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Frank Carroll new student...

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by inthemiddle, Apr 16, 2010.

  1. Skittl1321

    Skittl1321 Well-Known Member

    I think the issue is more that the top skaters often have "non-compete" clauses in their coaches contracts, then it is that a coach can't handle more than one student.
  2. oleada

    oleada Well-Known Member

    I don't think Evan and Denis are even at the same level, in any case.
  3. bek

    bek Guest

    But by Sochi they could be. I will say I had a feeling a North American coach was going to take him under his/her wing.
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 17, 2010
  4. pinky166

    pinky166 #teamtrainwreck #teamdiva

    Yes, Ten speaks very good English :)
  5. Zokko!

    Zokko! Comansnala?

    I don't think Mr. Carroll :blah: :blah: :yawn: is a good choice for lil' Denis ... he should stay where he belongs... as for Denis and Lysacek not being on the ... "same level" ..., that's true, Denis is already FAR ABOVE that certain Olympic disaster ... :D :p
  6. loulou

    loulou Let It Snow


    That's exactly what have been said about Nagasu and Kostner last year.
    That Nagasu simply wasn't in the same league as Kostner, and so there was no conflict to begin with.
    And look how it turned out.

    Here is what I said last year, which I still think: if two people are entering the same competitions, and they are both talented enough so that some specific goals are possible, then anything can happen and any coach who would want to teach both would have a conflict.
    And, generally speaking, I tend not to trust conflicts.

    I think Ten and Lysacek are conflict.

    Ziggy, really, at this level it's not just fun and sparetime anymore. It's a job, a career, a lifetime accomplishment. Coaches can teach many students at the same time for any other purpouse. But at this level, two kids (same gender) are conflict. And conflicts are tricky.
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2010
  7. Nune

    Nune Member

    mmh, honestly... I think Evan will retire quite soon. So there will be not conflict at all.
  8. pinky166

    pinky166 #teamtrainwreck #teamdiva

    :lol: I still love Evan even if his triple axel looks like a triple salchow :rolleyes:. Anyways I think Carrol is a good fit for Ten, who seems like a serious and hardworking skater. Maybe in 2014 Carrol will be the coach of TWO Olympic Gold Medalists (Mirai and Dennis - how cute :)). Plus I think it's good for Ten to get away from Russia - otherwise he'll end up a mini-Plush and I'd rather him become a more exciting skater than that.

    I was almost positive he'd go to Morozov though....I wonder now that Morozov will be in Russia who his new targets will be - baby Russian girls? Hope not. I would cry if he became the coach of Polina Agafonova or Anna Ovcharova and destroyed their adorable, spunky personalities and left them with boring programs full of flailing arms and busy Russian costumes :(
  9. hardcoreiceman

    hardcoreiceman New Member

    I think this would a good move for Denis Ten!
  10. Dr.Siouxs

    Dr.Siouxs Well-Known Member

    :eek: I love this pairing!!!! :cheer:
  11. Megi

    Megi Well-Known Member

    I do too and I find some people's denial of how good his skating actually is very amusing. :2faced:

    Hope the move to Frank works out well for Denis. :cheer:
  12. Fallcolor

    Fallcolor Member

    Frank and Denis would make a great pairing...so does this mean that Denis will start working with Lori Nichol for choreo and not Tarasova anymore?
  13. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

    Maybe it was the transitioning from Juniors to Seniors that led Ten to only have one or two jumps after the halfway point. I am sure Carroll will radically overhaul his jump layout!
  14. c971022

    c971022 New Member

    TAT continues to work with Denis as consultant and possibly choreographer.
  15. Jaana

    Jaana Well-Known Member

    That is very bad news. If Denis works with Frank C., he does not need any outside cnsultant which would bring only disaster, in my opinion. Huh, a possible choreographer, Denis dos not benefit from programmes, that need to be changed and changed again to become good CoP-programmes
  16. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    If someone is such a diva, they can't deal sharing the coach with another competitor near his level, they should either get a life or shoot themselves in the face. :saint:

    If anything, having someone to compete with every day in practice is beneficial because it takes you out of your comfort zone and keeps you on your toes.

    There are a lot of skaters and coaches for whom this is not an issue at all, so I don't see why it should be for Frank or Evan.
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2010
  17. loulou

    loulou Let It Snow


    And there are a lot of skaters for whom it's a big deal. I would name Takahashi, who's everything but a big diva.

    Because it's not about being diva or not being up to challenges.

    The point is that the coach should teach you, and then he/she should play your game so that you'll end up beating every body else, including the other student.
    You don't see the conflict? I do.

    Do conflicts always work out disaster? No. But they are tricky.
    I personally would avoid them (indeed I'm not the only one, if coaches have such clauses in their contracts).
    Surely, that's enough of a reason to have people ponder, and it cannot be dismissed as if it was some spoiled voice speaking.
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2010
  18. harvey

    harvey New Member

    All of this talk about conflicts in coaching just got me to wondering why if it's such a big deal, how can the top 2 (In most peoples' opinion) ice dance teams tolerate having the exact same coaching staff?:rolleyes:
    I know that there has been a lot of discussion about the coaches' preference for one team or the other, but it seems that in this case it's not only possible to have 2 approximately equal competitive students, but both V & M and D & W seem to have thrived on it (This year anyway).:cool:
  19. Mevrouw

    Mevrouw living every minute

    As to the V&M and D&W arrangement, both of those teams started with their coaches when they were just promising young teams. They have a long relationship with each other and the coaches that grew up before they placed 1 & 2 in the world in everything they enter. That's different than having another skater/competitor suddenly sign on with the same coach.
  20. bek

    bek Guest

    I'm sure that Frank wouldn't be taking out Denis if Evan was staying in and/or Evan wasn't okay with it.
  21. maclou

    maclou Member

    The big deal about that was that they were direct competitors from the the same country. That would be like if Frank started coaching Johnny without talking to Evan about it first.

    I'm sure Evan would be fine with Frank coaching Denis Ten, they're both at completely different points in their careers but I do think Evan probably is going to retire...
  22. Jaana

    Jaana Well-Known Member

    From the same or different country does not matter, in my opinion. What matters is, whether the skaters are direct competitors with each other and in this point Denis is far from it. As a matter of fact I think that Denis would really benefit from training with Evan (LOL, many skaters would!).
  23. Lacey

    Lacey Well-Known Member

    I don't know why I feel so sure, I have no inside information, but I am convinced that Evan will retire. But he's not going to tell us yet, I believe, because he thinks he needs time to milk the gold medal, which he really doesn't. Once you are an Olympic Gold Medalist, you are always an Olympic Gold Medalist. But I bet his agent is still sniffing out contracts.
  24. caseyedwards

    caseyedwards Well-Known Member

    Sarah Hughes didn't retire immediately. But she was considered a medal contender by some not a OGM frontrunner like Lysacek was considered a Gold medal frontrunner. Not the favorite but a favorite. Hamilton-retired-Boitano retired but probably would have come back if the iSU had the rules it had now. And he could retire for three seasons and come back like Cohen. There is nothing left for him to win or prove is my point.
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2010
  25. gratefulmkfan

    gratefulmkfan New Member

    Evan has his own private ice time. Mirai said she's lucky that Evan allows her to share it with him. He might share it with young Mr. Ten also, but he does not have to do that. I'm curious to learn how things unfold, but I'm happy Frank has taken him on.
  26. Dancin' Dream

    Dancin' Dream New Member

    OK, I'm not that enthusiastic about that prospect, Ten already has all the goods he needs to become a leading one, I want somebody who supports him just the way he already is - and I don't think Carroll is the right person. Sorry, but so for I haven't seen anyone really exciting, charismatic, someone with personality, coming out under Carroll's tutelage. It would be sad if such a tremendous talent like Ten simply makes a wrong choice. :(
  27. Squibble

    Squibble New Member

    Fifty-six posts, and the thread topic turns to Michelle Kwan.

    kwanfan1818 and (deleted member) like this.
  28. luenatic

    luenatic Well-Known Member

    Christopher Bowman anyone?
  29. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

    What Ten is mostly lacking is consistency and that's what Carroll can help him achieve, both through support and encouraging a better work ethic.
  30. skateboy

    skateboy Well-Known Member

    I love this news! Now if Oda can go to Frank as well, I'd be thrilled.