because they love going to the Olympics. The US Men's field is weak, and Evan and Johnny have a chance to get a ticket to the greatest sports event on earth (Olympics), so they're going for it. For them, it is not about winning; it's about the Olympic experience. They have a chance to relive it one more time, and they are going for it. Same motivation for most OGMists of any sport who return for another Olympics.

    Interest in figure skating is so low that networks barely televise the major events. It's just not profitable. Same goes for live ice shows: attendance is low. It's not feasible to host Pro competitions for the same reason: no interest = no money.

    And why is there no interest in skating these days? Could be the sport has lost its way. Could be the new scoring system and the kind of skating it encourages. The emphasis is no longer on artistic performances, but on technical jumping. If a man does not have a quad, he is out. Beautiful skaters who cannot do the hard jumps (S. Cohen, A. Czisny) are marginalized in the sport. I would rather watch Czisny spin once than watch Una-K rotate 100x in the air.

    Figure Skating has become more of a sport than an art form, and that is why no one watches it anymore.
  27. NadineWhite

    NadineWhite Well-Known Member

    It's too bad Evan's comeback has been derailed by injury. :( But not surprised. However, I really wanted him to come back in order for the US to gain 3 spots at the Olympics. Say what you will, but Evan knows how to land on the podium, and he's consistent.

    Without him, I don't see the US getting those 3 spots unfortunately, not with the inconsistent Jeremy Abbott and whomever is lucky enough to accompany him.

    Ah well, sigh, you win some you lose some. :)
  28. Carolla5501

    Carolla5501 Well-Known Member

    Hmm... and it's back to where it was before the "whack heard round the world" Honestly, there are a lot of other things in play here besides "the new scoring system" that everyone loves to blame, (I mean the Salt Lake fiasco turned off a lot of folks who still think this thing is 'fixed')

    FS had several years of false popularity based on "personality" and "Drama" Now we have neither. Especially in the US. I love a lot of our skaters, but they aren't going to "sell" this sport to the general public. The fact that NBC resorted to those cheese "WEIR IS BACK" promos is evidence of that....(And that didn't work out well for them LOL!)

    For all the "hate" on here for Scott Hamilton... he managed to do a lot by "selling". SOI did fine until he finally had to retire, without that 'personality' it died.

    The US needs a star. There's a LOT more interest in skating in Japan where they have the same "judging system" you want to blame. But... they have stars.

    Yeah, Evan is a competitor. He comes, delivers what he plans and puts it out there. He has that inner "steel" that I think a LOT of US skaters are missing (Abbott, Cziny etc...) They can deliver in practice but not when it's time to deliver.
  29. Sylvia

    Sylvia Prepping for club comp. season!

  30. Iceman

    Iceman Well-Known Member

    Hyperbaric Oxygen therapy.