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Is it physically possible to land a clean quadruple axel in competition?

Discussion in 'The Trash Can' started by Maofan7, Jan 31, 2013.

By which date will a clean 4A be successfully landed in competition?

Poll closed Mar 3, 2013.
  1. By 2015

    7 vote(s)
  2. By 2020

    17 vote(s)
  3. By 2030

    10 vote(s)
  4. By 2040

    2 vote(s)
  5. By 2050

    1 vote(s)
  6. Sometime beyond 2050

    0 vote(s)
  7. Never - its not humanly possible

    29 vote(s)
  1. lakewood

    lakewood Active Member

    Someone with Michael Jordan jump ability may do it?
  2. skateboy

    skateboy Well-Known Member

    I've often wondered if, at some point, skates will be made with springs to make more rotations more possible.
    Maofan7 and (deleted member) like this.
  3. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    Yes (well other than for the 4A part because I don't think anybody will land it ever - unless there's some serious technological advances).

    And not just in skating but in life in general.

    And I don't just think. I can safely say that I know because we have a lot of psychological and sociological research to prove this is the case.
  4. briancoogaert

    briancoogaert Well-Known Member

    I don't know about racism, but for sure, in Figure Skating, money is a key that puts off some athletes.
  5. Rock2

    Rock2 Well-Known Member

    I agree it will be a man's version of Ito. She finished her 3A pretty high so it looked like there was room for another almost half rotation. So I can see a man getting there.
    However, I would see this NOT coming from a top skater, but rather from someone lower down who decides to put this in his bag as a trick shot just to maybe get to worlds because he has such great axel technique. Would be real hard to train all the other triples and quads and get your levels AND add this and not kill yourself.

    It would be someone with this rare ability who has little else to offer and therefore sees the risk as worth it.
  6. ballettmaus

    ballettmaus Well-Known Member

    It's a tough call for me. Since ice is a hard surface and doesn't really give a bounce and aide with jumping, I'd say it all comes down to whether someone can develop enough force to hurl himself high enough into the air to complete the revolutions. Hard to tell because I have no idea how much room skaters have lef in regards to force when it comes to a 3axel.
    The question, I guess, is also what it does to a skaters health, how likely it is to succeed and if a skater considers the risks worth it.
  7. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    I love how people say it has to be the male version of Ito to get that jump. I think that is a great compliment to Ito and the respect she has amongst skating fans.
  8. Screenie

    Screenie Active Member

    Ryan Bradley's video above is a triple axel not a quad.
    The other skater is Keegan Messing and it's a quad attempt that's about 1/2 turn underrotated.

    I voted for by 2040 as I think it will take some boot improvements and those will take a while.
  9. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

    There are quite a few different lighter blades now, almost every company is making a light version. (The biggest advantage is they hold a sharpening for WAY longer, at least to me where the weight doesn't matter.)

    Do many men wear Edeas? Those boots are much lighter than standard boots.

    I have a friend who is a long distance backpacker with 'ultra light' philosophy- she trims her shoelaces to the shortest possible length they can still tie, even cuts her hair before she goes. No extra weight at all. Would have to remove all the crystals from a skating costume- they weigh you down quite a bit.
  10. Moka-Ananas

    Moka-Ananas Man's Ruin

    I remember an interview with Andrei Griazev who, btw., had an exquisite triple axel and in which he said that he would love to do a quad axel and was thinking about practising it. No idea if he actually did.
    And I think I have seen an off-ice video of Sergei Dobrin trying to do a quad axel on the floor.
  11. johndockley92

    johndockley92 New Member

    I don't think lighter boots would be the route to go, a skater doing a 4A would likely need a sturdier boot that was therefore heavier. Don't wanna break any ankles.
  12. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

    I was just continuing the thought brought up by this quote
    I agree that a lighter boot is necessary- but it cannot be a less supportive boot. Heavy materials aren't necessarily better than light ones- it is all about the technology used. It is possible the technology to make fully supportive light weight boots for quad axels doesn't exist yet.
  13. crzesk8dad

    crzesk8dad Well-Known Member

    It will be done by Max Aaron, in January 2015. :cool:
  14. gkelly

    gkelly Well-Known Member

    Or just move skating competitions to someplace with lower gravity. I think that's more likely to happen sooner than significant genetic mutations, but probably not by 2050.

    Artificially reduced gravity?

    Ice rinks with some springy surface beneath the ice, or specially formulated ice that has springy properties of its own?

    Unlikely to become standard in all training rinks everywhere, considering that figure skating rarely pays the bills for standard ice rinks and hockey/public skating (nor speedskating or curling, which don't pay the bills either) wouldn't need the spring (or the lower gravity).

    Yeah. And also some technology in the skate itself that facilitates higher jumping?
  15. arakwafan2006

    arakwafan2006 Well-Known Member

    I wonder if Yuzuru Hanyu could?
  16. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

    It will be done, and the skater who does it will receive positive GoE for licking his elbow in midair. ;)
  17. leafygreens

    leafygreens Well-Known Member

    Are 7 revolution jumps physically possible? Where do you draw the line.

    Wouldn't this be like swimmers using and then being banned from using the full length pants? (cheating)
  18. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

    It depends where the governing body draws the line. It could be likened to clap skates becoming available for speed skaters- and almost (all?) every speed skater switching to them. When they started becoming popular, many people though clap skates should be illegal, but the ISU didn't, and they have advanced speed skating.
  19. lala

    lala Well-Known Member

    I think, it's possible.
  20. tonyahardly

    tonyahardly Banned Member

    Tonya Harding did a clean Quad Loop in practice back in 1991. Unfortunately there is no known footage of this.
  21. Aussie Willy

    Aussie Willy Hates both vegemite and peanut butter

    I would give them more points if they could lick their butt when doing it.
  22. midori

    midori Well-Known Member

    I think it is possible. The key is a field of talent. If figure skating gets really popular and a LOT of children, as many as baseball or football, engage competitive figure skating, I think it will happen pretty soon.
  23. RickInSanJose

    RickInSanJose Active Member

    I think off-ice weight training will be the key here. Mao, as of 2010, was said to be performing barbell back squats with 50 kilos. If, over time, she could up that to 100 kilos, who knows what she'd be capable of in terms of jumping. (Kristi Yamaguchi did squats with 102.5 kilos in preparation for the 1992 Olympics, so this is obviously possible.)

    Heavy back squats, then, together with explosive exercises like power cleans and power snatches, and perhaps some plymometric jumping, would certainly increase any skater's vertical jump height, and time in the air.

    So, for the 4A, if one day a female skater builds up to a single 140-150 kilo squat, and a male skater up to a single 180-190 kilo squat, then the jump might be cleanly landed.
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2013
  24. maatTheViking

    maatTheViking Danish Ice Dance! Go Laurence & Nikolaj!

    I have always wondered about not only the crystals, but the amount of necklace charms some skaters wear. I don't know how they will not be a distraction and extra weight.

    For the 4a, I think a lot f things are possible - both the talent pool, equipment, modern training methods are essential. Look at a guy like Usian Bolt or Micheal Phelps, who are so extraordinary in their fields.

    I wonder if the talent pool will not be the real limiting factor - but what could a Dick Button have done with today's boots and training methods?