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Lance Armstrong used performance enhancing drugs? Behold our shock!

Discussion in 'Other Sports' started by Theatregirl1122, Jan 18, 2013.

  1. heckles

    heckles Well-Known Member

    I wondered about that as well. Did he give Oprah a time frame for his doping? I watched both interviews and don't recall his disclosing the years that he started and/or ended the doping. He had cancer in 1996, and Betsy Andreu alleged that he was doping before then. If he was doping all the way until his retirement from cycling in 2011, one has to wonder what additional health issues he's going to encounter.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2013
  2. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

    That I agree with. I think health professionals who work with cancer patients should understand that while positivity is good and can be helpful in coping, forcing it on patients isn't the way to go; people shouldn't be made to feel as though they owe it to themselves or to others to remain positive and upbeat at all times, or as though there is no room for them to express other emotions. That's not a healthy form of emotional regulation for anyone.

    If I had to sum up - I think the message should be that in most cases, this is not a death sentence, but that it doesn't mean that the experience of dealing with cancer isn't a difficult one or that the various emotions experiences by those dealing with it aren't appropriate. I'm sorry you were made to feel that way, made_in_canada, and I hope you're doing well now.

    As I said earlier, I feel uncomfortable with that specific allegation made by the Andreus, due to the circumstances around it; that they told it under oath in court is fine, but sharing the story beyond that was not, IMO. For me, the main thing is that Armstrong says he doped in every TdF win and before that too - I don't particularly care about the details or each specific incident. I understand why other people, and specifically the Andreus, would feel differently, but I disagree that they are owed confirmation of every detail they have shared. They are certainly owed an apology, of course, and possible financial compensation. Emma O'Reilly does, too. And others.

    Regarding the possible link between Armstrong's earlier doping and his testicular cancer, there are a number of risk factors for testicular cancer (apparently regular marijuana use is one), and while it's not common, my understanding is that it actually is one of the most common cancers in younger men. Also, presumably most riders of Armstrong's era were doping, and we haven't seen all that many adverse outcomes that I'm aware of. I hope we won't. Even if people take risks with their health - and there are many such risks, not just doping - I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
  3. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

    IIRC, it's epo that is linked to testicular cancer, non?
  4. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

    But if it were that much of a risk factor, wouldn't there be a lot more cases among athletes in various sports?

    IIRC, at some point in the cycling thread I asked whether EPO can be used in the treatment of cancer patients, and someone answered that it was indeed used in some cases.
  5. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    It's their fault they died!

    Barbara Ehrenreich "Smile Or Die: The Tyranny of Positive Thinking"
  6. heckles

    heckles Well-Known Member

    Weird, it looks like that's the UK version of Ehrenreich's book, Bright-Sided: How Positive Thinking Is Undermining America. Similar release dates and subject matter. Did not know there were two versions. Bright-Sided is very entertaining, especially when the author describes her battle with breast cancer and how women with that disease tend to be trivialized with Susan G. Komen gift bags stuffed with pink crayons and teddy bears.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2013
  7. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    Yes, it's the same book.
  8. heckles

    heckles Well-Known Member

    I don't care much about specific events beyond the TdF wins and 2000 Olympics, but I'm interested in the time frame from a medical perspective. His testosterone usage is surprising, as many would assume that would be contraindicated not only for Armstrong's cancer risk, but because it would create bulk that would not be useful in his sport, especially bulk in the thighs. Armstrong, like most other cyclists who admitted to doping, wasn't particularly "ripped", so that seems odd.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2013
  9. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

    I agree that this is a deeply silly way of trying to help cancer patients. OTOH, at least for breast cancer patients there are a lot of available resources, support and information (ETA: in some countries). That's not always the case when someone has/is at risk for a less common type of cancer.

    I don't really know enough about the biochemistry of it - maybe it's a matter of dosage/frequency of use?
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2013
  10. Buzz

    Buzz Well-Known Member

  11. AJ Skatefan

    AJ Skatefan Well-Known Member

    This^ I have a friend who had breast cancer. From what I saw she always seemed to be a positive person who lived a healthy lifestyle. She somehow managed to feel guilty for getting cancer. She said it was because she stifled her emotions and had bad thoughts. WTF? She'd read all these alternative healing books and somehow concluded that it was her fault.
  12. judgejudy27

    judgejudy27 Well-Known Member

    I hope somehow he ends up going to jail. It is certainly what he deserves. He deserves to go to jail 1000x more than Marion Jones who actually served some prison time.
  13. made_in_canada

    made_in_canada INTJ

    Found this article which sums up the fallout from his confession pretty well.
  14. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, T&M, Shibs, P&C

    Armstrong said at one point during the interview that other athletes who took drugs get only a 6 months ban before they were allowed to compete again, but he got a "death sentence". When you consider how long he lied, throughout his 7 Tour de France championships, and how many people he ruined along the way by bullying them and suing them, his transgressions are much more serious than those of the other athletes who got caught doping.

    Plus, as Anderson said, he did not get a "death sentence". He cannot compete, that's all.

    Armstrong is the epitome (sp?) of arrogance.

    He is going to live a luxurious life- not just a comfortable one-, even if he pays everyone that sued him.
  15. Zemgirl

    Zemgirl Well-Known Member

    Frankie Andreu answered some questions for VeloNews - a really classy interview.

    I think he means death sentence in the sports sense - like the "death penalty" SMU got in college football back in the 1980s. Being a Texan, he's probably well familiar with that scandal.

    FWIW, there are people who doped and covered it up for as long as Armstrong did and indeed received lesser punishments. The difference being their willingness to cooperate with investigators eventually. And I think Floyd Landis soliciting donations to fund his defense against his doping ban was as bad as some of what Armstrong did.
  16. Cachoo

    Cachoo Well-Known Member

    The higher the climb the harder the fall.
  17. bmcg

    bmcg Well-Known Member

    You would think a cancer survivor would have a little more perspective about death sentences (even in the sports sense).
  18. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

    Hello WADA, hello USADA,
    Here I am doing nada
    Life isn’t entertaining
    and they say shut up and stop complaining.

    You remember David Millar
    He crashed into a pillar
    You remember all the winners
    They all got poisoning last night after dinner.

    All the lawyers hate the bikers
    And they say we all are pikers
    And the lab tech says something’s missin’
    He’s been handing me a cup to piss in.

    Now I don't want this should scare ya
    Come on and test me, come on, I dare ya.
    You remember Floyd Landis
    You should see where his hand is.

    Take me home, oh WADA USADA, take me home, I hate doin’ nada
    Don't leave me out in the cold where life is rotten.
    Take me home, I promise I will not make noise or shoot up Clear with
    other boys, oh please don't make me stay, I've been here one whole day.

    Dearest USADA, darling WADA,
    Please call me on my home numbah
    Let me come home if ya miss me
    I will even let Betsy Andreu hug and kiss me.

    Wait a minute, I admit I’ve been doping,
    Turns out I’m the dope that I’ve been roping,
    Without me, cycling’s been getting better,
    WADA USADA kindly disregard this letter.

  19. my little pony

    my little pony war crawling into canada

    assuming he's have to do it drug free from now on, would he really still be competing w/o the ban?
  20. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

    Marion Jones didn't go to jail for doping. She was convicted of cheque fraud.
  21. 4rkidz

    4rkidz plotting, planning and travelling

    Lance is a narcassist and a bully.. I have been involved a little in the cycling world and was ironically involved in the world cycling championships here in canada with the anti doping.. and it was then I had my eyes opened to the realities of elite cycling.. they ALL do it!! The winner of one of the races - may have been the time trial - British guy Miller - failed his doping.. the Canadian girl - failed her doping.. then I observed first hand juniors informing us about blood transfusions etc., It reminds me of the sprinters - the Ben Johnson era - where they were ALL doing it.. Maybe some good will come from this and for once the mess gets cleaned up.. the coaches who allow and encourage this should be banned for life.. and bullies like Armstrong should never again be allowed to compete in an Olympic sport.. IMHO..
  22. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    Finally got to watch the interview. I think Oprah did an excellent job of it.

    I am with those who think the worst thing Armstrong did was to sue the people who had accused him of doping. This whole thing about defending to the hilt was just unacceptable behaviour. It was interesting he didn't make any comment about David Walsh, the journalist who had been saying for so many years that Armstrong was a drug cheat.

    For him to say that he has received a "death penalty" with regards to not being able to compete again is just a load of BS.
  23. Scintillation

    Scintillation New Member

    Yeah his behavior in the interview pretty much coincided with his characterization in the report that came out last summer. He bullied his teammates in to doping, he bullied other riders if they dared to speak up about the corrupted cycling culture, and he became outlandishly offended if anyone dared suggest he was doping too. As others have said, it's not so much that he doped. He was and still is a giant asshole.
  24. overedge

    overedge Janny uber

    Funny, I was just thinking last night whether Armstrong confessing would lead to Carl Lewis confessing. Another one who claimed that he was the only clean athlete in the sport, and everyone around him was doping like crazy to keep up with his great natural talent etc. etc.
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2013
  25. heckles

    heckles Well-Known Member

    Can he be a sanctioned coach and/or official?
  26. 4rkidz

    4rkidz plotting, planning and travelling

    who the hell would want him ;)
  27. BittyBug

    BittyBug And the band played on

    She was convicted of perjury, not check fraud.
  28. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member


    There was cheque fraud in there somewhere as well wasn't there? :slinkaway
  29. Erin

    Erin Well-Known Member

    Thanks for sharing - I agree that it was a classy interview. He did a good job of conveying that there is still some anger towards Lance without coming across as bitter and if anything, was overly fair in a number of his comments towards Lance. Pretty remarkable, considering the way Lance treated the Andreus.
  30. sequins

    sequins Active Member

    Oh I am waitin' for that day. I feel like the U.S. puts him on a pedastal and I know what Ben Johnson did was wrong, and I have no sympathy for the choices he made but he was annihilated by the media, by Canada and I don't believe for a second Carl Lewis was any better, just didn't get caught. While I don't know if you can trust what Ben says I just remember him saying in an interview years later that he knew for a fact everyone that started on the line with him that day, except for one individual who he wasn't sure of, that all of them were doping. Fess up Carl.

    As for Armstrong, never been a fan and always believed he was doping. He's also an ass, what a jerk. It's like he still doesn't get it.