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Flatt trains with Tom Z over winter break

Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by fan, Dec 31, 2011.

  1. essence_of_soy

    essence_of_soy Well-Known Member

    What's the definition of a masochist?
    flutzilla1 and (deleted member) like this.
  2. AxelAnnie

    AxelAnnie Well-Known Member

    I thought she was smart
  3. DimaToe

    DimaToe El Chen-te Fernández

    Come on Rachael :scream: Does she want a matching set of broken tibias or something?
  4. MacMadame

    MacMadame Cat Lady-in-Training

    I said before that I thought if she really buckled down and used the Thanksgiving and Winter breaks to really work on her programs, she had a shot at making the podium at Nationals.

    Well visiting another part of the country and living in a hotel, training with someone who isn't actually your current coach, and doing some shows during that period is not buckling down and concentrating on getting ready for Nationals in my book. I am not sanguine about these plans.
  5. Domshabfan

    Domshabfan A proud P/C fan

    Rachel's jumps has been very shaky this season and end of last season due to injury. Tom Zzzzzzzz is very good jumping coach so it makes sense to get help from him, but that is not the only problem Rachel has, she need better ice coverage and better presentation, which is all but absent in her programs. I hope Rachel's visit Tom Zzzzzzzz is a success and hope we will see and better presentation at the US nationals.
  6. Marco

    Marco Well-Known Member

    Even if she lands her jumps, I suspect her PCS will suffer so much to the extent that she wouldn't be a threat to the podium.
  7. Susan M

    Susan M Well-Known Member

    She also needs to get a lot more serious about her overall fitness and condition. It is pretty obvious from the roundness of her arms that she is carrying too much body fat for this sport, which cannot be helping her jump consistency.
  8. olympic

    olympic Well-Known Member

    As many of you know from past posts, I'm no fan of Tom Z. But, somehow, I think this is the best immediate solution for Rachael: Tom Z and Rachael seem to get along and his coaching method, along with training at 6,000 ft. altitude, might return her jumps to passable form that gets her on the podium. She doesn't seem to be able to make Stanford and training at 3 rinks work for her.

    If she had more time, I'd say going back to Tom Z for a temporary fix would be a disaster. However, she doesn't have the time right now to invest in deep, long-term repairs to her skating skills and presentation.

    However, I do think she will be behind all of Czisny, Nagasu and Wagner come Nats
  9. IceAlisa

    IceAlisa discriminating and persnickety ballet aficionado

    I didn't realize she is doing shows. However, she could be in need of :bribe: to pay for her training so it could be a necessity.

    As to the training with Tom Z --the jump coach: the article mentions how Rachael wants to show off her artistic side rather than tech side. Is Tom Z the person for that? To me it sounds like her jumps are in not so good a shape.
  10. barbk

    barbk Well-Known Member

    I hope that her jumps don't just improve for Nationals, only to see them degrade again once she goes back to school, especially if she makes the Worlds team.
  11. MacMadame

    MacMadame Cat Lady-in-Training

    But she's not just training but also doing shows. Those are a distraction for her preparation for Nats and will cut into her training time.
  12. The Fly On The Wall

    The Fly On The Wall Active Member

    Well, her results have been less than spectacular under the new coaches, though we have no way of knowing if that's due to coaching or schedule adjustments, etc. And RF's PCS scores aren't going to matter if she can't get her jumps back. I'm sensing a little desperation??
  13. MacMadame

    MacMadame Cat Lady-in-Training

    I'm sensing she wanted to do the shows... :D
  14. UMBS Go Blue


    EYS. The article made it sound like college life - in addition to training and long Bay Area commutes - has been a tough adjustment. Going back to a comfortable, familiar environment, including a coach she's used to working with and who has gotten good results from her before, sounds like a good recipe for getting back into shape.
    Vash01 and (deleted member) like this.
  15. OnyxRose81

    OnyxRose81 Active Member

    Even if she improves for Nats, everything will just degrade after that. I seriously hope Alissa, Mirai and Ashley are prepared to kick butt. I don't want Flatt anywhere near a Worlds team.
  16. chipso1

    chipso1 Well-Known Member

    After 9th and 10th place finishes in her two GP events this fall, I can't imagine the judges giving her any favors when it comes to PCS. Although Nationals is still a few weeks away and many things can happen, I think Rachael is skating for a 4th place finish, at best. Even Mirai's worst this season (151.72) is better than Rachael's best (147.63). Then factor in skaters like Keiser and Wang who are triple-triple threats, and Rachael may find herself out of the top 6 all together.
  17. Nomad

    Nomad Celebrity cheese-monger

    I'm not sure that the US judges will write her off after one bad season. On the other hand, I agree that if she doesn't skate well, she probably won't get held up. At least not by much. Her SP got her decent scores but the LP really sank her. Zakrajsek might be able to help her with the URs, but will he fix those craptastic spins?
  18. SueSue

    SueSue Active Member

    Agreed. To compete at such a high level requires full time dedication which includes off-ice training and a highly regimented diet. That seems impossible with the time demands of attending a top university like Stanford.

    She's a nice girl and I wish her the best, but it seems like her competitive days are over and she should just enjoy being a very bright and promising college student.
  19. Jammers

    Jammers Well-Known Member

    I just beg any of the other skaters like Mirai or Alissa or Ashley to not meltdown and skate the way they can and keep Rachael away from the podium especially a top 2 finish. It's only a little over two years to Sochi and the US doesn't need a holdover like Racheal anywhere near a podium at Nationals.
    tlk and (deleted member) like this.
  20. Sylvia

    Sylvia Prepping for club comp. season!

    Go Rachael! :)

    ETA: In the general US Ladies thread in the Trash Can (where I also posted this espnW.com article last week), I noted that the shows she was scheduled to do were 3 consecutive days in Vail, Colorado right before Christmas (with Patrick Chan, among others) and, IMO, I don't think they would have impacted her training for Nationals too much. ;)
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2012
  21. Carolla5501

    Carolla5501 Well-Known Member

    Those of us who have lived and worked in California "cringed" when she laid out this multi rink, touring plan for her training. I think we may have been right. She and her family looked at a "map" and said "oh this won't be bad" But.... it's a nightmare. Sounds to me like she's spending as much time in the car as at training!
  22. Screenie

    Screenie Active Member

    Shows can help. She could use them as a mock competition and, for example, do her SP at them and see how she fares. It's an environment you can't really get in practice.
  23. smarts1

    smarts1 Well-Known Member

    Does anyone really know why she picked three rinks to train at?
  24. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

    Her principal coaches are Justin Dillon and Lynn Smith, but due to other commitments, they aren't available every day. As a result, she also trains with other coaches, including former U.S. Men's Champion Charles Tickner. The various coaches are at three rinks, in San Jose, Redwood City, and Oakland.


    Dillon and Smith are based in San Jose. Unless Flatt is driving in the height of rush hour traffic (which I doubt), that's about half an hour away from campus. Redwood City is about fifteen minutes away. Oakland is farther, but how often does she actually go there?
  25. FunnyBut

    FunnyBut Well-Known Member

    When there's a 45 foot billboard of the you as the hometown girl, I think that's quite a bit of pressure to give the audience a good performance. I wish her luck. I doubt she'll get sent to Worlds unless she's clearly at least 2nd best, she's no longer USFS's 'reliable Rachael'. I suspect that's why she specifically said she'd be working on artistry with Tom Z., so the emphasis might be more on a audience pleasing performance as opposed to one that will get her to Worlds, which is a longshot.
  26. Carolla5501

    Carolla5501 Well-Known Member


    Well... she's the one who keeps bringing up that Oakland route.... plus I do think she may have been driving at the "height" of rush hour. It appears she was leaving the dorm VERY early, skating for a few hours...so let's say she skated from 6 to 8... RUSH HOUR LOL!

    I drove around there a LOT for a year or so and your times are "nice" IMHO but not at all what I experienced.
  27. Vagabond

    Vagabond Well-Known Member

    I take it you've never read what her actual training schedule is and that you have never driven on 280 between Page Mill Rd. and downtown San Jose. :shuffle:
  28. Carolla5501

    Carolla5501 Well-Known Member

    1. Not really. I don't really care what time she trains. I just go by what she tells the reporters.. (leave before breakfast, 2 hour commutes)
    2. Yep been there sat in traffic.... SORRY! I drove 280 at all times of the day commuting between several hospitals and quite often it was just stopped.

    One of the reasons I turned down a job in San Jose..... and another job in Southern CA....

    Traffic (and I live in Atlanta, not exactly known for trouble free roads)
  29. RD

    RD Well-Known Member

    Flatt has already been to Olys and been on several World teams. Perhaps she is a) being realistic about her situation and does not expect to win or get on the World team in her present condition, b) setting outside expectations low while she prepares a serious comeback behind the scenes.

    I think she has peaked as a competitor. Even when she wasn't in school, her skills and consistency were on the decline. Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you see it as a skatefan) she does not have staying power, nor does she have the immense talent required these days to beat the highest-ranked skaters in the world.

    Her chances of making the world team also depend on how Nagasu, Wagner and Czisny do. If Flatt can do what she used to be able to do, it will be up to those three to best her for the World team spot. I'm getting the sense that several fans cannot wait for Flatt to fail/retire. While I never wish stuff like that as far as any skater is concerned, I do have an inner hope that the World team this year will consist of 2 other skaters. Rachel just needs to put out something that she can be proud of and not worry so much about the result, since there is always school. I feel the other contenders have much more at stake- Nagasu having the most (needing to prove herself), Czisny right behind (defending champ), then Wagner a somewhat distant third (made big changes over the summer, needs a payoff for the hard work).