Discussion in 'Great Skate Debate' started by Sylvia, Jul 23, 2013.
I've heard Amodio left Morozov because he wasn't able to clone Plushenko's medals too.
I wonder how well Florent may do if he's given programs without pelvic thrusts. The elimination of those alone would be a significant improvement.
Go watch his programs from his first senior season and you'll have your answer. He was wonderful (and a bit underrated) before Morozov took over.
His programs were better before Morozov, but he didn't have much power to his basic skating: he looked better on TV, whereas in the rink, he often looked underpowered and inconsistent in speed. He's credited Morozov with helping him this way. He's gotten stronger physically over the last few years, too, which has helped.
He would do well to have a career like Plushenko's, even his 2010 - 13 career of two Euro titles and an Olympic silver. Amodio's programs may not be everyone's cup of tea - I think he could do more, but I appreciate that he's one of the few guys who can really dance - but he still has very good basics and elements. This year's Euro SP showed that he can compete with Fernandez if he lands the jumps. Consistency is what he needs even more than choreography... if he landed his jumps more often, his PCS will go up anyway.
I didn't get the impression his unhappiness had anything to do with California, but rather with the last minute change of plans by Morosov, again.
Sounds to me like he got tired of living like a gypsy.
It's becoming rarer that a skater DOES stay with one coach.
Florent is not in Paris, he's in Vaujany, an alpine village near Grenoble, just beside l'Alpe d'Huez. There is a brand new rink (half underground with a very nice view on the valley and the mountains). That's where the next french championships will be.
I don't know where Marina is right now but she has been part of the french fed's plan for some time.
For a few seasons, the french fed has centered its policy and funding on Bercy.
Bercy is like a platform where the fed brings exterior help to doctor the skaters' weaknesses.
Last season for example, Maé has worked with Sandra Garde to help her posture, polish her programs, make her more feminine. (Sandra is normally in Nice, that means she must travel weekly to Paris to take care of Maé ; Garde is responsible in good part of Maé's improved results and she gets absolutly no credit ; as a reminder, Garde is this, that and as a choreographer, this and with work-in-progress Maé that)
There were several camps over the last years in Bercy with Urmanov for the jumps and with Lucinda Ruh for the spins.
Claude Péri has moved from Dammary to Bercy and she's the real additional value, performance-wise IMHO. She's the one who made Vanessa James get her triple jumps back.
Marina Anissina has also worked on the skaters' skating skills and overall polish regularly for a year.
Sylvain Privé who is in Montpellier (quite a distance from Paris) also travelled regularly to help James / Ciprès with their lifts (Claude Péri who has trained them last season when Racle went away, comes from singles, not pair ; she was Morgan's former coach).
So 1° being in Bercy means a shot at a deluxe treatment for a french skater, which is probably why, when he tempestuously left Dumont after 4 months with her (September-December), Joubert agreed to come to Bercy and found a steady place there. And why Florent agreed to work with Krier, temporarily.
But I'm gonna tell you something, the ambiance was so poisonous in Bercy 3 years ago that the skaters there were all leaving and that no exterior skaters would have settled there ; the arrival of Péri + the whole deluxe treatment has changed things and that will last for ... 6 months (that's how long mastermind Didier's plans last ) since the Bercy rink and the whole POPB will close their doors next February for a year and a half.
And 2° Marina going to Paris and Vaujany to help the french team, that was planned. It's the "I wanna go to the Olympics" that wasn't. Maybe being part of this olympic preparation thing gave her the idea.
YES! YES! YES!
Thank you for all the information - that was very interesting! It's unfortunate, though I guess not surprising, that there are a fair number of coaches and consultants involved who are not being properly credited for their work. I hope that they are at least properly compensated?
Haha definitely. Even without much going on in his programs, he still couldn't get his consistency down. He was really musical. So was Leonova. They were both dialled down to Ando level of boring and tone-deaf after moving to Morosov. That's why it's such a waste that he stayed for so long with him.
And come on, a coach that knowingly allows his student to use vocal music and take a deduction during competition?!
At 2012 Europeans Amodio was one of the fastest if not the fastest skaters in the Men's competition, so I think MOrosov definitely helped with that. I'd like any new coach of Amodio to get rid of that annoying scrape he does with the free leg before his triple axels attempts.
I thought the issue was that he didn't receive the vocal music deduction that he blatantly should have received.
That's true, but when they planned that stunt they didn't know that there would be no deduction. It could have been very costly for him.
When it was announced that Takahashi was returning the Morozov, I thought that might leave Amodio in the position Fernandez when those two were training mates: talented skater but not his coach's number one, doing programs that were beneath his talent (remember the awful SP he had in 2011?). I am glad that like Javi, Florent finally realized he was no longer benefiting from his work with Morozov, and I hope that he too will find a more productive coaching situation.
Or maybe they did and Morosov had politiked his way to not get a deduction from the judges
Thank you for all the insights into what's going on in France, Nmsis.
Hell to the YEAH. Free Leonova next!!!
Why is Bercy closing for a year and half? Are they undergoing renovations? Where will the skaters who are based there train?
The old POPB (Palais Omnisport de Paris Bercy) is about to become Bercy Arena.
Some photos of the project
Bigger, with new luxury boxes, conference and private rooms, a new shopping space, new bars, a second entrance on the river Seine side with a walkway toward the enbankment.
And where will the skaters go ?
That's the 100 000 $ question. No idea. I'm not sure the skaters know either.
Gailhaguet wil never want to let them go away to other coaches so he'll probably think of a solution.
I can tell you what his dream is.
It is what the french ice hockey federation (who parted from the FFSG some years ago) is doing right now in Cergy. (which means the closing of Amodio's rink by 2015)
A national training center with the federation's offices and the rink + all training facilities in the same building. (mental picture of Gailhaguet keeping a close watch on the rink from his desk, calling the coaches to make corrections on the jumps ).
That's not in the making right now. But if he can show results from what is happening in Bercy, he could sell the idea to a city around Paris who is renovating or building a new facility.
So there is an immediate interest in Bercy right now and a potential long term interest ... and a hole in-between.
What is Morozov only good for one season? Or was he just off in 2013? Because like Amodio and Leonova both had tremendous 2012's! Tremendous!! So did I/K and Takahashi. But they are all still with him as is Leonova. Keeping the faith?
They can all go with Joubert to the newly renovated Poitiers rink?
The renovation proposal does look nice. The project doesn't start until after the Olympics, right?
Calling it tremendous twice won't make it true. Amodio's 2011-2012 was not an improvement over the previous season: he had an awful GP, failed to defend his Euro title and, and while he did well at Worlds, it wasn't vastly better than 2011 (and he wasn't the top French guy, either). For that matter, his 2011 season was a breakthrough because of the GP medals and Euros title, but I don't think it was "tremendous" either. Interestingly he did not win French Nats in either of those seasons (actually, Amodio has never beaten Joubert at Nats). Dai had a wonderful showing in 2011-12, but he was not coached by Morozov at the time so that's irrelevant. In 2011-12, their first season with Morozov, I/K moved up one spot at Euros (to the bronze position vacated by the Kerrs, who had retired) and two at Worlds. Again, not a vast improvement and not a tremendous season. I suspect they'd had a similar trajectory had they stayed with Zhulin.
Leonova in 2011-2012 I'll grant you, it wasn't that consistent (7th in Euros) but she did have some great results. I'm not sure how much time she spends working with Morozov though. You can also make an argument that Javier Fernandez improved a fair bit under Morozov - but he also improved greatly under Orser after stagnating with Morozov.
Very true . Stagnation was a big problem. Stagnation and poor programs.
Financially, yes, I think so. And the fed has asked Garde to choreograph the future tour of the french team this spring.
Checking on her facebook, she has been spending a week per month in Bercy to work with all the skaters, along with Line Haddad and Catherine Glaise.
I think the girls would rather go with Claude Péri if she goes back to Dammary . Her contract with the fed is only 2 years long. But would Krier go along / move there ? That's another story.
The boys would be inspired to consider Poitiers. Especially Champigny's. The fed pushes all the promissing boys there but they still don't know how to spin after 2 years. And they start stagnating after a year or 2. That's appalling .
In March. It's okay for Sochi.
The preparation for Worlds will be more chaotic.
Amodio in Courchevel with Yagudin.
Did Florent part ways with Morozov or not?
Don't understand why Amodio is so obsessed with the idea working with Yagudin. I didn't see any improvement on his jumps after they worked together a couple of times.
Maybe Yagudin gives Florent his undivided attention while Morozov is too busy with his Russian skaters? It seems to be the most common complaint about Morozov (that he spreads himself too thin) and I know the Russian Federation wants his attention to be on his Russian skaters as the Sochi Olympics are coming up.
Alexei answered about Amodio in this interview.
Alexei will help Amodio to improve skating technique , but does not have any plans to work as a coach with anyone as he told in the past.
It was the same he always said in many interviews and I think Itar-Tass is one of reliable masmedias in Russia.
I can't believe French Federation really helped Amodio out with that. Yagudin always stated he's not interested in coaching right now in his interviews, not even consultant work, but if someone asks him, I don't think he will just turn them down. I only hope it won't turn out to be another ugly thing and Amodio will really get the kind of help as he expected.
Hi, lala, how are you doing? Thanks for the link. You are really watching out Yagudin closely huh?