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Gunman at Fort Lauderdale airport kills 5, injures 8

Discussion in 'Off The Beaten Track' started by Vash01, Jan 6, 2017.

  1. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, Russian ladies

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    This is breaking news and we may not have all the details, but so far it is known that a gunman opened fire in the baggage claim area at Fort Lauderdale airport in Florida. Five were dead and 8 were injured. The gunman was captured and was not injured.

    http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...d-airport-shooting-gunman-idd-esteban-n704001

    He had flown in from Canada according to NBC, and Alaska according to CNN. Clearly a lot of information is missing.

    There is no safe place anymore. People are not allowed to carry weapons on board, but this man recovered his gun in the baggage claim area and started shooting randomly.

    My heart goes out to the innocent people and their families. :(
     
  2. AxelAnnie

    AxelAnnie Well-Known Member

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    I saw it online. I am just astounded and so saddened. What the heck is wrong with people that they think it is ok to just run around murdering people. It certainly is terrorism (not the kind from the Middle East). Those poor people who were in the area were certainly terrorized, to say nothing of the families of those killed and the people injured.
     
  3. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, Russian ladies

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    There is domestic terrorism.
     
  4. oleada

    oleada Well-Known Member

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    I'm sorry for the victim and their families.
    Unless we do something about the gun problem in this country, this unfortunately will keep happening.
     
  5. skatesindreams

    skatesindreams Well-Known Member

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    My sympathy to the victims, their families; and all affected by this tragedy.

    It has been reported that the assailant recently left the military.
     
  6. Vash01

    Vash01 Fan of Yuzuru, Medvedeva, Russian ladies

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    I am wondering if this may be a case of PTSD? The killer didn't try to run away. He wasn't carrying extra ammunition. When the bullets were exhausted, he stopped shooting and just lay down on the floor, where he was captured, based on my first read of the article.
     
  7. Buzz

    Buzz Well-Known Member

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    Nowhere is safe anymore. My heart and prayers goes out to the victims and their families.
     
    alexikeguchi, paskatefan and Vash01 like this.
  8. AxelAnnie

    AxelAnnie Well-Known Member

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    The problem is not the guns. The problem is that people think they have the right to murder other people. There are millions of people who have guns and act responsibly. The gun is an inanimate object. The gun did not murder and maim those people, Esteban Santiago did. It is a tragedy to be sure.

    Washington Post
    The problem, in my opinion, is that somewhere between his being AWOL at the Alaska National Guard, and the visit to the FBI office, there should be a mechanism in place to get this man the help he obviously needed.
    As a society we have removed and blurred the means of treating sick and dangerous people in the name of privacy and personal freedom. I think we need to swing back a little way.
     
    paskatefan likes this.
  9. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

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    The problem is people like you who don't think guns are a problem.
     
  10. AxelAnnie

    AxelAnnie Well-Known Member

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    Or people like you who are busy fixing the sink when it is the refrigerator that is broken.
     
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  11. ballettmaus

    ballettmaus Well-Known Member

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    In this case it actually sounds as if, as a member of the military, he would have had a gun one way or the other and that a lack of psychological care might have been the root of the problem.

    My sympathies to all the families of the victims. I hope all of the injured ones pull through!
     
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  12. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

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    Is it not possible to fix both? I know that fixing the sink would be the priority for me in any case.
     
  13. oleada

    oleada Well-Known Member

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    Except that easy access to guns makes murder easier and it's no coincidence that the United States has such high rates of gun violence compared to other developed countries.
     
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  14. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

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    Now, now. Don't be bringing logic into this debate to try and take people's right to maim and kill each other away.
     
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  15. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

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    He was in the military and had a permit. He seems to have mental health problems following his tour in Iraq. These may or may not have been apparent enough to warrant taking his weapon away, too early to tell.

    But don't let that stop you from the usual knee jerk reaction.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
    fan likes this.
  16. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

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    So the families of the victims should just suck it up because they were killed by a mentally unstable war veteran? I'll go with my kneejerk reaction that U.S. gun laws and the people who support them are dumb, thanks.
     
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  17. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

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    You are a disgusting person for saying that. And strictly operated by knee jerks, as previously mentioned.
     
  18. Japanfan

    Japanfan Well-Known Member

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    In his film 'Bowling for Colombine' Michael Moore pointed out that there actually a lot more guns per capita in Canada than in the US (presumably a lot of those are for people who hunt). But, our incidence of death by gun violence and massacres/shoot-outs are much lower than that in the US.

    So, it is not the presence of guns alone than can account for gun violence in the US.
     
  19. oleada

    oleada Well-Known Member

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    I think it's clear they were apparent:

    https://www.apnews.com/83be82c922c4...rested-in-airport-shooting;-5-dead,-8-wounded

    Yet he was allowed to have a gun and fly with it.

    (And yes, I am completely aware that the mentally ill are more at risk of being victims of violence than being perpetrators of it; and that access to mental health in general is difficult, but that doesn't change my point that getting guns is way too easy in this country)
     
  20. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

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    What's his diagnosis, Dr. oleada? Should we tell the FBI that you have solved the case and they should stop wasting valuable time and resources?
    ETA: I didn't know this

    That's an interesting point.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
  21. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

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    I'm not the one making excuses for gun violence in an "Oops whatcha gonna do about it?" way....
     
  22. Twilight1

    Twilight1 Well-Known Member

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    Thoughts with the families and friends. So sad. :(
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
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  23. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

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    Also crass and hypocritical, with no impulse control. These are desirable traits in politics these days, try running for an office.
     
  24. once_upon

    once_upon weary

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    One of the dead, was from the city I grew up in. His wife is one of the injured. They were on vacation.

    The swimming and diving team from the university were in the airport.

    I really don't get the gun mentality. You want guns to hunt, game or fowl, I would think that is OK. There is zero need for hand guns especially in travels.
     
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  25. ballettmaus

    ballettmaus Well-Known Member

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    I think this was completely uncalled for. The FBI put him into a psychiatric facility for evaluation. The least that they should have done is flag his name and suspend his gun license for the time being or something along those lines. A man who was under evaluation for a mental health issue should not have been allowed to legally carry a gun anywhere.
    I don't know how these sort of things work in the US but in Germany, unless you're a threat to yourself or others, they cannot force you to stay in a psychiatric facility. So, even if a person is released, they still can have a mental health problem.
     
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  26. mag

    mag Well-Known Member

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    According to Wikipedia this in incorrect. Not that it is surprising that Moore has played fast and lose with the facts. Anyway, according to Wikipedia the USA has an estimated 112.6 guns per 100 residents and is the number 1 gun owning country. Canada has an estimated 30.8 guns per 100 residents and ranks number 12.

    Here is an article with slightly different numbers, but still showing the US has a much higher rate of gun ownership. http://globalnews.ca/news/1354803/f...canada-have-more-guns-per-capita-than-the-us/
     
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  27. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

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    I don't know exactly what went on. I haven't read his chart. As of last night's presser, the FBI had ruled nothing out, including terrorism.
     
  28. ballettmaus

    ballettmaus Well-Known Member

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    Isn't that a separate issue? Isn't the actual issue that he was exhibiting signs of a mental health problem and maybe shouldn't have been permitted to carry a gun? The incident that he walked into the FBI office happened in November. That's just a little over two months ago, maybe not even, depending on when exactly in November it happened.
    There's the chance he has an actual mental health problem, there's also the possibility that he was faking it for one reason or the other. Either way, I'd say that he should not have been allowed to legally carry a gun only two months after the first incident.
     
    oleada likes this.
  29. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

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    That's the key word there. Maybe he met whatever threshold they have for taking away his weapon and someone seriously dropped the ball, maybe he had not. OTOH, his actions at the time of the attack seemed methodical, not chaotic. Lots of questions remain.
     
  30. allezfred

    allezfred Master/Mistress of Sneer Staff Member

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